Help me reach the Ultimate Good Ending. SPOILERS.

[Naked Master]

SPOILERS AHEAD, I will use [spoiler] [/spoiler] tags but BEWARE.

I plan to replay Pyre one last time to finally finish the story the best possible way. I need help!

My goals:

• Make sure lovers stay together.
  
• Make sure friends stay together (as much as possible).
  
• Make sure exiles reach their personal goals. (example: Tamitha will forgive Pamitha)
  
• Complete Peaceful Revolution, if possible.
  
• Liberate people useful for Sahran Union (relationships take priority).

Who stays, who goes?

• Hedwyn - stays. Later joined by Fikani.
  
• Jodariel - stays. Later joined by Ignarius.
  
• Rukey - goes. His mother waits for him and he has connections, Plan could use this. I don't like the idea of separating the Original Trio, but Pamitha will be here for him, later.
  
• Bae the Bae - goes. Later joined by Almer.
  
• Ti'Zo - stays. He is okay in the Downside and his friends are here.
  
• Sir Gilman - goes. I need to free someone on the first Liberation Rite, and I don't want to tear apart Jodi and Hedwyn or Ti'Zo and old crew. Bae needs time to develop relationship with Almer and Rukey needs time to resolve Barker Situation.
  
• Pamitha Theyn - goes. But only after her sister is liberated. She will help Sahran Union build agreement with Harps and keep Rukey company, too.
  
• Big Bertrude - stays. Volfred is here and she said that it is easier to do stuff here. She also assists him with teaching Downside how to read, I believe?
  
• Volfred Sandalwood - stays. He is very important to plan and I believe that he can even prevent violent revolution, but Bertrude, Ti'Zo and Oralech are all here. I will keep them together.
  
• Oralech - goes. At first I though I would go instead of him, but now I think he just deserves his freedom: he was exiled unjustly, he was then betrayed and if he returns he will help people on the night of Scribes' Return. And since I can show him my thoughts, even if he goes free, he will know that Volfred was never involved in his betrayal.

In what order you plan to release people?

1. Gilman.
   
2. Tamitha. (The Essence)
   
3. Almer. (The Fate)
   
4. Rukey.
   
5. Bae.
   
6. Pamitha.
   
7. Reader.

Thoughts.

• Hedwyn gave a bold promise about something he wasn't even sure about. Of course, breaking isn't good, but since I plan to make everyone happy anyway, it doesn't matter.
  
• Pamitha and Almer are both very useful to Sahran Union. Pamitha helps with Harps and Almer becomes great historican, preserving both Cur and Nomad (and Savage, I guess) culture. He is invaluable and I don't think I should swap him at all.
  
• I am doubting my choices here and need help considering. For example: granting freedom to Volfred, Bertrude, Ti'Zo, Oralech, Bae, Almer and Pamitha sounds interesting, but when Theyn sister are in different realms, Tamitha won't forgive Pamitha.
  
• By the way, either Pamitha or Hedwyn always need to go free, or Fikani will never see Hedwyn again.
  
• I thought about swapping Gilman / Tamitha / Pamitha with Ignarius / Jodariel / Hedwyn, but I am not sure if Ingraus will hit on Jodariel when both are free, and that Tamitha will forgive Pamitha when both are in downside.
  
• Apparently to avoid rioting you need to free 6 Nightwings at least, not including Oralech.
  
• I kinda feel bad for poor Lendel, but he will only hurt the Plan in the end. Dissidents, Pyrehearts, Withdrawn and Chastity are out of question, I won't let them go.
  
• I am awful at writing in English.

Please, if you have any ideas, suggestions and stuff, write it in the comments.

[Snarplord XVI]

Lose the Oralech fight, but by a small margin. Then reach out to Oralech. He will give you his place, and he and Volfred get a good ending. This way the Reader goes free as well.

[AnkhWarrior]

WARNING-This post contains hardcore spoilers, even after several playthroughs, since he brings up conversations or character endings you may not have come across yet.

I've had Gilman say to me twice he has no desire to leave the Downside. He wants to regain his honor, and the only way he could do that is to finish his self-imposed sentence.

Did Jod really have a thing for Ignarius? Funny enough, Jod was my first to be sent, and i only vsed Ignarius once. Hedwyn would be awfully unhappy if he couldnt get everyone he wanted to freedom, and i honestly think Hedwyn plays a huge part in the Plan, lore wise. Volfred even says that, and he dosnt compliment like...Anyone.

And i'm quite certain that Oralech's freedom is 'canon'. Nominateing yourself just proves you learned nothing from the game :P A game about compassion and teamwork, they wouldnt end it with you being selfish. When it comes exclusively to the playables...

Hedwyn- Send, if you agree on the 'large part of the plan' deal.
Jod- Meh? As i said, first sent, so i know very little about her lore wise.
Rukey- Definitely needs to be Sent. He's one of the few who shows genuine interest in returning to his family.
Gray-Another Meh, but she was one of my last to be sent. While she shows reasonable desire and has notable effects on the community if sent home, she dosnt show it as much as others, and then she'd have to leave her best friend, Brother Wagon, so... Honestly? I think she should stay. Finish her relationship with Almar(Drawing a blank on his name....) within the Downside.
Gilman-Stay.
Pamitha-Send, afyer fixing her relationship with her sister.
Bertrude-She goes wherever Volfred goes.
Volfred-Says specifically he dosnt desire to go back. Which means, Bertrude stays too.

Which leads a problem. How many do ya need to send for the peaceful variant? However many... This example here shows only 3, 4 if you count Gilman.

But i'm curious.....Does Oralech count towards the Plan? If he wins instead of you, he reads your thoughts, and expresses that he understands the Plan, and his ending indicates he joins the rallying for freedom.

Hey i forgot Ti'zo! He...... he should definitely stay, though he's a good pick for a member of the revolt. So i say he could go either way, though keeping him in the Downside might be best.

[tulicloure]

Originally posted by AnkhWarrior:

I've had Gilman say to me twice he has no desire to leave the Downside. He wants to regain his honor, and the only way he could do that is to finish his self-imposed sentence.

He says he will regain his honor by helping the Plan, or something along those lines. So he wouldn't mind going back in the last Rite or so, IMO.

[Karavanth]

Originally posted by Sir Snarplord the Enraged Hat:

Lose the Oralech fight, but by a small margin. Then reach out to Oralech. He will give you his place, and he and Volfred get a good ending. This way the Reader goes free as well. [/quote]





Ooooh how I wish I'd done that. I'd ceremoniously stood aside for him, and refused to score at all.

At the same time..... I like the sacrifice I made. So there's that.

[Iry]

Spoilers, obviously, if you're this far deep into the thread.

Oralech definitely seems to help the plan.
Volfred helps the plan a huge amount. He also seems to be in love with Oralech.
Bertrude helps the plan a huge amount. She's in love with Volfred, but he loves Oralech.
Ti'Zo helps the plan a huge amount. He becomes a mascott and icon for the revolution.
Almer helps the plan a lot. He gets into a relationship with _ae if they both get out, or both of them stay.
Jodi helps the plan a lot, but she's also happy to stay and can get into a relationship with Iggy.
Gilman says he is happy to stay, but then ends up kind of lonely.
_ae is happy to stay, and ends up being a holy pilgrim of the Scribes.
Pamitha kind of, sort of, reconciles with her sister. But her wing gets damaged doing it, and that's pretty sad since she is always telling you about how much she loves flying.

[Karavanth]

Off topic (sorry), but I totally didn't catch that Volfred and Orelech were an item? I understood from my epilogue and such that they forgave each other and became friends again due to their mutual experiences, but I wasn't aware it was deeper than that.

[Snarplord XVI]

Originally posted by Iry:

Volfred helps the plan a huge amount. He also seems to be in love with Oralech.
Bertrude helps the plan a huge amount. She's in love with Volfred, but he loves Oralech.

Nothing ever says anything about Volfred being in love with anyone.

[Iry]

Originally posted by Sir Snarplord the Enraged Hat:

Nothing ever says anything about Volfred being in love with anyone.

It's heavily implied. He was devastated by the loss of Oralech, offers a good explanation for turning down Bertrude, and in certain endings Volfred and Oralech spend all their time together.

[Zoro4rk]

I just finished the game, so here are two things I haven't seen in here:
- I left Tamitha go (because Pamita asked, not because she deserved lol) and there was bloodshed. Maybe it isn't related, but I only liberated nightwings before that, so, yeah.
- If you win agains Oralech (at least if you win with a big margin) and don't let him go free, he WILL kill himself.

So yeah. I think you should leave Volfred, Bertrude plus another one of the nightwings. Chose either yourself or Oralech in the end.
Also, don't let Ti'zo and the Stowaway get apart; they're best friends!!

[Naked Master]

Wow, this thread grew bigger than I ever expected!
Thanks for all the answers!
I think I'll have to finish the game two times then - one save where Jodi, Hedwyn, Rukey and Reader go free and another where Bertrude, Volfred, Ti'Zo and Oralech do.

[AnkhWarrior]

Can someone test a theory for me, whenever they can? If you give Bertrude her freedom, she'll ask why you're doing it, since she has literally no desire to leave, but then realizes how she can help the plan. So i wonder, what happens if you send Volfred first? Will she say she DOES have a reason, and it's to meet back up with him?

[Iry]

Originally posted by AnkhWarrior:

Can someone test a theory for me, whenever they can? If you give Bertrude her freedom, she'll ask why you're doing it, since she has literally no desire to leave, but then realizes how she can help the plan. So i wonder, what happens if you send Volfred first? Will she say she DOES have a reason, and it's to meet back up with him?

I sent Volfred before Bertrude in my most recent game, and she just said the usual stuff about understanding why you chose to send her (the plan).

[Ghostel]

About losing to Oralech...
In my experience you don't need to "almost win and lose" to him.
After doing my first playthrough and liberating everyone except Bertrude, Sandalwood and Reader (i promised them freedom - i ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ delivered what is promised to them at the max of my ability following the order of young people, children and TiZo first. Haedwyn suck it up you big baby - world is a harsh thing we're not always get what we want - at least i lost my freedom while keeping my dignity)

So I've reloaded last checkpoint after it and literally threw the game against Oralech - he still considered listening to me and allowed me to choose whether Reader or He goes free anyway (Dude is such a stubborn fool - didn't allow me to give freedom to my teammate... Srsly i was playing the part of selfless Reader, i let you read my thoughts, the hell do you expect from me - to suddenly change my ways? You feel generous? Then give your freedom to young generation, i have books and emerald orb to keep me company anyway... )

Ehem... So the fact is.

You just need to LOSE to Oralech - it doesn't matter whether it was a close match or onesided "we allow you to win" one.

[Epithet Lost]

Originally posted by Naked Master:

Thoughts.

• I kinda feel bad for poor Lendel, but he will only hurt the Plan in the end. Dissidents, Pyrehearts, Withdrawn and Chastity are out of question, I won't let them go.

What? Why? I would seriously rather liberate Manley over Lendel. Both are Aholes, but Lendel also affected others while Manley is just a rich guy. Also, Manley has a kickass track (the best track in the game I would say). Also, Ti'zo.
The only one that I would like to see liberated less than Lendel is Uhmilthe, and that is because she wants to destroy the world.

[Snarplord XVI]

Originally posted by Hamaon:

Originally posted by Naked Master:

Thoughts.

• I kinda feel bad for poor Lendel, but he will only hurt the Plan in the end. Dissidents, Pyrehearts, Withdrawn and Chastity are out of question, I won't let them go.

What? Why? I would seriously rather liberate Manley over Lendel. Both are Aholes, but Lendel also affected others while Manley is just a rich guy. Also, Manley has a kickass track (the best track in the game I would say). Also, Ti'zo.
The only one that I would like to see liberated less than Lendel is Uhmilthe, and that is because she wants to destroy the world.

Manley states that when he regains his freedom, he'll exploit his position and wealth to send those he dislikes/disagrees with into exile. Lendel was just a corrupt cop.