Smooth hatch.....what about?

[Wish Granter]

So I was told again smooth hatches changed?

I remember farming them but they only output 50% of the metal they consume, making theire farming effort worthless, as the work to breed and kill them and feed them is a TON higher then using a rock crusher, and way inefficient when using a metal refinery, which, by far, isnt hard to setup anymore. With a bit of ceramic, and needed anyway for steel.

Do they output more then 50%?
Like, when they happy? My main problem is that they have no off switch. You cant just stop feeding them when you dont need metal, like a refinery.

Kinda mixed feelings about farming them.

Ps, the rock crusher also puts out sand. Worthless to some, but on this weird full of literal s+it planet its worth gold to avoid +30 gramm oxygen usage + animations that slim down worktime.

[Evilsod]

Pretty sure it's always been 75% consumed mass for Smooth Hatches.
But they're still considered to be pretty weak afaik. A great alternative to moving into Metal Refining early to produce larger amounts of refined metals, but since you need it eventually for Steel, they become obsolete after a point.

[Wish Granter]

Originally posted by Evilsod:

Pretty sure it's always been 75% consumed mass for Smooth Hatches.
But they're still considered to be pretty weak afaik. A great alternative to moving into Metal Refining early to produce larger amounts of refined metals, but since you need it eventually for Steel, they become obsolete after a point.

what I thought. not to forget that smooth hatches dont have a off switch. Once they there, they need metal constantly or they die. Work efficiency? 500 times higher, you need a stable, 2 workers, a hauler, or sweep system and killing them without using most unethical drwoning methods is near impossible without multiple sick bays.

[cswiger]

Of course Smooth Hatches have an off switch: stop feeding them. It takes something like 5 or 10 cycles before they actually die from no food. Even then, you could keep one or two eggs around for later if you want to start using them again.

I have no idea why you would try to kill Smooth Hatches using dupes.
Again, starvation works fine for that.

Once you can build a Refinery using high-temp coolant like petrol and cool it via a Steam Turbine, the Refinery is more efficient. But Smooth Hatches are fine for the earlier stages of the game before you can build such ideal systems or have a solid power grid.

[POWER WITHIN USER]

Refining metals takes a lot of power and produces a lot of heat (except for gold), feeding SOME smooth hatches copper/cobalt ore before you get to oil+fiber isn't that bad.
When you get to steam turbines, petroleum and 26 machinery duplicants working under a light, let the smooth hatches starve or send a couple eggs to another asteroid.

[Dracuras]

Originally posted by Wish Granter:

what I thought. not to forget that smooth hatches dont have a off switch. Once they there, they need metal constantly or they die. Work efficiency? 500 times higher, you need a stable, 2 workers, a hauler, or sweep system and killing them without using most unethical drwoning methods is near impossible without multiple sick bays.

don't need sick bays to kill stone or smooth hatches, just time. Wrangle them first so they're restrained, then kill them.

[Wish Granter]

Originally posted by cswiger:

Of course Smooth Hatches have an off switch: stop feeding them. It takes something like 5 or 10 cycles before they actually die from no food. Even then, you could keep one or two eggs around for later if you want to start using them again.

I have no idea why you would try to kill Smooth Hatches using dupes.
Again, starvation works fine for that.

Once you can build a Refinery using high-temp coolant like petrol and cool it via a Steam Turbine, the Refinery is more efficient. But Smooth Hatches are fine for the earlier stages of the game before you can build such ideal systems or have a solid power grid.

All I do is slap a refinery down, pump water in it, build it from ceramic, pipes from ceramic, and pump piss in it.
And it works over 20-30 cycles in full production before reaching overheating.
I deconstruct it, rebuild it.


I dont understand what people see so unbelievable complicated with it.
You build it, you use it.
Just use it somewhere you dont really care about heat, like, not in the middle of the base.
In my 1800 hours of ONI and lots of colonies I have not once even attempted to cool the refinery, same with the glass one. Even if the pipe breaks, who cares, a bit of water loss, the glass f.e just falls out on 100% material.

For me having alot of animals squirming around deleting resources as they dont give back all, instead of one guy in a atmo suit standing 10 secs to produce 100kg 100% efficient metal, idk.
Maiby I just got lucky and never had heat problems with it.

[Wish Granter]

Originally posted by POWER WITHIN USER:

Refining metals takes a lot of power and produces a lot of heat (except for gold), feeding SOME smooth hatches copper/cobalt ore before you get to oil+fiber isn't that bad.
When you get to steam turbines, petroleum and 26 machinery duplicants working under a light, let the smooth hatches starve or send a couple eggs to another asteroid.

hmm, I guess you can just throw some eggs in the wild and they will still reproduce smooth ones due to shire chance.

Steam turbines I keep f.ing up. Tried to build some in oil biome but yeah, that went backwards. I dont like those ultra super, in my opinion denying all physical laws cheese systems like liquid hydrogen, so I gotte find a steam turbine system I like.
Thats why I am so happy they gave us the rad engine.
I still hope they somewhen release like a supercooler machine using Nuclear power, and idk, 5000 Watts as long as it runs and 2500 idle to keep the hydrogen fluid.

Some systems just seem to cheesy or out of this universe but the game is still wonderful.

[Wish Granter]

Originally posted by Dracuras:

Originally posted by Wish Granter:

what I thought. not to forget that smooth hatches dont have a off switch. Once they there, they need metal constantly or they die. Work efficiency? 500 times higher, you need a stable, 2 workers, a hauler, or sweep system and killing them without using most unethical drwoning methods is near impossible without multiple sick bays.

don't need sick bays to kill stone or smooth hatches, just time. Wrangle them first so they're restrained, then kill them.

all that violence and active work (I need to click wrangle, watch, click kill, for every single one, there isnt a automation sensor saying to kill new ones).
Those poor little things.....cuties. You cant kill them :(.

Eat theire eggs. There we go. Ethical discussions, are new eggs living creatures? We will never know.

[cswiger]

750 kg of ore becomes 625 kg of metal plus one hatch egg over five cycles, per Smooth Hatch. If you cannot cool your base yet-- or choose not to, whatever-- this process has advantages because it does not generate heat nor does it require 1200 W of power.

The time for a Metal Refinery to run is 40 seconds per 100 kg. So it processes 6.5 tons of ore over 5 cycles, which is almost exactly the same amount of metal ore a ranch full of 8 hatches can process.

If you use the Metal Refinery coolant to drive a Steam Turbine, it can greatly offset the power draw, or even become power-positive for some metals like Steel which create a lot of extra heat while being refined. This is not complicated to do, but does require crude oil and plastic.

[Wish Granter]

Originally posted by cswiger:

750 kg of ore becomes 625 kg of metal plus one hatch egg over five cycles, per Smooth Hatch. If you cannot cool your base yet-- or choose not to, whatever-- this process has advantages because it does not generate heat nor does it require 1200 W of power.

The time for a Metal Refinery to run is 40 seconds per 100 kg. So it processes 6.5 tons of ore over 5 cycles, which is almost exactly the same amount of metal ore a ranch full of 8 hatches can process.

If you use the Metal Refinery coolant to drive a Steam Turbine, it can greatly offset the power draw, or even become power-positive for some metals like Steel which create a lot of extra heat while being refined. This is not complicated to do, but does require crude oil and plastic.

40 seconds really? I always thought its faster. Is that the level 0 Skill? I felt my level 8 or 10 Operators in light are way faster then 20 seconds, almost dropping metal out of that thing like hot potatos.

[gimmethegepgun]

Originally posted by Dracuras:

don't need sick bays to kill stone or smooth hatches, just time. Wrangle them first so they're restrained, then kill them.

Don't need that, either. You can take a page out of the Pokeshell book and access the ranch from above with a ladder bridge and just shoot them from there where they can't reach you.

[kampfer91]

People do smooth hatches because they produce no heat nor eat electricity .
Sure you can slap a primitive refinery with water running through ceramic , but you need a lot electricity and you still generate heat , a lot .
It is a slow way to get early refined metal though , better than using stone crusher for sure , meat is a bonus .

[cswiger]

Originally posted by Wish Granter:

40 seconds really? I always thought its faster. Is that the level 0 Skill? I felt my level 8 or 10 Operators in light are way faster then 20 seconds, almost dropping metal out of that thing like hot potatos.

40 seconds really is the base speed.

Sure, a dupe with high level operation skill / morale bonuses might run the refinery twice as fast. But even then they'll get limited by reloading the refinery with ore and coolant. 400 kg of coolant still takes 40 seconds to pipe in, assuming you can cool it down that quickly.

[Angpaur]

Originally posted by Wish Granter:

I dont like those ultra super, in my opinion denying all physical laws cheese systems like liquid hydrogen.

What is so wrong with liquid hydrogen?

[glass zebra]

Smooth hatches are not a late game integral part, but can be a heat and energy cheap way early game to get refined metal + heat. If you build your ranches efficiently, it's a less work for unskilled dupes. You also get some egg shell and meat.

Since they do not eat meat, you can also just let them starve and pick up the meat after, if you want to avoid drowning. They have a ton of hp, so killing them manually uses quite a bit of time.

You can check up guides for heat and steam turbine or steam discussion threads, since heat and the steam turbines come up in every other thread. Not sure what is so law defying about liquid hydrogen or steam turbines, except the used numbers. Both things are used in real life, though since helium does not exist ingame, we used liquid hydrogen or super coolant for cooling.