I am fat and out of shape, advice for game?

[KarusDaedlyn]

I started off this thread being self-deprecating, so I'd appreciate it if replies stay somewhat positive.

I have a hormone disorder that makes losing weight pretty rough, but I want to combine my geek nature of beating games with something I have to do physically so I'm driven to do it frequently.

Combine that with current lockdowns going on and I am hoping that even if I can't get to be super fit, I'm wanting to shoot for moderate health.

Thing is, the game is really hard for me. Even the first opponent (other than sparring partner). I've never really played boxing games besides NES punchout, and obviously this isn't the same.

I think I am using my arms too much (I've seen this referenced, to use body for punches) because by the third round I'm even having trouble keeping hands up for defense.

I see opponent protecting face a lot but if I go for body shots it just opens me up to combos to the face. If I get overly defensive to my face, I get hit with what I assume to be hooks to the side, but I can't seem to do the same thing back, yet.

I'm not complaining about the game, it's great, I want to use it to improve fitness, but I figure I need to try some actual strategy so I can improve and not just trying to punch harder.

[Netheri]

I have no other advice but repeat, repeat repeat. Nerves learn as does the brain. Edit: But don't over do it, remember to rest between the longer game sessions and drink water!

[KarusDaedlyn]

Thanks for the encouragement. Out of curiosity, in terms of boxing strategy, is it better to hold defensively, and wait for openings, or aggressively try to make an opening?

I feel if I wait too much defensively, I take too many shots from the sides I can't block. But if I try to open up the body I leave my face open.

Either way, it's a fantastic workout.

[Jargous]

Seeing how you're completely new to the game, you should definitely get a feel for how it is when you are fighting your opponent. It seems like you've jumped in and had a few rounds, it was fun, but you're all tuckered out. Much like how I started when I played this game.

Now I'm not sure where you are at for difficulty choice, and see that your difficulties are common to that of someone being quite new to the game let alone the sport. I'm interested to know your answers to the following questions...

1) Are you always looking for a knockout? Or are you trying to gauge your opponent for a well-timed punch?
2) I notice your reply about a fear of body shots, this is common as committing to a body punch completely exposes you. Do you prefer to keep your shots to the head, or are you more open towards creating an opening that would allow for an easy punch to the head?
3) Are you more interested in the cardio aspect of getting fit through this game, or more about proper technique?

Some quick points if you wish to understand how your body performs (we all like to believe we have unlimited stamina/power , but reality is that fatigue eventually becomes a factor and bad techniques causes injury). Try the speed bag, reflex ball and dummy.

The speed bag should help you understand your pacing, whether it is punching with 1 hand or both. Try to keep the speed bag going back and forth (feel free to look up videos) and don't get discouraged if you can't really keep up a proper pace. What's important is to know what you can keep up with.

The reflex ball is more to do with your body movement. To work with this one depends on how much you put into your punch. A jab would generally be 1 dodge attempt worth, and majority of the other types of punches (with the exception of uppercuts) is around 3 dodge attempts. Getting 1 or 2 dodges is good enough, but it's good to keep in mind how your should react depending on where you could be 'hit' from.

The dummy. This would best explain your current dilemma. My opponent is blocking the face, how do I get them to drop their guard or punch around it? The dummy, is where you practice your punch. There are weak spots that are marked on the dummy. This is where you will be practicing your punches to make sure you can hit those targets. Start light, then start adding some power to see if you can maintain such accuracy (do not throw everything you have into landing that punch).

At the end of all that, you might be wondering how this will improve your game. It doesn't, it gives you a starting point of where you are at, and this is where you start to either..

1) Look up some boxing videos to improve
2) Develop your own

All up to you. What I will emphasize greatly is that you work on mastering the technique of throwing punches as this will greatly improve your fitness before you start considering next steps (such as running outside, or focusing heavily on your diet). This game can definitely make you feel fit, but you may need external motivational factors combined with this game to get you into the level of fitness you want to achieve.

[KarusDaedlyn]

Thank you so much for all of that advice. I will admit, where I am at now, 1 match (3 full rounds) is pretty much my limit for a session. I know that's pretty pathetic, but, I'm pretty much starting at square one.

Diet is definitely a factor. Using an MyFitnessPal to track calories, and make sure I at least get what nutrients I need to stay safe with medical stuff.

Cardio is just walking for right now, but better than what it was before.

The game is just part of the fitness plan, but I'm more motivated when i can at least perform competitively. The training dummy/speed bag ideas sound great. I haven't really tried to determine my current pace, and I prolly should see how the hit detection works on a dummy for hooks and such, because I never seem to land those.

Really looking forward to just improving over time. I probably am not going to be a true athlete anytime soon, but I'd be happy to get to half as good as I was before medical problems.

Thanks again for the advice.

[Phantom Professional]

I would say just keep doing the fights you can do. once you can beat them easily, move to the next guy. the more you practice, the better youre going to get.

[KarusDaedlyn]

The practice dummy has helped a lot, just in one day. I realized the importance of my position, and roughly how far away I can be for certain punches, and how close I need to be for others.

Still working on accuracy. Some of the weak points are still hard for me to hit, especially sides of the head with a hook, but going to develop that as I go. Realized the importance of closing distance if I am going for body blows, too.

Lowered difficulty to easy for now. It makes more sense with my abilities right now, but I'll raise it as I improve. Finally won against the first real opponent too by decision. Hoping as i improve i can actually go for knockdowns.

Probably will watch some videos, just to get some form down, too. I realize I'm definitely just kinda throwing wild body blows, and need a better method.

Overall though, I'm loving it.

[Ian (Sealost)]

Origineel geplaatst door KarusDaedlyn:

Finally won against the first real opponent too by decision. Hoping as i improve i can actually go for knockdowns.

Probably will watch some videos, just to get some form down, too. I realize I'm definitely just kinda throwing wild body blows, and need a better method.

That's awesome! Congrats! You've definitely got the right mindset here. Start slow, examine what you're doing, and work on improving yourself. The true progression in TotF is in real life, not in game.

At first, you should definitely focus on your form, limiting the amount of hits you're taking, and going to the scorecards before you start chasing knockdowns. I don't know how much room you have to play in, but assuming you've set your boundaries up safely, remember to really move around to utilize the space defensively and put distance between you and the opponent if needed.


Everyone's advice has been fantastic. The community is a great resource here. I do want to jump in with some tips on punching form. You'll probably want to check out a few YouTube videos on the basics of boxing punches first, but I think I have a decent way to practice punching with your "body" instead of your "arms".

You'll want to start out at the boxing dummy or the heavy bag. Get in your boxing stance and raise your guard. Then, raise your arm and hand out to the side in the position they would be in if you were throwing a hook and tense your arm muscles to brace your arm in place as if it were about to receive an impact. Now, throw your punch while keeping your arm locked like that relative to your body. Your power needs to come from your feet (rear foot for a rear hook and lead foot for the lead hook) and cause your hips and full torso to rotate as well. Basically, think of your punch power being solely from the rotation of your body, and you're using your tensed arm to deliver that force. Practice a bit like that to nail down the body rotation portions, trying to match what you see in YouTube tutorial videos.

After you get comfortable with that, the next step will be to utilize your arms properly. Putting your arm out and locking it before you rotate your body is slow, telegraphed, and leaves a big opening that the opponent can swing into. Ultimately, what you'll want to do is take your hand straight from your guard position to the position it needs to be in when you land your punch, timed to and tensed at the moment of impact.

You can do the same thing for straight punches, but instead of locking them relative to your body, just keep your fist moving in a straight line out from your body as you turn your body, but with your muscles tensed to stop your fist from moving backward if it were to hit something moreso than using your muscles to fling your fist forward. Again, you'll eventually want to get the point where your hand goes straight from your guard position to being tensed at the point of impact and then right back to your guard position. Do the same thing with uppercuts as well - push off with your foot and rotate your body to send your locked arm straight up vertically.

Note that you don't actually have to punch this way in TotF. In fact, "arm" punches tend to be more powerful than "body" punches in TotF since the game only knows about your controller speed and not how much mass you're putting behind your punch. But the game will adjust to however you're throwing, and so you might as well be throwing with proper real-world effectiveness while you're playing.


Hooks and uppercuts are short ranged punches, but they're what you're going to need in order to hit the opponent's weak points to go for knockdowns. With a little practice and some advice from YouTube videos, you'll eventually be able to throw a jab to distract the opponent while you step in and then combo into these more powerful punches.


Keep it up! I'd love to hear about your progress as you go.

[Lazarus {FATE}]

Origineel geplaatst door KarusDaedlyn:

Thank you so much for all of that advice. I will admit, where I am at now, 1 match (3 full rounds) is pretty much my limit for a session. I know that's pretty pathetic, but, I'm pretty much starting at square one.

Diet is definitely a factor. Using an MyFitnessPal to track calories, and make sure I at least get what nutrients I need to stay safe with medical stuff.

Cardio is just walking for right now, but better than what it was before.

The game is just part of the fitness plan, but I'm more motivated when i can at least perform competitively. The training dummy/speed bag ideas sound great. I haven't really tried to determine my current pace, and I prolly should see how the hit detection works on a dummy for hooks and such, because I never seem to land those.

Really looking forward to just improving over time. I probably am not going to be a true athlete anytime soon, but I'd be happy to get to half as good as I was before medical problems.

Thanks again for the advice.

A little info... I'm past a half century, bad back,bursitis, and tendonitis. I have high blood pressure and slight asthma.
I weighed 262 lbs a little over 2 years ago, I used this game, box vr and beat saber, weight training, and proper dietary nutrition to drop to 197 lbs in about4 months. Although it was drastic it wasn't necessary to do so in a short time, nor is it all that healthy.

I'm now at a comfortable 202 to 205 with little to no effort to stay at this weight. Most of my medical conditions are gone and I still workout but less often.


One 3 round match on normal had me spent when I started.... 3 months later I would fight the whole roster in one go.

YouTube beginner boxing and shadowboxing vids is something you want to watch.

Practice on the equipment. Try and keep loose and consistantly moving your head while punching to keep the counter punches from connecting.

Don't stay in one spot too long and don't get into a slug fest that will drain your stamina and you might not win the encounter.

Don't over exert when punching, you will handicap yourself with the auto adjust on.

Over punching and not enough movement will tire you out much more quickly than dodging and weaving and punching at openings. You also burn more calories with movement.

Most of us start by slug festing until experience kicks in.

Don't be discouraged, improvement comes with play time.

Good luck on your journey!!

[wolfmage75]

Hey man, you're on the right track by trying this. I'm using VR as my main fitness workout/motivator these days, and I'm having a blast (and I am in better shape than I have been in a good long while!)

I will say though, Thrill of the Fight is usually the "hard thing"; the high-intensity part of the workout. I've gone from struggling against Ugly Joe in Normal to finding Endurance a bit too easy - and I've beaten it in Outclassed, though Duke still takes me out more often than not :p Progressing in ToTF makes for a good overall goal, but I'd mix in some more relaxing games just to get you up and keep you moving.

My "daily bread/warm up" is usually a short workout in BoxVR. It's the right kind of training for TotF without as much pressure, and the music makes it more pleasant though less intense. I'll throw in (or substitute sometimes) some Beat Saber, Synth Riders, or Pistol Whip. My other mainstay though it's more time consuming is "Until you Fall". It can be infuriating sometimes because it's a Roguelike, but it's lovely and it feels great to hack and slash at weird enemies.

Take it one day/fight at a time, and best of luck with your journey!

[Just_Ryan]

In terms of using this game as a workout you can try check out one of my videos on YT, it shows and explains how I progress throughout the months. I hope this helps. Its quite short and compact so it wont take long to watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKVujtUhNqY&t=604s

For notes on knocking the players out I'd say hooks are your best shot. First use left jabs on the face or body of the opponent to change their guard to a front guard or a body guard. This leaves their side wide open. Once their guard changes go for a right hook followed by a left hook or vice versa. This is how i always deal with the first 3 opponents.

Check out this video to see how i do it myself, i got 11 tko's in a row meaning i did 33 knockdowns in one session. Good luck on ur journey :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqEe_toI7hI&t=1170s

[VirsaTyle]

You're doing great man! Just remember improvement doesn't come immediately. Keep track of your progress day by day and you'll look back thinking about how you've improved a lot.

Every fight can be a learning experience. Especially when you lose. The trick is to look at what happened and find the areas where you can improve and reforge those faults. Practice a lot on the dummy and bags. Work incrementally and you will surely see great progress.

Everybody has already listed fantastic tips and videos off so I'll just wish you the best of luck good sir. Everyone's gotta start somewhere and we're sure you can succeed!

[KarusDaedlyn]

Thanks a ton, everyone. It really means a lot.

Since some of you shared, the thing that bugs me the most is that I used to be pretty fit, I was a Navy vet. Unfortunately developed a mild case of 'Cushing's Syndrome' at my 4 year mark, and my hormone levels spiked off the charts, and I was gaining nearly 25 lbs a month. I got out honorably but with a pretty bad disability rating. Sure depression didn't help the weight either.

I realize I might not ever get to that level again, but with my case a modest build is within reach if I try.

The practice dummy has helped a lot, I needed to realize how the hit detection works, and what the reach of my arm is compared to what I see. Also learning a bit about how to control the strength of my punches, so that I'm not throwing everything I have at every available shot.

Also, slowly trying to work on things like dodges and feet movement. I'm not getting into that as much yet, until I have a bit more core endurance and some balance.

And taking breaks. This is my hard workout, three times a week. I try lower impact games like Gorn or shooting VR stuff for longer, less intense periods of time, combined with a short walk on my off days.

[Brian C Stradale]

Let me give some encouragement from the opposite perspective... real life training...

I've been doing MMA (Krav Maga, Muay Thai, Taekwondo, Jui Jitsu) for many years... when new people come into my real-world gym, even ones that think they are in great shape (and are relative to most in the world), discover that boxing/MMA is a new level of work-out. Just to give you a few examples, often as a warm-up, we will pair up and just throw medium speed punches in unison, tapping each others' fists with each punch. The intent is to use the cooperation with the other partner as encouragement to maintain pace and keep your hands up. Those athletic types that do that for the first time... their hands are falling after maybe a dozen punches... they are completely unable to continue after 30 or so. Us experienced people can go for a long time. After a few months, they're doing great in that warm-up... until the coach adds 1 or 2 lb weights in each hand... doesn't take much, and those newbies are back to struggling.

I can give lots of other examples where those athletic types new to boxing/MT/MMA are just dying in what is to us (and soon will be to them) simple warm-up drills. One of those is vigorous shadow boxing. ToTF is essentially shadow boxing with a visible shadow that moves and reacts on its own to where you truly have to react... making it substantially harder. So, don't feel bad if you're finding it exhausting... it is truly another level of workout than most people ever do.

Finally, some advice: make sure you're breathing. When trying to not get hit and trying to hit, people tend not to breathe... nothing will wear you out faster. The beauty of ToTF is that they can't actually hurt you... so, focus on relaxing, but moving continuously, flow... but always maintaining your breathing. Don't start throwing punches faster than you can breathe... find that "idle" speed that you can just keep going for longer stretches, even if its a little too slow right now to be effective in the game. You want to develop good habits that let you keep moving... that will get you in shape much quicker.

[Distantecho64]

Origineel geplaatst door KarusDaedlyn:

I started off this thread being self-deprecating, so I'd appreciate it if replies stay somewhat positive.

I have a hormone disorder that makes losing weight pretty rough, but I want to combine my geek nature of beating games with something I have to do physically so I'm driven to do it frequently.

Combine that with current lockdowns going on and I am hoping that even if I can't get to be super fit, I'm wanting to shoot for moderate health.

Thing is, the game is really hard for me. Even the first opponent (other than sparring partner). I've never really played boxing games besides NES punchout, and obviously this isn't the same.

I think I am using my arms too much (I've seen this referenced, to use body for punches) because by the third round I'm even having trouble keeping hands up for defense.

I see opponent protecting face a lot but if I go for body shots it just opens me up to combos to the face. If I get overly defensive to my face, I get hit with what I assume to be hooks to the side, but I can't seem to do the same thing back, yet.

I'm not complaining about the game, it's great, I want to use it to improve fitness, but I figure I need to try some actual strategy so I can improve and not just trying to punch harder.

Yes you do use body for punches but regardless your arms are gonna get tired, especially if you're new to boxing they will get tired, relax, don't tense up

in regards to real world boxing tactics.

For body punches change level. Weave under the guys punches then counter with body shots then get out

[giant89]

If It helps at all I'm in good shape and this game kicks my ass. I threw 400 punches in a fight the other day and barely won, the key to it is picking your spots and learning to dodge rather than block I think. It's an amazing workout though just don't hurt yourself swinging too hard like I likely did.