FPS Drops in large Parks / Bankrupt Guests

[MasterJB]

Thread title says it all. FPS will drop significantly in large Parks because of bad programming and bankrupt guests refuse to use ATMs no matter how many and close they are.

Both aspects are huge late game fun killers, persistent since years and in case of the FPS drops directly size limiting the parks i can build. My hope that these two major issues will get fixed diminishes with every patch released not addressing these matters.
Are there informations that these issues will get fixed EVER?

Greetings

[Wylie28]

Lol. So you think GPUs can magically render more assets with no performance drop? The only thing bad here is your education.

[HeatherG]

its slow because everything u put in your parks adds up. The more in the park the more RAM you use. Thats why the recommended Ram is 12. Rides, scenery, guests, even turning on the rides eats up memory.

[Ancient]

Originally posted by heatherg23:

its slow because everything u put in your parks adds up. The more in the park the more RAM you use. Thats why the recommended Ram is 12. Rides, scenery, guests, even turning on the rides eats up memory.

Has very little to do with RAM. Each scenery item and each guest costs more draw calls. DX11 has a fairly limited number of draw calls because it can only use a single CPU thread to initiate them. Once that limit is hit you'll see your GPU usage drop dramatically along with FPS.

I have a 32GB system and still get this kind of performance on my GTX 1080 in massive parks with a lot of guests (note that only 11-12GB of system RAM is even being used system-wide): https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1528803888
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1432025963

[Wylie28]

Originally posted by Ancient:

Originally posted by heatherg23:

its slow because everything u put in your parks adds up. The more in the park the more RAM you use. Thats why the recommended Ram is 12. Rides, scenery, guests, even turning on the rides eats up memory.

Has very little to do with RAM. Each scenery item and each guest costs more draw calls. DX11 has a fairly limited number of draw calls because it can only use a single CPU thread to initiate them. Once that limit is hit you'll see your GPU usage drop dramatically along with FPS.

I have a 32GB system and still get this kind of performance on my GTX 1080 in massive parks with a lot of guests (note that only 11-12GB of system RAM is even being used system-wide): https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1528803888
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1432025963

CPU usage is still in the 90s on larger parks. DX12 wont add anymore than 10% of fps for anyone thst doesnt have a heavily OCed CPU. And 10% of 20 is 2. The single thread draw call limit does far less to performance than you think.

[Lyim]

This is what I use while playing planet coaster, I get constant 60FPS and the only frame drops occur during the first few secounds of loading. I can vouch for this GC: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B01MEFABEL/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[MasterJB]

Originally posted by Wylie28:

Lol. So you think GPUs can magically render more assets with no performance drop? The only thing bad here is your education.

Ahh thanks Mr toxic person, so that's why all other games, some very graphic heavy, run with 60+ FPS. Maybe put it this way: the only bad thing here was your parents upbringing of you. It's not too late, learn some manners and respect.

[Wylie28]

Originally posted by MasterJB:

Originally posted by Wylie28:

Lol. So you think GPUs can magically render more assets with no performance drop? The only thing bad here is your education.

Ahh thanks Mr toxic person, so that's why all other games, some very graphic heavy, run with 60+ FPS. Maybe put it this way: the only bad thing here was your parents upbringing of you. It's not too late, learn some manners and respect.

None of them are graphically heavier. In fact most of them done have the SSS or GI planrt coaster has. 2ndly. Graphics never come into the equation. Its the mumber of assets in the scene. In a typical game, this is a set amount deaigned for 60 fps on a modern GPU. In planet coaster, you place them and have no limit. Not to mentioned the 3000+ AI walking through your park.

Learn how software and hardware works and dont pretend you do. People that speak out of their ass dont deserve respect.

[MasterJB]

Ahh tanks, i guess that's why for example Cities: Skylinies with similar demands like you described (Citizens have AI, quasi-unlimited assets) runs way smoother with way softer diminishing performance? Thanks for your clarification, what would the world be without you.

[Wylie28]

Originally posted by MasterJB:

Ahh tanks, i guess that's why for example Cities: Skylinies with similar demands like you described (Citizens have AI, quasi-unlimited assets) runs way smoother with way softer diminishing performance? Thanks for your clarification, what would the world be without you.

The AI in cities skylines are not simulated. They are faked like in JWE. They do not react to anything and they have very simple node based pathfidning as well. Not to mention, cities skylines has very few assets in scene even in a full city. Buildings in the game are not made of hundereds of individual meshes like in planet coaster, but instead 1.

But go ahead and keep speaking out your ass. You must enjoy looking like one.

[Chad]

Originally posted by Wylie28:

Lol. So you think GPUs can magically render more assets with no performance drop? The only thing bad here is your education.

Why do you attack him? he points out valid issues.

If anyones education are lacking its the people that designed this game to not be playable if you want to build a realistic theme park

[Chad]

Originally posted by Wylie28:

Originally posted by MasterJB:

Ahh tanks, i guess that's why for example Cities: Skylinies with similar demands like you described (Citizens have AI, quasi-unlimited assets) runs way smoother with way softer diminishing performance? Thanks for your clarification, what would the world be without you.

The AI in cities skylines are not simulated. They are faked like in JWE. They do not react to anything and they have very simple node based pathfidning as well. Not to mention, cities skylines has very few assets in scene even in a full city. Buildings in the game are not made of hundereds of individual meshes like in planet coaster, but instead 1.

But go ahead and keep speaking out your ass. You must enjoy looking like one.

I would trade in this fps-killing guest behaviour for random roaming guests and have an actual playable game in a heartbeat.

[Ancient]

Originally posted by Wylie28:

Originally posted by Ancient:

Has very little to do with RAM. Each scenery item and each guest costs more draw calls. DX11 has a fairly limited number of draw calls because it can only use a single CPU thread to initiate them. Once that limit is hit you'll see your GPU usage drop dramatically along with FPS.

I have a 32GB system and still get this kind of performance on my GTX 1080 in massive parks with a lot of guests (note that only 11-12GB of system RAM is even being used system-wide): https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1528803888
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1432025963

CPU usage is still in the 90s on larger parks. DX12 wont add anymore than 10% of fps for anyone thst doesnt have a heavily OCed CPU. And 10% of 20 is 2. The single thread draw call limit does far less to performance than you think.

Where do you see 90% usage? My CPU is only at 47-50% overall usage in those screenshots. Were it being pegged at 90-100%, I would be far less concerned that draw calls are the bottleneck and not CPU time itself.

You are correct that it's not the single thread limitation coming into play, because not a single thread is being maxed out. It's the API draw call limit that is being hit long before a single thread can even get maxed out. The game is just throwing that many draw calls per frame out when you have 10000+ guests.

[Cyonden]

Originally posted by Ancient:

Originally posted by Wylie28:

CPU usage is still in the 90s on larger parks. DX12 wont add anymore than 10% of fps for anyone thst doesnt have a heavily OCed CPU. And 10% of 20 is 2. The single thread draw call limit does far less to performance than you think.

Where do you see 90% usage? My CPU is only at 47-50% overall usage in those screenshots. Were it being pegged at 90-100%, I would be far less concerned that draw calls are the bottleneck and not CPU time itself.

You are correct that it's not the single thread limitation coming into play, because not a single thread is being maxed out. It's the API draw call limit that is being hit long before a single thread can even get maxed out. The game is just throwing that many draw calls per frame out when you have 10000+ guests.

can cofirm your cpu is at 50% , i just looked at your screen shot.

[Wylie28]

Originally posted by Ancient:

Originally posted by Wylie28:

CPU usage is still in the 90s on larger parks. DX12 wont add anymore than 10% of fps for anyone thst doesnt have a heavily OCed CPU. And 10% of 20 is 2. The single thread draw call limit does far less to performance than you think.

Where do you see 90% usage? My CPU is only at 47-50% overall usage in those screenshots. Were it being pegged at 90-100%, I would be far less concerned that draw calls are the bottleneck and not CPU time itself.

You are correct that it's not the single thread limitation coming into play, because not a single thread is being maxed out. It's the API draw call limit that is being hit long before a single thread can even get maxed out. The game is just throwing that many draw calls per frame out when you have 10000+ guests.

It is the single thread limitation coming into play. Your graph wont show it. Itd a bottleneck that happens 20x per second. (assuming 20fps) One point on a usage graph represents somewhere between .25 - 1 seconds of data. This small bottleneck prevents your GPU from rendering until its over. Which adds up over a second. You wont see a single threae maxed because durint that bottleneck the rest of your cores is doing the work required for that cycle. Which completes long before the wait is over and a frame is rendered. The game is designed to run at 60 fps after all. Its the graphics API that holds it back.