How to deal with graplers?

[Waffle]

First of all I'm new to USFIV and fighting game in general. This is not the first fighting game I've ever played but it's the first game were I'm putting effort in order to improve and learn all it has to offer.

Right now I'm playing lots of arcade mode to get used to my character and the mechanics of the game. While I can deal with most characters I encounter, I'm having huge problems every time I fight against a grapler, specially Hugo and T. Hawk. Whenever I get close to them, no matter what kind of attack I do it will always be nullified by one of their command grabs. Sometimes I knock them dow and they wake up with a command grab leaving me with no means to counter it.

It feels really frustrating to fight them. I have some luck using shoto charcters like Ryu or Sakura but I'm totally hopeless with other charcters I enjoy playing such as Ibuki or Makoto.

[Beastlierduke]

Im not completely sure but possibly footsies, I have the same problem to me it seems like keeping distance and attacking at range seems to work somewhat.

[majik]

The IA is very good at command throwing you out of every single thing you do. You can avoid that (and abuse it in the process) by using true blockstrings (a series of attacks that is positive on block, can be different things depending on your character, usually several crounching jabs for most of them, or even a complete combo that is safe on block, like Ryu cr.mk into hadouken).
You can then easily bait the command throw by backdashing or neutral jumping.
After a jump-in attack, try to do 2 crouching jabs, then neutral jump. If you're against an AI Zangief or almost any other grapplers, you'll bait out a throw and you'll get a full punish, works almost everytime.
Obviously if they're waking up, it's usually a bad idea to try any meaty attacks up close. Instead just fall back and zone them out.
Command throws also only work if you're grounded (unless it's an anti-air throw of course), so if you use an airborne attack, you'll beat the throw. With Sakura for example, when you get a knock-down, try walking close and throw a light tatsu on their wake-up. Most of the time the AI will try to throw and you'll get a full punish.

[n00bdragon]

Characters like Ibuki and Makoto which rely on confusing the opponent or performing ambiguous actions have a really hard time against the AI. The AI is not a person. It doesn't think about what you are about to do next or move the stick around, it just does things. You can't cross it up or sneak in a low hit when they least expect it. The computer either blocks appropriately or simply lets you hit it because "fairness".

This can make dealing with AIs that have command grabs or DPs (shoryuken and the like) very difficult to deal with if you are all about creating pressure with small unpredictable gaps.

For AI grapplers try jumping when you predict the command grab. Ibuki can zone them out with her kunai and get a lot of full screen neckbreakers when they do something random at that distance. Makoto can use your sweeps with near impunity (the AI will never punish appropriately) and any attack that's safe on block followed by a backdash to safety.

[Waffle]

Thanks for the help to all of you!

[Detestable Geohound]

I've played a lot of SFIV AE (had it for PS3) and after migrating here it seems that AI wise, the best bet if you're playing Ibuki is to out-zone them. You have a Kunai, use it while jumping backwards if your opponent can't use an anti-air command grab on you. The AI will get hit pretty frequently with it. As long as you make the AI have to come to you, you can strike when it makes a mistake with anything that ends with you being safe.

You can try pokes as well but I find that command grabs are complete ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ and will literally move your characters hitbox into theirs for their command grabs to work in some cases (had this happen on the PS3 non-ultra edition in a local game with my friend and we both couldn't understand why it happened). It must be one of those "Ah I touched the very edge of your hitbox, it counts! Let me just scoot you a bit this way so it looks right" things.

I personally don't find the grapplers in this game very balanced at all; they seem to have a counter for literally everything; making characters like Ibuki completely useless. The only real chance one has in out-maneuvering a grappler (Player) is having a character that can use zoning to their advantage (Hadokens + Shoryukens). On the one end, they sort of need that advantage to be useful at all (if command grabs were to easy to shake off, they'd be useless), on the other it reduces the game speed to a crawl as it forces the other player to play extremely defensively; which some characters aren't as good at doing by nature.

I hope Capcom tries to change it up a bit for Street Fighter V (but then again, if it doesn't have Ibuki it won't matter for me since she's the only one I can seem to play).

[Shegz]

What I actually do, is to bait the command throw.

When I see that my opponent grapples alot, either I interrupt thier setup (an attack string that leads to the command throw), or on knock down, move close to him, throw out a few light punches, then on his wake up, DASH BACK. Very reliable. Works very well.

The only way he can react to that is to do another special to catch you on your back-dash. If you can predict that, give him a MEATY attack. What is a meaty attack? - Let me explain: A meaty attack is an attack you do on your opponent's wake-up to stop him during his reversal attack (IF he tries one). For example, Ryu's cr.mk* and my fav. Oni's standing back-mp*. There are many more that I cant quite remember rn but yeah...

The only down side to it is that, If he does an EX special as his reversal... errr... You're on you own m8 :D

Although you can answer with an EX special of your own like Seth's EX dp* (strongest thing in the entire ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game) or Ryu's as well. Seth's just has more invincible frames.

If he blocks, grab his ass.

So you see, its a gamble on his wake-up. But what is important, is to get the knock-down. Knock-downs are very essential. If you watch pro matches, sometimes they go for more knock-downs than Max-damage combos. Why? - Because It lets them get into thier opponents' head for more setups, pressure, stun (on the long run), gimmicks, and sometimes unblockables (yes... unblockables).

Lastly know the Match-up. Knowing the matchup, equals knowing which block strings are true and which have gaps inbetween, giving you a chance for that Juicy dp*.

If I'm to summarize all what I've just said in a word, FOOTSIES. I believe good situational footsies can out-smart anyone (Grapplers not being an exception).

Hope I was able to help.

[ dp* - Dragon Punch | cr.mk* - Crouch medium-kick | mp* - medium punch ]

[Waffle]

While I apreciate all the help it seems like I can't do any progress at all.
I'm trying to fight T. Hawk but no matter what I do he always couters me with a command grab.
If I do a back dash he grabs me, if I try to connect my ultra combo he grabs me right when the animation starts. The only thing that sort of works for me right now is zoning him with kunai if I use Ibuki but he kicks my ass the rest of the time.

This feels so unfair compared to literally any other type of character in the rest of the game.

[Waffle]

Originally posted by Enrico Pallazzo:

Originally posted by Kuroneko:

While I apreciate all the help it seems like I can't do any progress at all.
I'm trying to fight T. Hawk but no matter what I do he always couters me with a command grab.
If I do a back dash he grabs me, if I try to connect my ultra combo he grabs me right when the animation starts. The only thing that sort of works for me right now is zoning him with kunai if I use Ibuki but he kicks my ass the rest of the time.

This feels so unfair compared to literally any other type of character in the rest of the game.

He shouldn't be able to grab you while back dashing... anyway, yeah, grappelers were my furst trouble too, pretty much stay away, try to poke them, so they can't get close to you.
Don't worry you'll learn to deal with it.

At my like 20th attempt I managed to beat him by jumping in, doing a 3 hit combo (pretty easy thanks to Ibuki's chains) and then jumping back. I repeated the process until I won, it feels like a super cheap victory but at least it's something lol

[Shegz]

Originally posted by Enrico Pallazzo:

Originally posted by Kuroneko:

While I apreciate all the help it seems like I can't do any progress at all.
I'm trying to fight T. Hawk but no matter what I do he always couters me with a command grab.
If I do a back dash he grabs me, if I try to connect my ultra combo he grabs me right when the animation starts. The only thing that sort of works for me right now is zoning him with kunai if I use Ibuki but he kicks my ass the rest of the time.

This feels so unfair compared to literally any other type of character in the rest of the game.

He shouldn't be able to grab you while back dashing... anyway, yeah, grappelers were my furst trouble too, pretty much stay away, try to poke them, so they can't get close to you.
Don't worry you'll learn to deal with it.

You forgot the 8-bit glasses :p

[Shegz]

Originally posted by Kuroneko:

Originally posted by Enrico Pallazzo:

He shouldn't be able to grab you while back dashing... anyway, yeah, grappelers were my furst trouble too, pretty much stay away, try to poke them, so they can't get close to you.
Don't worry you'll learn to deal with it.

At my like 20th attempt I managed to beat him by jumping in, doing a 3 hit combo (pretty easy thanks to Ibuki's chains) and then jumping back. I repeated the process until I won, it feels like a super cheap victory but at least it's something lol

You see?! - Already better. Thank you forums :D