Khergit Khanate for Best Faction? Swadia Go home?

[Carlos Chircop]

Guys you gotta be two bricks short of a load to say that Swadia is the best and say that Khergit suck.

Swadia suck in Inf, They only have good Crossbowmen when they are upgraded, and their Man at Arms aren't all that special of a heavy cav. Only good thing they have is The Knights-
So:

Only have Knight and Man at Arms as cav.

Infantry suck and only have 1 good troop as inf- Swadian Sharpshooter
------------

Khergit are fricking as hard as hell to beat in battle, Their Lancers are like saying

French Lancer vs. Musician in NW...

They got good missile cav which are armoured and can handle themselves in 1v1 cav fight...

They don't have inf which is good, If you go against the Nords you can beat em by Rishing in Lancers and them finish the lads with a good Missile cav charge.

They can easily be trained, cheap as Sh*t.

Then they lack for sieges but for that if you order them to hold fire and then unleash hell and you can help em'.

What do you lads think?

[Stevenson Family]

Originally posted by BaconTheShakin:

also no faction is the best some people just prefer other factions

I prefer playing as nords, because Axes. The culture and style of them just appeal to me more than the others too. Who doesn't secretly (or openly) love vikings.

But if I was honest and had to pick a faction that was all round the best to make an army out of, nords would be behind Rhodock.

Maybe behind Swadia too.

Vaegir's are kind of well balanced though.... Sarranids too come to think of it.

[Nolo Contendere]

the only factions that aren't well balanced are truly the nords and khergits (assuming of course that we are talking about native) just because of their specialization

[Darawesh]

The Khanate sucks. It's the easiest faction to take over considering they are absolute ♥♥♥♥♥ when it comes to sieges. In the open field they're a more formidable foe, but Sarranid Mamlukes and Swadian Knights can easily beat them.

[Pianissimo]

Swadian Knights still beat Khergit Lancers and Khergit Horse Archers.

[Ape-tier Buffoonery]

Originally posted by Tubby Wubby Madness116:

Originally posted by BaconTheShakin:

I play the vagiers(i probley spelled it wrong) and i almost always beat the khergits,and also no faction is the best some people just prefer other factions

Do you have the options not set to an even difficulty? 100% damage to your own troops instead of reduced? I will agree there is no best but you using your own army and helping them is a little like cheating the system in this instance

He did say he almost always beats them. Which implies he loses sometimes probably when odds are stacked against him.

I find it hard to believe even the most drooling caveman couldn't beat even odds with 1/4 and 1/2 done to him and allies, much less charge into incredible odds he could never win.

With that being said, Swadian units statistically are better than the other factions.

Swadian Knight is the best melee mounted unit with Sarranids coming VERY close second, Vaegir and Khergit lancers finishing off the rest.

Swadian Crossbows are ranked behind Vaegir and Rhodoks, they're definitely better than Nords and Sarranid. Khergits are a tossup, if it's open battle Cav Archers beat Swadian xbow, but in a seige the xbow's would win.

Swadian Sergeants are ranked behind Nords for sure, but it's iffy if they're behind Rhodoks, better 1 hand with the excellent morning star weapon + better armour vs more raw hp and bigger shields, I'll probably leave it up to you to decide, either way both are better than Vaegir and WAY better than Sarranid guard.

So in the end you've got a highly versatile army who places 1st, 3rd/4th and 2nd/3rd for ranking of unit types, the reason they get smeared off the map is because they're borders touch 4 out of the 5 factions which they can declare/be declared war on, which they do/happens all the time for them.

[DROPbear]

Originally posted by Melon Collie:

Originally posted by Tubby Wubby Madness116:

heavy dependent on their loadouts and the condition what are they are fighting with.

If a direct duel comparison:

Calvary:
swadian knight> sarranid mamaluks>>> vaegir knights > khergit lancer

Note: khergit lancer may not necessary to be weaker, the reason why i rank them lower is just due to the fact that their lance cant 1 hit kill those opponents which are armed with better shortrange weapons and have better armor. In the case of fighting infantry based army, khergit lancer will steamroll them regardless and they are cheaper to build, maintain, and could field a larger quanity

infantry:
hurscal>>vaegir guards>sarranid guards> rhodok Sergeants > swadian Sergeants

Note: i would normally rank rhodok/swadian sergeants better than vaegir/sarranid guards because they are always armed with kite or towershields which will protect it from archers and will be better option in tower sieges. However if in even on 1v1 Axe wielders will benefit more, due to knock down and axes will destroy those shields in 2-3 hits. Rhodok sergeants are slightly better than swadian sergeants just because they are much more heavily armed and armored.

archers:
Vaegir archer / sarranid master archers > rhodok sharpshoots > swadian sharpshooters >> nord veteran archers

Note: besides xbows vs bows debate. In terms of shear DPS in an archers duel, currently bow unit have a significant DPS lead. In case of swadian vs rhodoks, rhodok are slightly better due to having better melee weapon while swadian xbows have better ROF. From my experience, i will still prefer xbow over bows as they are better at siege battles.

all faction have their cheese, other than the vaegirs which does not have any unit that excels over the others.

[Ape-tier Buffoonery]

Sarranid Guard is better than Rhodok and Swadians Sergeants?!

In a 1v1 situation Sarranid would beat Vaegir thanks to maybe spawning with a throwing weapon and Vaegir without a shield but would get wrecked by Rhodok and Swadian top tier infantry since with shields they would almost always get a free melee hit before the Sarranid Guard switches to 2 hander, which would get wrecked anyways thanks to 1hand speed and the shield probably not breaking after only having Jaris thrown at it. Sarranid guard armor provides a laughable 38 body defense, might as well just use Nord Warriors (which are a tier below Sarranid Guards) which are just better in almost all stats compared to Sarranid Guard.

Swadian Sergeants are actually better armed and armoured than Rhodok, apart from shields everything a Swadian wears/uses is generally better except for maybe the Awlpike vs Glaive since AI can't use pike weapons properly. Morning Star > Military Cleaver/Pick. The Rhodok has a higher natural health, and I believe 1 more power strike. So I think it's a toss up, you'd have to run like 100 tests of 1v1 and tally each winner down to see who comes out on top, ones naturally a better fighter the other has better equipment except for shield.

Axes do not cause knock down, only bonus shield breaking ability, Blunt weapons cause knock down. Again while a 2 hand is good, it's best in a player's hand who knows how to backpedal. An AI will simply run in face first and 1handed weapons which are faster would be better. Vaegirs and Sarranids are bottom tier as far as final Infantry go, especially defensively.

As for Archers/xbows I do agree that a bow will outdps a crossbow and in a 1v1 situation bows will probably win, in a battle scenario crossbows fire throughout the battle and the ability to pierce shields is fantastic. But yeah arguement goes seiges are for xbows, open field for bows.

Anyways, Sarranid is certainly not top tier archer, I'd put it roughly on par with Khergit's Vet Horse archer. Do they sometimes still get jarids to throw instead of bows? I remember back when I last played Sarranid they had a tendency to do that and thus waste slots in my army, it was awful. Even in an open field map I would prefer Rhodoks over Sarranids. Seige I would tie Swadians with Vaegirs. The problem I have with Vaegirs and Sarranids is that once they fired all their shots (which will only take like 30 seconds) they switch to melee, and dear lord are they bad at it.

[DROPbear]

no, sarranid guards sometimes spawn with 2nd axes that more capable of destroying the opponent shields in 2-3 hits, then a brief stun and finishing off in a final blow. Its really nasty when fighting with vaegir guards, as they are most likely to spawn with bardiche. I have seen nord huscral basicly getting 1-hit by it. A lot of players underestimated this units, as they are have lowest HP, and the worst shielded top tier unit in the game. I have seen them working extremely well in castle siege defence where units are funneled and archers could barely touch them, where hurscal would have a hard getting close as those axes constantly stun, breaking the shields.

I mean they are intially designed as shock troops, and they are working as intended.

note:
Its also possible that the collision in the game is bad, making that multiple long 2nd weapons able to work behind the rear row

[Carlos Chircop]

Khergits Lancers can handle themselves in a 1v1 siege fight

[a razor named qualia]

Originally posted by Juan Juarez (Carlos):

Khergits Lancers can handle themselves in a 1v1 siege fight

HAHAHA. No.

[Carlos Chircop]

no really they can....

[Carlos Chircop]

I mean they won't die dat easy lad :P

[a razor named qualia]

Spears are CRAP when they aren't against Horsemen or infantry while on a horse, in a siege Khergits get slaughters, 1 vs. 1 with a Nord Huscarl? Khergit Lancers are ♥♥♥♥♥♥.

[Carlos Chircop]

yEAH YOU GOT A POINT BUT THEY USUALLY DON'T HAVE SPEARS IN THIS CASE,really sry used caps... damn...

[Velvet Waltz]

Yep, then they use 1H weapon and shield. Their skill with these weapons is 110 which isn't even close to other units of that rank/cost