*Spoiler Alert* I hope that "true ending" is a bad joke

[Harmony]

Beat the game within 3 hours and got some "true ending". Dear developers...can't you just let this innocent girl have her inner peace? Cut this "same father same daughter" crap and give us some happier endings!!!

[Arke12917]

Originally posted by Harmony:

Originally posted by cronnoponno:

Spoilers:

I haven't played this game in awhile but the evidence that Aya is not a good person are all over throughout the game, in fact. There is a scene that imo is absolutely blatantly describing that Aya is at the very least unsympathetic to others or apathetic.


Remember the scene where she needs to rinse off a key that was in a filthy toilet before she is okay with using it? This same girl, will then dissect a dog to retrieve a key that it ate and then use that key with no mention of how disgusting it is.

I think this is just goes to show how much she is okay with cutting people up and the overall gory nature of what her father does, like hiding dead animals in her drawer, having no qualms swinging around a chainsaw when she was a child(the flashback scene is pretty important imo).

Again, it has been years since I played this game, but the hints were everywhere. My memory is fuzzy, but I think there was even a point where she showed no interest in some type of book or didn't have any interesting comment on it, but then in part of the area where you could find her fathers books on the human anatomy and other stuff in it she was curiously interested in it.

Even in the If route, when the doll asks Blondie what he would do if she ended up doing the same thing her father did, and he plays it off as ''Impossible, she understands the subjects feelings more than others''.

Notice how the lessons that are trying to be enforced into Aya are sympathy and compassion for the subjects, yet the entire game the only time she only shows much emotion is when it personally affects her overall welfare or interests.


There was also the matter of the comment the girl makes at the ending when she is being examined by Aya, I forgot the exact words but she seems to mention a lady in a carraige with horses driving it told her to come there to seek help, pretty much as soon as she says this they make it a point to make horses outside audible, heavily implying that Maria was the one who tricked the girl to even coming to her house in the first place. Again, I forgot the exact details of that scene, but watch it again with this in mind.


Didn't know they added new endings, pretty interested in what they will reveal. I personally like the thought that she herself was no better so I admit I'm kinda biased towards evidence supporting her being psycho, I think it makes the story more meaningful as it really brings a complex issue to the one playing it. It makes them question just who exactly they were playing as the entire time and I think that's done pretty well here.

About the rusty key part: for most of people, to chop some meat with blood on the chopping table is much more acceptable than dumping their hands into a pile of garbage in the flusher (You just can't do that, can you?!). Aya watched her father doing experiments all through her years. To save her dad she only had to search a key within a dog's body...how hard can that be? And, if you check that dog again, the line would be "fainted", so it's not dead anyway. I think that dog is kinda special too.

About the chainsaw part: I don't want to talk too much about this part. Just don't let your kid grab anything dangerous around him/her, even out of the game world. Be it a gun, a chainsaw, or even a small branch from the tree. Anything could be fatal.

About the red covered book part: there's no evidence showing that the red book on the shelf in her house IS that anatomy archive. The model of books are shared through the game. Plus, to be a good doctor, the human anatomy books are great help. You can use a knife to kill as well as to save.

About the Maria part: Maria just can't tell Jean like "oh, judging by your current condition, you're beyond help, so let me take you to my master and she can kill you later." I kinda support Arke12917 here, Maria only played a role which called the ferryman who leads the deads to their final destination then let Aya do the rest work. By doing this, Aya's able to keep her promise to her mother, her father and Dio at the same time. Perfect for me. Maybe that bold guy felt the same character on Aya so decided to help her (to play a role just like himself).

And...you mentioned that "It makes them question just who exactly they were playing as the entire time". I'd gladly be Dio (I cant' make the time stop though XD).

Wow you did a better job of explaining everything then I did. Nice to know somebody out there isn't part of the 98% that believes aya is just fully evil. Not saying she hasn't done some bad things but that Doesn't mean she's off the deep end like her father who did whatever he wanted (even murder). Her mother's promise and dio's last wishes are intertwined. So she has good intention with whatever she's decided to do for the rest of her life.

[DarthVitrial]

Originally posted by Arke12917:

Originally posted by Harmony:

About the rusty key part: for most of people, to chop some meat with blood on the chopping table is much more acceptable than dumping their hands into a pile of garbage in the flusher (You just can't do that, can you?!). Aya watched her father doing experiments all through her years. To save her dad she only had to search a key within a dog's body...how hard can that be? And, if you check that dog again, the line would be "fainted", so it's not dead anyway. I think that dog is kinda special too.

About the chainsaw part: I don't want to talk too much about this part. Just don't let your kid grab anything dangerous around him/her, even out of the game world. Be it a gun, a chainsaw, or even a small branch from the tree. Anything could be fatal.

About the red covered book part: there's no evidence showing that the red book on the shelf in her house IS that anatomy archive. The model of books are shared through the game. Plus, to be a good doctor, the human anatomy books are great help. You can use a knife to kill as well as to save.

About the Maria part: Maria just can't tell Jean like "oh, judging by your current condition, you're beyond help, so let me take you to my master and she can kill you later." I kinda support Arke12917 here, Maria only played a role which called the ferryman who leads the deads to their final destination then let Aya do the rest work. By doing this, Aya's able to keep her promise to her mother, her father and Dio at the same time. Perfect for me. Maybe that bold guy felt the same character on Aya so decided to help her (to play a role just like himself).

And...you mentioned that "It makes them question just who exactly they were playing as the entire time". I'd gladly be Dio (I cant' make the time stop though XD).

Wow you did a better job of explaining everything then I did. Nice to know somebody out there isn't part of the 98% that believes aya is just fully evil. Not saying she hasn't done some bad things but that Doesn't mean she's off the deep end like her father who did whatever he wanted (even murder). Her mother's promise and dio's last wishes are intertwined. So she has good intention with whatever she's decided to do for the rest of her life.

So you'd argue that Aya is not evil for euthanizing people she deems uncurable?
That still sounds like murder to me - if I went around killing people in hospitals because I didn't think they'd make it, that makes me a serial killer, not good person. You could make the argument that it's OK if they consent, but characters like Jean clearly did not consent to be euthanized.
If someone goes to the doctor's office saying they're sick and need treatment, and the doctor, deciding they're too sick to be cured, murders them, that makes the doctor evil.

[Zombie]

Originally posted by Harmony:

Originally posted by cronnoponno:

Spoilers:



.

About the rusty key part: for most of people, to chop some meat with blood on the chopping table is much more acceptable than dumping their hands into a pile of garbage in the flusher (You just can't do that, can you?!). Aya watched her father doing experiments all through her years. To save her dad she only had to search a key within a dog's body...how hard can that be? And, if you check that dog again, the line would be "fainted", so it's not dead anyway. I think that dog is kinda special too.

About the chainsaw part: I don't want to talk too much about this part. Just don't let your kid grab anything dangerous around him/her, even out of the game world. Be it a gun, a chainsaw, or even a small branch from the tree. Anything could be fatal.

About the red covered book part: there's no evidence showing that the red book on the shelf in her house IS that anatomy archive. The model of books are shared through the game. Plus, to be a good doctor, the human anatomy books are great help. You can use a knife to kill as well as to save.

About the Maria part: Maria just can't tell Jean like "oh, judging by your current condition, you're beyond help, so let me take you to my master and she can kill you later." I kinda support Arke12917 here, Maria only played a role which called the ferryman who leads the deads to their final destination then let Aya do the rest work. By doing this, Aya's able to keep her promise to her mother, her father and Dio at the same time. Perfect for me. Maybe that bold guy felt the same character on Aya so decided to help her (to play a role just like himself).


And...you mentioned that "It makes them question just who exactly they were playing as the entire time". I'd gladly be Dio (I cant' make the time stop though XD).

The thing about the Rusty Key though is the fact the scene is shown at all. They show that she genuinely has a sense of what is disgusting and what isn't, they're still showing you that ultimately she doesn't show any emotion in dissecting a dog. Also, I would not trust the game for saying the dog fainted, unless it was changed in this version you clearly need to use a knife to retrieve the key from when I remember last and saying the dog is ''fainted'' might be from Aya's perspective, which is even MORE incriminating against her rather than working for her. They give us a clear comparison between the two acts. Furthermore, if my life was on the line and I felt truly endangered, I would definitely fish a key out of a dirty used toilet to secure my safety, I wouldn't outright refuse to use the key until I could find a way to retrieve it out of the toilet and then sanitize it. That takes time and many ghosts have jumped out and tried to rip her to pieces immediately for her to be able to afford such calm thoughts.



The fact that the developer showed us a scene where Aya was scolded for mindlessly waving a chainsaw is important, naturally kids are dangerous with any tool and have no real emotion using them. We've all had that time as a kid when we thought it was funny to burn bugs with a magnifying glass and such, the thing is that we usually grow out of this and have parental figures in our lives to help facilitate our empathy towards other things. Aya does not have the proper upbringing normal children have and I would go as far as to say this childish selfishness of hers is what her father was so obsessed with preserving in her in the first place.



Aya seems to be very anti-social around Dio near the end, and Maria plays it off as her being shy.....is it really? Could it not in fact be her genuinely having no interest in talking to him and not continuing a conversation with him becuse overall he has nothing more to really offer her?


Why would they hide the fact that Maria is the old lady who brought Rooney to the clinic? If Maria did it for entirely altruistic purposes she would have no reason to be secretive about it, sneak into the backdoor after parking her carriage and make a very questionable remark with a sad face that she's ''just like her father'', noticeably looking a little older(which would coincide with Aya looking closer to an adult be the time the clip takes place).

[Arke12917]

Originally posted by cronnoponno:

Originally posted by Harmony:

About the rusty key part: for most of people, to chop some meat with blood on the chopping table is much more acceptable than dumping their hands into a pile of garbage in the flusher (You just can't do that, can you?!). Aya watched her father doing experiments all through her years. To save her dad she only had to search a key within a dog's body...how hard can that be? And, if you check that dog again, the line would be "fainted", so it's not dead anyway. I think that dog is kinda special too.

About the chainsaw part: I don't want to talk too much about this part. Just don't let your kid grab anything dangerous around him/her, even out of the game world. Be it a gun, a chainsaw, or even a small branch from the tree. Anything could be fatal.

About the red covered book part: there's no evidence showing that the red book on the shelf in her house IS that anatomy archive. The model of books are shared through the game. Plus, to be a good doctor, the human anatomy books are great help. You can use a knife to kill as well as to save.

About the Maria part: Maria just can't tell Jean like "oh, judging by your current condition, you're beyond help, so let me take you to my master and she can kill you later." I kinda support Arke12917 here, Maria only played a role which called the ferryman who leads the deads to their final destination then let Aya do the rest work. By doing this, Aya's able to keep her promise to her mother, her father and Dio at the same time. Perfect for me. Maybe that bold guy felt the same character on Aya so decided to help her (to play a role just like himself).


And...you mentioned that "It makes them question just who exactly they were playing as the entire time". I'd gladly be Dio (I cant' make the time stop though XD).

The thing about the Rusty Key though is the fact the scene is shown at all. They show that she genuinely has a sense of what is disgusting and what isn't, they're still showing you that ultimately she doesn't show any emotion in dissecting a dog. Also, I would not trust the game for saying the dog fainted, unless it was changed in this version you clearly need to use a knife to retrieve the key from when I remember last and saying the dog is ''fainted'' might be from Aya's perspective, which is even MORE incriminating against her rather than working for her. They give us a clear comparison between the two acts. Furthermore, if my life was on the line and I felt truly endangered, I would definitely fish a key out of a dirty used toilet to secure my safety, I wouldn't outright refuse to use the key until I could find a way to retrieve it out of the toilet and then sanitize it. That takes time and many ghosts have jumped out and tried to rip her to pieces immediately for her to be able to afford such calm thoughts.



The fact that the developer showed us a scene where Aya was scolded for mindlessly waving a chainsaw is important, naturally kids are dangerous with any tool and have no real emotion using them. We've all had that time as a kid when we thought it was funny to burn bugs with a magnifying glass and such, the thing is that we usually grow out of this and have parental figures in our lives to help facilitate our empathy towards other things. Aya does not have the proper upbringing normal children have and I would go as far as to say this childish selfishness of hers is what her father was so obsessed with preserving in her in the first place.



Aya seems to be very anti-social around Dio near the end, and Maria plays it off as her being shy.....is it really? Could it not in fact be her genuinely having no interest in talking to him and not continuing a conversation with him becuse overall he has nothing more to really offer her?


Why would they hide the fact that Maria is the old lady who brought Rooney to the clinic? If Maria did it for entirely altruistic purposes she would have no reason to be secretive about it, sneak into the backdoor after parking her carriage and make a very questionable remark with a sad face that she's ''just like her father'', noticeably looking a little older(which would coincide with Aya looking closer to an adult be the time the clip takes place).

I can see where you are coming from but a few things don't make sense. You say you would much rather pick up a filithy key rather than find a way to sanitize it? yeah except that aya is 11. I don't think that crossed her head when she decided not to pick it up. Besides you say her life is in immediate danger but it's not REALLY in immediate danger. Is she being strangled by a ghost while trying to pick up a key? I don't think it counts that way. What about her father? Isn't he the reason she's rushing? well we can assume that some level of magic is present in this game (the portal to the other world). If you check the clock in aya's bedroom it is STOPPED at 12 meaning time is frozen. It would appear she has much more time than you first think.

Also I want to make it clear I'm not just defending her I'm arguing for both sides and trying to find a conclusion to the ending (i'm a little good side biased though). Here's one. The dog "fainted" because aya pulled the mandrake out of the pot. She then KNEW it was alive and decided she needed the key because she wanted to save her father by getting to the incineration room. (because she saw the key before it was eaten she KNEW it was the key to the incineration room and decided it was more important to kill the dog.) However did she even know what the rusty key in the toilet was for? no she couldn't recognize it properly therefore there was no immediate need for her to pull it out (in her 11 year old head at least).

You also talk about her not having a proper ubringing from then onwards to the future. Um... Maria? aya asked maria to come with her so they could start a new life somewhere else away from her father. Aya seems a bit shy but if she had no interest in dio then why would she say "I want to see you again"? She could have just said thank you. (remember IF takes plcae inbetween when she faints and the house burning down.)

As for the chainsaw bit she's definetely crazy and in the new version she actually KILLS someone with it (albeit by acident in surprise though). The carriges I have no idea. Willing to help me out? (I genuinely don't mind if she's evil I just want some kind of Inargueable proof).

I'll even get you started on something MAJOR I just discovered in a place that's NOT part of the game. The steam trading card A red book. "it drives everything MAD" oh dear... did they just DIRECTLY admit that book is the same one her father uses? if you look in the picture it's her holding a red book while outside a house with a carriage... wait is the house in the picture the FUTURE AYA'S HOUSE? but in the picure she's young... oh. could she be reading it in secret during her spare time while she's growing up under the cover of the trees? Well you tell me.

[Harmony]

Originally posted by cronnoponno:

Originally posted by Harmony:

About the rusty key part: for most of people, to chop some meat with blood on the chopping table is much more acceptable than dumping their hands into a pile of garbage in the flusher (You just can't do that, can you?!). Aya watched her father doing experiments all through her years. To save her dad she only had to search a key within a dog's body...how hard can that be? And, if you check that dog again, the line would be "fainted", so it's not dead anyway. I think that dog is kinda special too.

About the chainsaw part: I don't want to talk too much about this part. Just don't let your kid grab anything dangerous around him/her, even out of the game world. Be it a gun, a chainsaw, or even a small branch from the tree. Anything could be fatal.

About the red covered book part: there's no evidence showing that the red book on the shelf in her house IS that anatomy archive. The model of books are shared through the game. Plus, to be a good doctor, the human anatomy books are great help. You can use a knife to kill as well as to save.

About the Maria part: Maria just can't tell Jean like "oh, judging by your current condition, you're beyond help, so let me take you to my master and she can kill you later." I kinda support Arke12917 here, Maria only played a role which called the ferryman who leads the deads to their final destination then let Aya do the rest work. By doing this, Aya's able to keep her promise to her mother, her father and Dio at the same time. Perfect for me. Maybe that bold guy felt the same character on Aya so decided to help her (to play a role just like himself).


And...you mentioned that "It makes them question just who exactly they were playing as the entire time". I'd gladly be Dio (I cant' make the time stop though XD).

The thing about the Rusty Key though is the fact the scene is shown at all. They show that she genuinely has a sense of what is disgusting and what isn't, they're still showing you that ultimately she doesn't show any emotion in dissecting a dog. Also, I would not trust the game for saying the dog fainted, unless it was changed in this version you clearly need to use a knife to retrieve the key from when I remember last and saying the dog is ''fainted'' might be from Aya's perspective, which is even MORE incriminating against her rather than working for her. They give us a clear comparison between the two acts. Furthermore, if my life was on the line and I felt truly endangered, I would definitely fish a key out of a dirty used toilet to secure my safety, I wouldn't outright refuse to use the key until I could find a way to retrieve it out of the toilet and then sanitize it. That takes time and many ghosts have jumped out and tried to rip her to pieces immediately for her to be able to afford such calm thoughts.



The fact that the developer showed us a scene where Aya was scolded for mindlessly waving a chainsaw is important, naturally kids are dangerous with any tool and have no real emotion using them. We've all had that time as a kid when we thought it was funny to burn bugs with a magnifying glass and such, the thing is that we usually grow out of this and have parental figures in our lives to help facilitate our empathy towards other things. Aya does not have the proper upbringing normal children have and I would go as far as to say this childish selfishness of hers is what her father was so obsessed with preserving in her in the first place.



Aya seems to be very anti-social around Dio near the end, and Maria plays it off as her being shy.....is it really? Could it not in fact be her genuinely having no interest in talking to him and not continuing a conversation with him becuse overall he has nothing more to really offer her?


Why would they hide the fact that Maria is the old lady who brought Rooney to the clinic? If Maria did it for entirely altruistic purposes she would have no reason to be secretive about it, sneak into the backdoor after parking her carriage and make a very questionable remark with a sad face that she's ''just like her father'', noticeably looking a little older(which would coincide with Aya looking closer to an adult be the time the clip takes place).

In Resident Evil series, you even have to turn the key around to read the tag, from "a key" to "a key engraved with sword/shield/club" or something like that. Just consider it a part of the game mechanism. You couldn't have dumped into a pile of dirth trash and found a brand new key so the only reasonable explanation is the rusky/dirty key; but without flushing it you'll have to guess where should it be used. That was only a quiz part to make the whole story more reasonable!

And all those "seems to be...Could it not", well, we're all making some guesses here, so I think I'll pass. However, about the "just like her father" line, do you think that Maria was implying Aya's words or her deeds? There's no proof for that part too. Maria's purpose could be "altruistic" like you said, but she might have some conscience too, which made her to hide from the person who was taken by her to the death. There will be someone who just can't watch the killing part. And for your refference, when that mad doctor do experiences on his subjects, Maria chose to stand by him and said "I'll take care of the remains". But now she decides to stay away from the killing part. A change of heart, I'd say!

[HimeAria]

Originally posted by aMaZa:

Of course she's doing it for her own personal gain but then why not just grab some random people off the road, strap them to a table and turn them into dolls like her father did? The answer is simple. "She understands the subjects pain more than anyone else" XD. There's my "happy" interpretation.

They weren't "random people off the road". They were people that were ABANDONED by society.

Did you not pay attention to Maria's backstory at all whatsoever? When the doctor found her and "saved" her, she was ON THE STREETS BEGGING FOR FOOD....and being ignored by everyone passing by. Then the doctor comes along and gives her a home and food. She's not the only one, either. Apart from that ONE starving spirit you meet in the kitchen, EVERY subject was well-fed.

And why did he do this? Not just for Maria, but EVERY subject he brought in? And why is it that he turned everyone into dolls? BECAUSE HE WANTED TO MAKE THEM BEAUTIFUL. Let me repeat that: BECAUSE HE WANTED TO MAKE THEM BEAUTIFUL. Let me repeat that one more time: BECAUSE HE HAD THE GOOD INTENTIONS OF PERSERVING THEIR BEAUTY.

Notice that "good intentions" wording I added in that last one? You're all willing to justify Aya's insanity with "sure she's insane, but she's actually doing it with good intentions, so she's not actually evil!", yet you blatantly dismiss her father as "purely mad, with no good caused" without even the slightest consideration.

If Aya is secretly good but her father is just pure evil....then why bother feeding and TREATING almost every subject? He even hires Maria as his assistant due entirely to HER ABILITY TO TREAT WOUNDS. She wasn't hired as some clean-up janitor, she was hired as a NURSE. Seriously people, pay attention to the backstories.

Dio/that blond guy even mentions near the end of the true ending how all the subjects were abandoned. Useless and discarded by society. It's why he asked Aya to make that promise to never forget them. To "carry in your heart proof we were alive", or something along those lines

Oh, and did everyone "conveniently" forget how much he LOVES HIS DAUGHTER? So much so that he wants Maria to PROTECT her? And the only reason he even wants to turn her into a doll to begin with is because he realizes she will someday lose her beauty? Did you all "conveniently" forget every single flashback Aya has of her father? They don't just show HER love for HIM, they also show HIS love for HER.

Aya and her father really are the same. If Aya is good, so is the doctor. If the doctor is evil, then so is Aya. If Aya can be excused for her "good intentions", then so can her father.

Again, pay attention to backstories and flashbacks, people. They exist for a reason.




....that ended up being a pretty long post....
Best part? 99% chance someone/everyone's gonna misinterpret most, if not all of it.

[Arke12917]

Originally posted by Yuudachi Kai Ni:

Originally posted by aMaZa:

Of course she's doing it for her own personal gain but then why not just grab some random people off the road, strap them to a table and turn them into dolls like her father did? The answer is simple. "She understands the subjects pain more than anyone else" XD. There's my "happy" interpretation.

They weren't "random people off the road". They were people that were ABANDONED by society.

Did you not pay attention to Maria's backstory at all whatsoever? When the doctor found her and "saved" her, she was ON THE STREETS BEGGING FOR FOOD....and being ignored by everyone passing by. Then the doctor comes along and gives her a home and food. She's not the only one, either. Apart from that ONE starving spirit you meet in the kitchen, EVERY subject was well-fed.

And why did he do this? Not just for Maria, but EVERY subject he brought in? And why is it that he turned everyone into dolls? BECAUSE HE WANTED TO MAKE THEM BEAUTIFUL. Let me repeat that: BECAUSE HE WANTED TO MAKE THEM BEAUTIFUL. Let me repeat that one more time: BECAUSE HE HAD THE GOOD INTENTIONS OF PERSERVING THEIR BEAUTY.

Notice that "good intentions" wording I added in that last one? You're all willing to justify Aya's insanity with "sure she's insane, but she's actually doing it with good intentions, so she's not actually evil!", yet you blatantly dismiss her father as "purely mad, with no good caused" without even the slightest consideration.

If Aya is secretly good but her father is just pure evil....then why bother feeding and TREATING almost every subject? He even hires Maria as his assistant due entirely to HER ABILITY TO TREAT WOUNDS. She wasn't hired as some clean-up janitor, she was hired as a NURSE. Seriously people, pay attention to the backstories.

Dio/that blond guy even mentions near the end of the true ending how all the subjects were abandoned. Useless and discarded by society. It's why he asked Aya to make that promise to never forget them. To "carry in your heart proof we were alive", or something along those lines

Oh, and did everyone "conveniently" forget how much he LOVES HIS DAUGHTER? So much so that he wants Maria to PROTECT her? And the only reason he even wants to turn her into a doll to begin with is because he realizes she will someday lose her beauty? Did you all "conveniently" forget every single flashback Aya has of her father? They don't just show HER love for HIM, they also show HIS love for HER.

Aya and her father really are the same. If Aya is good, so is the doctor. If the doctor is evil, then so is Aya. If Aya can be excused for her "good intentions", then so can her father.

Again, pay attention to backstories and flashbacks, people. They exist for a reason.




....that ended up being a pretty long post....
Best part? 99% chance someone/everyone's gonna misinterpret most, if not all of it.

Shhhh. Chill out. You've responded to an older comment of mine XD. You've also necroed this thread. I already understand your point of view and agree with you. After all it's actually even proven in the steam trading cards. Don't believe me? Go look at the mad father steam trading cards and read all the descriptions. Especially the one on the book. (Unless of course you read them all ready)

[HimeAria]

I'm nowhere near as pissed as you percieve me to be. I'm just really really really really really really REALLY talkative :D

That, and bolded font doesn't show up too well on the Steam forum background, so I kinda just use ALL CAPS instead. I'm not actually "yelling". Just trying to place a little more emphasis on important points.

[Luna]

I thought the ending was perfect <3 hahaha

[Vercingetorix]

Originally posted by Yura:

Originally posted by aMaZa:

Of course she's doing it for her own personal gain but then why not just grab some random people off the road, strap them to a table and turn them into dolls like her father did? The answer is simple. "She understands the subjects pain more than anyone else" XD. There's my "happy" interpretation.

They weren't "random people off the road". They were people that were ABANDONED by society.

Did you not pay attention to Maria's backstory at all whatsoever? When the doctor found her and "saved" her, she was ON THE STREETS BEGGING FOR FOOD....and being ignored by everyone passing by. Then the doctor comes along and gives her a home and food. She's not the only one, either. Apart from that ONE starving spirit you meet in the kitchen, EVERY subject was well-fed.

And why did he do this? Not just for Maria, but EVERY subject he brought in? And why is it that he turned everyone into dolls? BECAUSE HE WANTED TO MAKE THEM BEAUTIFUL. Let me repeat that: BECAUSE HE WANTED TO MAKE THEM BEAUTIFUL. Let me repeat that one more time: BECAUSE HE HAD THE GOOD INTENTIONS OF PERSERVING THEIR BEAUTY.

Notice that "good intentions" wording I added in that last one? You're all willing to justify Aya's insanity with "sure she's insane, but she's actually doing it with good intentions, so she's not actually evil!", yet you blatantly dismiss her father as "purely mad, with no good caused" without even the slightest consideration.

If Aya is secretly good but her father is just pure evil....then why bother feeding and TREATING almost every subject? He even hires Maria as his assistant due entirely to HER ABILITY TO TREAT WOUNDS. She wasn't hired as some clean-up janitor, she was hired as a NURSE. Seriously people, pay attention to the backstories.

Dio/that blond guy even mentions near the end of the true ending how all the subjects were abandoned. Useless and discarded by society. It's why he asked Aya to make that promise to never forget them. To "carry in your heart proof we were alive", or something along those lines

Oh, and did everyone "conveniently" forget how much he LOVES HIS DAUGHTER? So much so that he wants Maria to PROTECT her? And the only reason he even wants to turn her into a doll to begin with is because he realizes she will someday lose her beauty? Did you all "conveniently" forget every single flashback Aya has of her father? They don't just show HER love for HIM, they also show HIS love for HER.

Aya and her father really are the same. If Aya is good, so is the doctor. If the doctor is evil, then so is Aya. If Aya can be excused for her "good intentions", then so can her father.

Again, pay attention to backstories and flashbacks, people. They exist for a reason.




....that ended up being a pretty long post....
Best part? 99% chance someone/everyone's gonna misinterpret most, if not all of it.

Sorry, but I don't agree with many of the things you've said. Let's go through your arguement step-by-step.

-You mention the Father's subjects weren't random people off the street, but people abandoned by society. This is certaintly true, however, there is a reason he does this. People abandoned by society won't be noticed if they go missing. That's why he just doesn't nab random people. Because someone will notice they are gone and will file a missing person report. Dio even says this at the end. "No one looked for us...No one remembered us."

-Next, you mention that he feeds everyone he brings in. Well, why does he do this? Out of the kindness of his heart? I disagree. Think about it. He is making dolls. Beautiful dolls, as you put in in your next paragraph. You think starving, homeless beggars will make beautiful dolls? I think not. He fed them and took care of them until they were ripe for the picking. If he really cared about them, he would've stopped there instead of decapitating them alive and stuffing them.

-You then mention how he had "good intentions." I'm sorry, but his only intentions were satisfying his crazy doll fetishes. He tortured and murdered innocent people. There is nothing good about that. You also mention he hired Maria for her ability to treat wounds. I agree! To treat people who were brought in from the street and in poor condition, that is. Like I've mentioned above, people in poor health don't exactly have luxurious bodies. He is essentially rasing them as cattle for slaughter, and Maria helped him to do just that. Besides, someone who knows how to patch people up is essential when you are putting back body parts in order to make dolls. Remember how the Father said his dolls were from body parts of all different people? Someone has to put those body parts together.

-Next you mention how he "loves" his daughter. There is a stark line between love and obesession. Quite frankly I haven't heard of anyone who loves their daughter so much they chase her down with a chainsaw and decapitates her, then turns her into a doll. Must be that crazy kind of love.

-Finally, you mention how Aya and her father are the same. I also agree! They are both crazed murderers! Furthermore, they are also evil, despicable people. You can't seriously expect a nice ending for a horror genre. I sure as hell know I didn't haha

[HimeAria]

Originally posted by Vercingetorix:

-Finally, you mention how Aya and her father are the same. I also agree! They are both crazed murderers! Furthermore, they are also evil, despicable people. You can't seriously expect a nice ending for a horror genre. I sure as hell know I didn't haha

This was basically my entire point. I wasn't necessarily trying to say the father was a "good" person. I was simply pointing out how his actions can be "justified" just as easily as Aya's. If you're going to justify Aya's actions and call her a "good" person, then it's only right to use those exact same justifications to justify her father behaving the exact same way. If one's evil, so are both.

It just kinda irks me a bit that most everyone wants to justify Aya just because they don't want to accept a cute girl being "evil". It's not her father's fault he's too old to be "cute" <_<.

Also, just because I'd like a nice, happy ending in a horror game, doesn't mean I'm expecting a nice, happy ending. I do like when they at least add one in as one of many endings (even if it's non-canon), but I fully realize that this is a HORROR game first and foremost. If you want nothing but sunshine and rainbows.....don't play Mad Father :D

Plus, "happy" endings in horror games aren't always all that happy to begin with. :B Anyone play Mogeko Castle? I got the happy end in that game last night, and I STILL can't figure out where the "happy" is D:

[Vercingetorix]

Originally posted by Yura:

This was basically my entire point. I wasn't necessarily trying to say the father was a "good" person. I was simply pointing out how his actions can be "justified" just as easily as Aya's. If you're going to justify Aya's actions and call her a "good" person, then it's only right to use those exact same justifications to justify her father behaving the exact same way. If one's evil, so are both.

It just kinda irks me a bit that most everyone wants to justify Aya just because they don't want to accept a cute girl being "evil". It's not her father's fault he's too old to be "cute" <_<.

Also, just because I'd like a nice, happy ending in a horror game, doesn't mean I'm expecting a nice, happy ending. I do like when they at least add one in as one of many endings (even if it's non-canon), but I fully realize that this is a HORROR game first and foremost. If you want nothing but sunshine and rainbows.....don't play Mad Father :D

Plus, "happy" endings in horror games aren't always all that happy to begin with. :B Anyone play Mogeko Castle? I got the happy end in that game last night, and I STILL can't figure out where the "happy" is D:

Oh ok then! In that case then I agree with your point. I would never justify Aya as a good person, because she's still doing what her father was doing, just a watered-down version of it. At the end of they day, they are still both killing people and turning them into dolls, which is completely mad. I also like happy endings. I just don't really expect them much either lol

[Disconnected]

That moment the kid realizes not everything gets a happy ending.

[Ela]

Originally posted by Harmony:

Beat the game within 3 hours and got some "true ending". Dear developers...can't you just let this innocent girl have her inner peace? Cut this "same father same daughter" crap and give us some happier endings!!!

if you play the game in the second round you find out that Aya killed animal herself and you find letters which say that the mother noticed that Aya is like her father.(that she likes to kill) I don't like the ending either, but in the second round it gets a bit clearer why she does the things her father did and you get to know that Aya would have had the same future anyways, because she was going insane like her father.

[x-calibar]

This looks like the topic to discuss the ending, although old... (Just got around to playing the Steam version!)

It is disconcerting...
Aya has the potential to follow in her family's footsteps... Between all the clues found during the main game and the true ending alluding to a new dark path.

But at the same time "IF", gives us the possibility that Dio could cross their path once more. And try to stop her if she really has started killing.

In the end, I didn't see any hard evidence that she has chosen the same as her father. Though there are plenty of hints with just the final scene:
There were small dolls, similar to the ones her father made. Maria did imply that she was very similar to the doctor. Anesthesia at the start of a check-up seems wrong. The sound of horses could imply the patient was tricked and lead there. She was shown fixated on the patient's beauty.

But, it could be interpeted that she loves her father, so she has taken up the same... a similar hobby of creating dolls as a way of keeping his memory alive. She also could be obsessed with research, and act similar to her father... without killing everyone she gets her hands on. It might be plausible that this rumored secret clinic might be curing people, which is how such rumors are drawing people to her. Even if her science... goes beyond conventional ethics, if she is saving people and not turning them into human DOLLS... hm... Well, it's a possibility anyway.

Then again, I wonder if she has the ability to manipulate people's minds like her mother (unless I misunderstood that part). We did witness her pet Rabbit fetching an important item for her. Manipulating minds could allow her to catch and release people without them being the wiser of what happened while they were there. She could become quite calculating with age...

Still, the Aya who reached the true ending, went around fearlessly helping most lost souls even if they might pose a threat or would be in contrast to her father's plans. I find it hard to believe she would forget those lost souls, and the day she lost her father and mother again... and completely fixate on following in her father's footsteps.

It was weird though, how that book just conveniently ended up there. Did Ogre orchestrate that? And it was weird how her attitude changed the moment she got the book. And then the Steam card says the red book drives people MAD. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a curse on that red book, in a world where curses exist (also, wasn't that "house" owned by ritualists/cultists etc? That "incinerator" area was ... rather ominous... Even though the father was already a murderer, he became so much more after coming to that place.)
Or maybe she just had a revelation about honoring her father by carrying on his legacy...

Well, unless a sequel is made, I guess it's up to our imaginations...