Can't sacrifice a creature or trigger an ability before a card goes to the graveyard or is exiled.

[[SCB]TripWire]

I occasionally want to do things like sacrifice creatures before they go to a graveyard in 2012, am I missing something or is this not possible? You don't even get to pause the timer before they go to the graveyard so that you can sacrifice them (since they'd die from battle damage anyway, for example). This is rather annoying given that the computer does it, but I don't seem to be allowed to even though I know you can in the real card game.

[GB EX]

Can you give specific examples?

I know in the case of some cards' abilities, once a choice is made, it's too late to respond.
You also can't sacrifice a creature (or use any other abilities) once the Damage Step begins.

[[SCB]TripWire]

That's the thing though, I should be able to sacrifice a creature or play a dieing/destroyed/whatever card's ability before it goes to the graveyard, but this isn't possible. Nor is it possible once blockers are assigned but before damage is dealt (because I know the result before it happens), if not once damage is dealt.

I've lost matches because of this seemingly poorly implemented mechanic.

[GB EX]

Still, a specific example would help greatly.

Right now, the one thing I can think of off the bat is using Vampire Aristocrat's sacrifice ability after you've assigned him as a blocker against a 3/3, then sacrificing another of your blockers to boost him to a 4/4, while simultaneously stopping the damage from the sacrificed blocker (all after the Blocking Step, but before the Damage Step).

[[SCB]TripWire]

What I'm referring to specifically is when wanting to trigger the ability of a creature or anything else for that matter which might require the sacrifice of itself for instance specifically before it would go to the graveyard for any unrelated reason.

I haven't played M:TG the card game in over 10 years so I'm a little vague on concrete examples, but say you have a creature that has the ability to give you life points if you sacrifice it as a cost to trigger the ability. In 2012 it seems impossible to trigger this ability if the creature is about to go to the graveyard for a completely different reason (eg. you declare it as a blocker but sacrifice it before it goes to the graveyard, alternatively you sacrifice it because it would otherwise die after the defending player chooses a blocker to block your creature's attack, given your creature doesn't need to get tapped to attack).

[GB EX]

"a creature that has the ability to give you life points if you sacrifice it as a cost to trigger the ability"
Let's use Brindle Boar as an example. This creature has "Sacrifice Brindle Boar: Gain 4 life." It is a 2/2 creature.
*Note: Brindle Boar is NOT in Duels 2012.

"it seems impossible to trigger this ability if the creature is about to go to the graveyard for a completely different reason"
Example 1:
- BLOCK STEP: Brindle Boar is declared as a blocker to block a 3/3 creature.
- The Block Step timer runs out.
- DAMAGE STEP: Brindle Boar and the 3/3 creature exchange damage. No effects can be activated during this step. Neither player has priority.
- Brindle Boar dies and can't be sacrificed on its way to the graveyard because it happens immediately as a state-based action.

Example 2:
- BLOCK STEP: Brindle Boar is declared as a blocker to block a 3/3 creature.
- During the Block Step, Brindle Boar's ability is activated. You sacrifice Brindle Boar. You gain 4 life.
- DAMAGE STEP: Brindle Boar is no longer on the battlefield. The 3/3 creature deals damage to nothing.

Example 3:
- BLOCK STEP: Brindle Boar is declared as a blocker to block as 3/3 creature with TRAMPLE.
- During the Block Step, Brindle Boar's ability is activated. You sacrifice Brindle Boar. You gain 4 life.
- DAMAGE STEP: Brindle Boar is no longer on the battlefield. The 3/3 creature deals damage to you because it has trample.

==================================================================
"you declare it as a blocker but sacrifice it before it goes to the graveyard"
This is Example 2.

"you sacrifice it because it would otherwise die after the defending player chooses a blocker to block your creature's attack, given your creature doesn't need to get tapped to attack"
This sounds like:
- ATTACK STEP: Brindle Boar is declared as an attacker.
- During the Attack Step, Brindle Boar is sacrificed. You gain 4 life. You do this because your opponent has a 3/3 creature.
- BLOCK STEP: Brindle Boar is not on the battlefield. Brindle Boar doesn't deal any damage; it is dead.

[Psycho]

Początkowo opublikowane przez SCBTripWire:

What I'm referring to specifically is when wanting to trigger the ability of a creature or anything else for that matter which might require the sacrifice of itself for instance specifically before it would go to the graveyard for any unrelated reason.

I haven't played M:TG the card game in over 10 years so I'm a little vague on concrete examples, but say you have a creature that has the ability to give you life points if you sacrifice it as a cost to trigger the ability. In 2012 it seems impossible to trigger this ability if the creature is about to go to the graveyard for a completely different reason (eg. you declare it as a blocker but sacrifice it before it goes to the graveyard, alternatively you sacrifice it because it would otherwise die after the defending player chooses a blocker to block your creature's attack, given your creature doesn't need to get tapped to attack).

As GB-EX said, this is pretty hard without a specfic example. Afaik with my shady rules lore (I dropped out of tabletop play at Exodus, sacrifice is a cost of the abilty, but you can only use it during a legal phase for fast effects, it's not like the old, old rule where sacrifice was basically interrupt-speed.

So yes, you should be able to use this in either attacking or blocking steps, as long as it hasn't been dealt lethal damage yet. Once it's taken lethal damage, it's already on it's way to the graveyard, and it's ability cannot be used.

[[SCB]TripWire]

I stopped playing M:TG about 13 years ago so yeah.. I guess I was unaware that Sacrifice was no longer an interrupt. :| That's lame.

[problem dog]

You need to sac it before it takes damage or is killed in another way.

You make it sound like you expect a creature to deal and recieve lethal combat damage, but instead of being put in the graveyard lets you still use abilities, which is not, nor has ever been possible.

[[SCB]TripWire]

It was possible in every game I ever played, including publicly-available tournaments that required entrance fees.

[Puzzlemint]

Every game you've ever played was before the Magic 2010 rules update.

[[SCB]TripWire]

I know, and when I played, sacrificing was an interrupt.

[Baernd]

It still is but combat damage no longer uses the stack.

[NikeAdam9]

I have a perfect example of this:

Dawntreader Elk is a 2/2 with an ability that the controller can pay one Forest to sacrifice it and bring another Forest into play - but when I kill the computer's Dawntreader Elk, the computer sacrifices it AFTER the damage step and gets another land - even though it was already on its way to the graveyard!

[NikeAdam9]

Actually I might've used an ability to kill it and so he used the sacrifice trigger before my ability did another -1/-1 to it. I bet that's what happened.