I have reached my limit. I just can't get any better

[Raiden]

Hello fellow Street Fighters.

I think I have reached my skill limit in Street Fighter and I am far from being good.
I have played a lot of Street Fighter over the last years. 200 + hours in Ultra and I played Super and even the first SF4 version. But somehow I haven't improved really that much in the last few years of playing.

I lose most of the online matches I play (I am always around 1000pp, sometimes I reach 1500pp on a good day and on the next day I drop down to 500pp)

I get thrown constantly in my fights (When I react and press throw to counter it, I am too late most of the time)
Many people jump in on me and cross me up when I wake up and I still can't block those.
And I even can rarely link normals. For example something like crouching l.punch into crouching m.punch (depending on the character of course)


I just don't know what to do. I really like this game, but on the other hand it is really frustrating and greatly decreases the fun I have with this game.

[Cipher Esteria]

Hm.Who do you use? Sounds more like characterspecific problemes.

Getting in is very characterspecific sometimes.
Also your problemes can be better solved,when you say who do you play,since all characters have different tools.

[Bruno]

I've hit a plateau aswell. I main Bison, I practice comboes in the training room, but when I get into a fight it's just like I forget everything I practiced, I forget every combo except a few ones that I can't land anyways. I relay mostly on specials and heavy attacks, do the same things over and over again, and get very predictable. Most of the time I just don't know what do to, especially when to jump at the other guy or with which normal to strike back at the other guy.

[KaTst3R]

Originalmente postado por Noatok:

And there many minor things I have problems with, some are for example:
- I have no idea what to do against bison's scissor kick pressure
- I can't do anything against Ibuki throwing knife on me when I wake up
- a lot of trouble getting in someone who is good at zoning
etc.

If you dont know what to do, go to training mode and use the record function to figure ways to counter the tactics you have issues with...

For bison, after you block the scissor kick, they usually will cr.lk again into another scissor kick to maintain pressure. So in order to escape, just back dash to avoid the cr.lk.

For Ibuki, the usual tactic is to hardknock down then jump knife and land behind. So you block front first then block backwards when they land. Sometimes, more advanced players can time it so that the knife hits behind when you wake up, it comes with experience to identify whether the knife will hit front or back. But usual case is hit front. You can also focus on wake up if they time it wrongly. Just go training mode and try a few different options.

[Jackie Daytona]

Originalmente postado por Noatok:

Originalmente postado por Cipher:

Like what? What are you still struggle with?

I am not really sure. Its just like everyone online is already so experinced in this game.

I have a hard time "getting in" on my opponent, they are too good at defending and punishing me.

And there many minor things I have problems with, some are for example:
- I have no idea what to do against bison's scissor kick pressure
- I can't do anything against Ibuki throwing knife on me when I wake up
- a lot of trouble getting in someone who is good at zoning
etc.

Bison's scissor kick is tough. You have to predict it. If you cannot, you are in trouble. To learn to predict, I suggest playing as Bison against the CPU. This will help you recognize when Bison is charging. Once you have a feel for that you can go back to your old character. The key is to wait for Bison to start his scissor kick. When he does, input a move quickly. This move needs to be something that will overpower Bison's move, and has fast start-up. (Like a shoryuken.) If you are at range, the scissor kick will only hit once. In this case, you can absorb it with a focus attack. A bad Bison will have patterns you can exploit. The good ones? Not so much.

Ah! The Ibuki vortex. A total pain. The specific part you mention is explainable. (At the very least.) Defeating it is another matter. You can prevent some Ibuki shenanigans with quick wake-up and delayed wake-up. The kunai (knife) will arrive too early or too late if you change your wake-up timing. (So it will miss.) If you must block the kunai, remember that sometimes she will try to jump over you as the kunai flies at you. In this case, the kunai will hit you IF YOU DO NOT BLOCK IBUKI. That is, you must block as if Ibuki is punching you. In other words, block the wrong way on the kunai. If that was too confusing, this video should help.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUozdQ7SWjo

Difficult zoning can be... difficult. However, it is very character-dependant. Both as zoner and defender. In general, the best thing is to Focus-Attack-Dash-Cancel through one of their projectiles. Although this is bad against characters like Oni or Evil Ryu that can throw multi-hit fireballs. (As it will knock you out of focus.) For them, you need simple old-school tactics. Walk directly at them. Don't block. Wait for the fireball, and jump over it. Alternately, block a few projectiles, then neutral-jump over them at random. Chances are, your opponent will whiff his projectile move and allow you to move-in.

Avoid creating a ranked-battle room. If you do that, there is no way to prevent high-level players from farming you for points, or trolling you into a ragequit. Always search for a similarly skilled opponent. I also suggest using the fight request via arcade or training mode.

If you want ideas, or a chance to learn something from pros... you should watch some live streams. Check-out Evo 2015 on July 17-19. (Live stream on Twitch.) You might be able to catch the Japanese TOPANGA this weekend. You can also check-out Capcom Fighters on YouTube. Most recently they have the CEO 2015 matches for viewing. The match below illustrates much of what I have expressed here in action during high-level play.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4ztEj8nQ5I

[Raiden]

Originalmente postado por Cipher:

Hm.Who do you use? Sounds more like characterspecific problemes.

Getting in is very characterspecific sometimes.
Also your problemes can be better solved,when you say who do you play,since all characters have different tools.

I enjoy playing many different characters. But I would say that I am mainly focusing on Adon as main character and on Cammy as my second character. From time to time I do like using Hugo too. But I am not really planning on becoming a good Hugo player.

In short: Adon and Cammy

Originalmente postado por K a T s t 3 R:

If you dont know what to do, go to training mode and use the record function to figure ways to counter the tactics you have issues with...

For bison, after you block the scissor kick, they usually will cr.lk again into another scissor kick to maintain pressure. So in order to escape, just back dash to avoid the cr.lk.

For Ibuki, the usual tactic is to hardknock down then jump knife and land behind. So you block front first then block backwards when they land. Sometimes, more advanced players can time it so that the knife hits behind when you wake up, it comes with experience to identify whether the knife will hit front or back. But usual case is hit front. You can also focus on wake up if they time it wrongly. Just go training mode and try a few different options.

Thanks for the tips, I will try to use these tactics when facing Bisons and Ibukis.

Originalmente postado por Weisswurst:

Bison's scissor kick is tough. You have to predict it. If you cannot, you are in trouble. To learn to predict, I suggest playing as Bison against the CPU. This will help you recognize when Bison is charging. Once you have a feel for that you can go back to your old character. The key is to wait for Bison to start his scissor kick. When he does, input a move quickly. This move needs to be something that will overpower Bison's move, and has fast start-up. (Like a shoryuken.) If you are at range, the scissor kick will only hit once. In this case, you can absorb it with a focus attack. A bad Bison will have patterns you can exploit. The good ones? Not so much.

Ah! The Ibuki vortex. A total pain. The specific part you mention is explainable. (At the very least.) Defeating it is another matter. You can prevent some Ibuki shenanigans with quick wake-up and delayed wake-up. The kunai (knife) will arrive too early or too late if you change your wake-up timing. (So it will miss.) If you must block the kunai, remember that sometimes she will try to jump over you as the kunai flies at you. In this case, the kunai will hit you IF YOU DO NOT BLOCK IBUKI. That is, you must block as if Ibuki is punching you. In other words, block the wrong way on the kunai. If that was too confusing, this video should help.


Difficult zoning can be... difficult. However, it is very character-dependant. Both as zoner and defender. In general, the best thing is to Focus-Attack-Dash-Cancel through one of their projectiles. Although this is bad against characters like Oni or Evil Ryu that can throw multi-hit fireballs. (As it will knock you out of focus.) For them, you need simple old-school tactics. Walk directly at them. Don't block. Wait for the fireball, and jump over it. Alternately, block a few projectiles, then neutral-jump over them at random. Chances are, your opponent will whiff his projectile move and allow you to move-in.

Thank you for all your advices. I am trying to incooperate them into my playstyle.

It sounds really difficult to me to react to Bison's scissor kick with a counter move.

I sometimes try to Focus-Attack-Dash-Cancel through Fireballs, but most of time they are hitting me with another move before my dash is over, so I can't block it.

Originalmente postado por Weisswurst:

If you want ideas, or a chance to learn something from pros... you should watch some live streams. Check-out Evo 2015 on July 17-19. (Live stream on Twitch.) You might be able to catch the Japanese TOPANGA this weekend. You can also check-out Capcom Fighters on YouTube. Most recently they have the CEO 2015 matches for viewing. The match below illustrates much of what I have expressed here in action during high-level play.

Yes, I know about all the fighting game events. I am watching many of those myself :-) like evo, ceo or recently that south-east asian tournament. It is a lot of fun watching these tournaments, but unfortunately I don't have a feeling that I have learned that much from watching the pros playing so far.

And thanks for the videos.

[Cipher Esteria]

Originalmente postado por Noatok:

In short: Adon and Cammy

I can't help you with Adon,but for Cammy.
Well I can throw you to death with informations.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=415955392

For Bison.
You usualy should just stay cool headed. Bisons do different stuff after the scissor. If the Bison does nothing,he waits for something or tries to bait something out.

For Ibuki.
Basicly is this an easy opponent.Cammy can anti-air Ibuki pretty easy,has better footsies and can vortex her reliable.Just be for every random thing ready Ibuki could do,what is a lot.
Since the most Ibukis I encounter online suck,you can mostly focus dash/backdash out of the Kunai.Just don't get to predictable and mix it up with Delayed Wakeup and sometimes just block.


Zoning,yeah,thats pretty annoying and opponentspecific.
If you have at least 1 Bar,you can react to the majority of fireballs with an Ex Arrow on halfscreen.You can also Ultra most projektils. Poisons H fireballs,Guiles and Gouken Fireball are realy hard to counter,but it's still possible.While Gouken can work at 1/4 range, you have to be nearly point blank for Guile and Poison.
You can abuse Guiles anti-air and his " I want to airthrow" syndrom to counter him.Same for Poison.

Watch some K-Brad for Cammy,he is probably the best right now,since I hear nothing from Alioune I'm sure he is.

[Raiden]

Originalmente postado por Cipher:

Originalmente postado por Noatok:

In short: Adon and Cammy

I can't help you with Adon,but for Cammy.
Well I can throw you to death with informations.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=415955392

For Bison.
You usualy should just stay cool headed. Bisons do different stuff after the scissor. If the Bison does nothing,he waits for something or tries to bait something out.

For Ibuki.
Basicly is this an easy opponent.Cammy can anti-air Ibuki pretty easy,has better footsies and can vortex her reliable.Just be for every random thing ready Ibuki could do,what is a lot.
Since the most Ibukis I encounter online suck,you can mostly focus dash/backdash out of the Kunai.Just don't get to predictable and mix it up with Delayed Wakeup and sometimes just block.


Zoning,yeah,thats pretty annoying and opponentspecific.
If you have at least 1 Bar,you can react to the majority of fireballs with an Ex Arrow on halfscreen.You can also Ultra most projektils. Poisons H fireballs,Guiles and Gouken Fireball are realy hard to counter,but it's still possible.While Gouken can work at 1/4 range, you have to be nearly point blank for Guile and Poison.
You can abuse Guiles anti-air and his " I want to airthrow" syndrom to counter him.Same for Poison.

Watch some K-Brad for Cammy,he is probably the best right now,since I hear nothing from Alioune I'm sure he is.

Thanks a lot for the guide and all the information :-)
That is a lot to read. It will take some time until I read through the whole guide.

But still ... knowing everything in theory and being good at an actual match are two quite different things.

Can anyone help me with Adon?

[Unknown]

Watching replays could help out! i learned a lot like that, try different ways to play, learn from others, practice makes perfect, if you just can't, well Street Fighter is not for you then.

[Jackie Daytona]

Originalmente postado por Noatok:

It sounds really difficult to me to react to Bison's scissor kick with a counter move.

I sometimes try to Focus-Attack-Dash-Cancel through Fireballs, but most of time they are hitting me with another move before my dash is over, so I can't block it.

Yes, I know about all the fighting game events. I am watching many of those myself :-) like evo, ceo or recently that south-east asian tournament. It is a lot of fun watching these tournaments, but unfortunately I don't have a feeling that I have learned that much from watching the pros playing so far.

And thanks for the videos.

That CEO match I linked shows the difficulty of defending against the scissor kick. Even a sponsored player at a tournament can get completely owned by it. So never be upset if Bison spams you to death with scissors.

You'll want to try to FADC fireballs at medium or long range. Stay out of range of the opponent's punches/kicks. The ideal is to get them throwing continuous fireballs. (By blocking a lot of them.) FADC through one. Jump the next, and attack. If you are trying to be defensive, you should try to back-dash, instead of forward-dash on the FADC. Your FADC should be quick too. If it isn't one smooth motion, you need to practice it.

There are many ways to learn from pros:
1) Try It
See something new? Go to training mode and try to replicate it.

2) Examples in Motion
Even if you know what to do, you might not be able to do it. Seeing something done well can often help you learn to do it too.

3) A Better Way
Sometimes you know how to do something, but not quite how to implement it. Watching high-level play can show you the best way.

Overall, you want to look for small improvements you can make to yourself to play better. The key is to find just one thing they do. One thing you might be able to do. One change you can make. If nothing else, you might find an option you never knew about.

Also, learning from watching gameplay requires active thought. Normally, most people watch videos/movies/television passively. They just let the entertainment come to them. With fighting game videos you need to always be thinking. Watch the replay as intently as you would play an online match. It is also important to note that as your knowledge and comprehension of the game increases, so does the value of watching high-level matches.

Watching USF4 gameplay is very similar to watching sports like football. To the uninitiated, it's just a bunch of sweaty guys running back and forth. To a fan, it's a big pile of rules and statistics. To a pro, it's a guide to an enemy's demise. Don't look for a miracle solution in pros. Just look for some small way to improve.

You definitely need to look up K-Brad tutorial videos if you like Cammy. (These aren't Cammy-specific.) Here's a couple:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBrgopIooQ8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPuXo-nDx40

I have no advice on Adon. All I know is what I've seen from people playing against me. It seems that spacing is very important to his gameplay. Many times he needs to predict his opponent's action. When he isn't doing that, he's trying some difficult set-up. Adon players almost always end combos by knocking me away or to the ground. They tend to be good at wake-up options and baiting.

[majik]

There are also some moves that can stuff scissor kicks, usually standing jab on reaction. Sako loves to do this, especially with Gen or E.ryu, I think you can still find some videos of him doing that on Youtube. Can be tricky to land but if you get the timing for it, it can get to your opponent Bison's head quickly.
Otherwise, like it's been said, you'll have to try to reversal at some point, neutral jump can work sometimes, or even red focus if you really want to get out (to avoid a stun for example).

If you think you have decent fundamentals but can't improve anymore, imo you should try to learn some "advanced" things, one at a time. Like "ok today I'm gonna learn one safe jump setup after a throw", or could be an option-select, an FADC combo or a counter-hit setup, or maybe plinking, etc. It might look intimidating at first, but it's really not that hard, and with time all of this complicated stuff will become second nature.

Also working on your execution is important. You can do that in practice mode of course, but also by trying out other characters, which will teach you new mechanics (or even trying out other fighting games), or completing new trials everyday (my execution improved drastically after I completed all of those).

[Raiden]

Thanks a lot guys for all the information you are giving me here.
I really appreciate your help

[Mark-James]

I have over 2000 hours from PC PS3 combined and I can't even beat 500pp players, I'm trash