Ultra Street Fighter IV

Ultra Street Fighter IV

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WickedRequiem 2014 年 12 月 13 日 下午 6:08
Why doesn't anyone use Yun or Cammy at the top level of pro competitions?
Weren't those two characters considered top tier by almost everyone?
I would have thought they'd be more common.


....also, y no luv for Dan?
最後修改者:WickedRequiem; 2014 年 12 月 13 日 下午 6:08
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Thunderbolt-7 2014 年 12 月 13 日 下午 6:30 
top tiers dont always mean beats everything, cammy is good but she is terrible against certain match ups from other characters that show up at tournies, if a cammy player faced off against say snake eyez, I could pretty much guarantee his gief will make cammy cry.
Dude Core 2014 年 12 月 13 日 下午 6:35 
dans the man!
Mr Fantastik @LAN 2014 年 12 月 13 日 下午 6:35 
Dan is p good but not tourney winning good. Plus he's supposed to be a joke, why bother actually playing him?
76561198163312722 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 12:48 
ive been using yun a fair bit and he's awsome. ive had my a$$ handed to me a few times by seth though
Cipher Esteria 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 12:56 
The problem with Cammy is the changes,she isn't annymore a free win.You have to look for which setup you go against which charakter,you have to bypass DWU,the Divekick timing has become a ridicoulis change,you have to learn her from 0 again.

Most Cammy players had a big problem with this and dropped her instand of train.Xiao Hai was considerd the best Cammy on the planet and even he struggeld in Ultra with the changes.

Cammys MU against the cast is mostly 5-5 or better.The only bad MU is Gief and thats about 4.5-5.5 for Gief.This MU is hard but not unwinabel,her HK,MK's can effective zone Gief,her DP can beat his Vortex on you're Wakeup.The bad thing is his U2 kills the DP options.

Yun is not realy often used.You have a charakter which runs automaticly after the first hit,with to many safe specials(finaly his EX Lugepunch get nerfed back),everything runs into the goal to land a red focus.

Even Yun's don't know which side they hit with there Divekicks,on the opponents wakeup.His footsies is terrible,thats another reason why nobody picks him.He has to relai on a special hit or a knockdown to start with his close normals since everything what is far,is bad.

And the last point,he is like Viper a vortex only charakter he works only with vortex.He need safe specials to compensate his terrible neutral game that he can get a knockdown and start with his Vortex.
Heroxoot 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 1:12 
Because Alioune Sensei is MIA and Kbrad gets flustered easily.
M3rcur1us 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 2:03 
Because Evil Ryu is easier to use and has no bad match ups. Also, the majority of top-level players are tier-wh***s (they don't play any character below high tier), so Dan is pretty much forgotten. :(
Heroxoot 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 2:06 
引用自 M3rcur1us
Because Evil Ryu is easier to use and has no bad match ups. Also, the majority of top-level players are tier-wh***s (they don't play any character below high tier), so Dan is pretty much forgotten. :(
Rose, Adon, Bison, Rose are fairly crappy matchups for him. Bison is only bad in lag but that's not matchup specific I guess.

Come Monday ERyu loses 50 HP. Anyone who can get in and do burst damage is going to become bad for him. Check my patch thread.
JELIFISH 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 2:19 
引用自 M3rcur1us
Because Evil Ryu is easier to use and has no bad match ups. Also, the majority of top-level players are tier-wh***s (they don't play any character below high tier), so Dan is pretty much forgotten. :(
Most top-level players are the ones who made their characters good. Who's a great Gen besides Xian? Who's a great Adon besides Gamerbee. Evil Ryu wasn't even considered a good character until Sako came along. Dudley was weak before Smug. More often than not, a character's potential isn't seen until a good player does well with that character. They don't pick characters based on tier because most of their characters weren't even threats until they were in their hands.
M3rcur1us 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 2:27 
引用自 JELIFISH
引用自 M3rcur1us
Because Evil Ryu is easier to use and has no bad match ups. Also, the majority of top-level players are tier-wh***s (they don't play any character below high tier), so Dan is pretty much forgotten. :(
Most top-level players are the ones who made their characters good. Who's a great Gen besides Xian? Who's a great Adon besides Gamerbee. Evil Ryu wasn't even considered a good character until Sako came along. Dudley was weak before Smug. More often than not, a character's potential isn't seen until a good player does well with that character. They don't pick characters based on tier because most of their characters weren't even threats until they were in their hands.
I didn't have said "ALL top-level players are tier-wh***s". Some of them play their favorite character(s) of course.
Cipher Esteria 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 5:45 
引用自 JELIFISH
Most top-level players are the ones who made their characters good. Who's a great Gen besides Xian? Who's a great Adon besides Gamerbee. Evil Ryu wasn't even considered a good character until Sako came along. Dudley was weak before Smug. More often than not, a character's potential isn't seen until a good player does well with that character. They don't pick characters based on tier because most of their characters weren't even threats until they were in their hands.

And nobody sayed Cammy was op until Sako played her.The community has a big problem with there tier-mentality.Some Pro's play realy just there favourite.PR Rog is the best exampel with Balrog.Daigos favourite is Ryu,but Daigo plays everything what is toptier,he played in AE2012 Cammy too,just not at tournaments.

I realy hate tierlist because they kill allmost the fun online,we see waves of E.Ryus,a lot of Yun's these Days,Roses.

Tierlists kill allmost the variation of charakters for online play.AE2012 was full of Akumas.AE was Yun/Yang time in Super was every second Match Bison/Guile and Vanilla Sagat all day long.

But then,there are still these people who pick lowtiers just to show "skill" because high/toptiers doesn't need this.

People should just play there favourite and let the game be the game.I still think FG's would be much better without them,but they exist forever.
Cozmic Chaos 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 7:43 
Yun does not have enough health to be that much of a threat.
majik 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 8:29 
At this level, it's more about the level of the players than their characters. Fighting games are not like your average MOBA game, you can't just change and pick a top tier character overnight and win because they became OP with the last patch. We've even seen Ryu, Elena, Gen, Balrog being played, among others, whereas they are miles away from Yun and Cammy tier-wise.
The only Yun or Cammy players who could have competed with these guys would have been Xiao Hai and Kazunoko, probably a few others too. But none of them qualified.
I don't why Daigo didn't pick Yun into Dhalsim though, againt Xian... he probably thought he could beat him with E.ryu anyway.
M3rcur1us 2014 年 12 月 14 日 上午 8:52 
引用自 Cipher
I realy hate tierlist because they kill allmost the fun online,we see waves of E.Ryus,a lot of Yun's these Days,Roses.

Tierlists kill allmost the variation of charakters for online play.AE2012 was full of Akumas.AE was Yun/Yang time in Super was every second Match Bison/Guile and Vanilla Sagat all day long.
Personally I don't see a lot of Yuns, but Evil Ryu and Rose are effectively overused, especially Evil Ryu.

Here's my list of overused characters for each iteration (based on my online experience from Europe):
  • Vanilla : Ryu, Sagat, Akuma
  • Super : don't know about this iteration because I didn't play it (it wasn't on PC)
  • AE 2011 : the iteration where there was actual character variety online
  • AE 2012 : Ryu, Akuma, Seth and to a lesser extent Cammy and the charge characters
  • Ultra : Evil Ryu, Ryu, charge characters, Rose, Dhalsim, Oni (in short, all the turtle/defensive characters)

引用自 Cipher
But then,there are still these people who pick lowtiers just to show "skill" because high/toptiers doesn't need this.
These people are low-tier heroes (the opposite of tier-wh***s, but just as annoying).

引用自 Cipher
People should just play there favourite and let the game be the game.
Exactly. Sakura is my main character since the vanilla days (and Ibuki my 2nd character since AE).

引用自 Mace
Yun does not have enough health to be that much of a threat.
Also, Yun requires more skill and execution compared to Evil Ryu.
Snacks the sober sea lion 2014 年 12 月 14 日 下午 3:53 
引用自 Mace
Also, Yun requires more skill and execution compared to Evil Ryu.

Definitely not. I've played both and it takes about a day to get Yun's bnb's consistently, while Evil Ryu's are 1-2 frame links without much rhythm. People never would have said this kind of nonsense before Ultra came out and Evil Ryu became overexposed.

And Yun is an all or nothing character. He can combo into almost any special, his divekick is pretty good, good grab game, decent mixups, but his footsies are only okay and his ability to escape from pressure relies on spamming uppercuts or just blocking all day. It's probably too easy to shut him down in an extended set or tournament.
最後修改者:Snacks the sober sea lion; 2014 年 12 月 14 日 下午 3:53
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張貼日期: 2014 年 12 月 13 日 下午 6:08
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