Oxygen Vs dirty oxygen weight?

[Torroc]

Ok... So, this is something that confuses me... is this like smog vs pure oxygen, and if so then why is pure oxygen havier then the smog IE dirty oxygen

[SKull]

No, the weight is the same.

[Errapel]

Are we talking real life or in game? In the game pure oxygen seems to be lighter than polluted oxygen (https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1471387929&searchtext=gas). I'm assuming the explanation is 'Because polluted oxygen has more stuff in it' (real technical details here!)

[SKull]

Nah. it never sinks if it forms a band with clean oxygen on either side. It's just that it usually comes from below; surfaces of PH2O, mined slime, etc.

[Torroc]

Thats the problem, Polluted oxygen will rest ontop of pure oxygen.

[MaebeKnot]

Originally posted by Torroc:

Thats the problem, Polluted oxygen will rest ontop of pure oxygen.

Weight doesn't matter. Density does. Things don't float on water because they weigh less then water. They float because their density is less then water. The same applies to how gases divide. Since PO2 and O2 have the same density they don't naturally divide/separate.

[Torroc]

Not quite, If we want to get in to the nitty girtty here. when we get in to chemistry and physics, molecular mass of the gas, is something that is not being taken in to affect here, Because polluted oxygen has to have something else inside of it with, causes it to be considered polluted oxygen. What this means is the Molecular mass would be different from then that of pure oxygen, It may not be a lot heavier, BUT It would be enough that pure oxygen would be floating ontop of the polluted oxygen with is haveing something clinging to it at the atomic or the molecular level changing its molecular mass and thus the Density of the gas

[MaebeKnot]

Originally posted by Torroc:

Not quite, If we want to get in to the nitty girtty here. when we get in to chemistry and physics, molecular mass of the gas, is something that is not being taken in to affect here, Because polluted oxygen has to have something else inside of it with, causes it to be considered polluted oxygen. What this means is the Molecular mass would be different from then that of pure oxygen, It may not be a lot heavier, BUT It would be enough that pure oxygen would be floating ontop of the polluted oxygen with is haveing something clinging to it at the atomic or the molecular level changing its molecular mass and thus the Density of the gas

While true we can simplify our equation significantly by just worrying about the natural density of the gas instead of pulling in thermodynamics and the shifting of particles. KISS or no ones computer will be able to run this game.

I agree polluted oxygen would be heavier and be a mixture with something else in there. Yet gases in ONI are always pure gases. The programmers have set polluted oxygen to the same density in game as oxygen. This causes pockets of polluted oxygen to free float around in oxygen. I find it annoying but I believe they did this for balance/design reasons. Maybe because it would be really easy to put deodorizers below the oxygen line. Which would honestly be really nice.

[AlexMBrennan]

Since PO2 and O2 have the same density they don't naturally divide/separate.

All gases have the same density in the game - take 50kg each of any two gases, put them in a 10x10 room, and observe that both gases take up the exact same space which would not be possible if they had different densities (e.g. helium balloons float but CO2 balloons don't because 1kg of helium displaces more air than 1kg of CO2)

So obviously it's not density that determines the behaviour of gases in this fictitious physics game, so trying to make sense of it is kinda pointless - just copy the best exploits from Youtube and win the game or whatever.

[MaebeKnot]

Originally posted by AlexMBrennan:

Since PO2 and O2 have the same density they don't naturally divide/separate.

All gases have the same density in the game - take 50kg each of any two gases, put them in a 10x10 room, and observe that both gases take up the exact same space which would not be possible if they had different densities (e.g. helium balloons float but CO2 balloons don't because 1kg of helium displaces more air than 1kg of CO2)

So obviously it's not density that determines the behaviour of gases in this fictitious physics game, so trying to make sense of it is kinda pointless - just copy the best exploits from Youtube and win the game or whatever.

You are fake news.

https://oxygennotincluded.gamepedia.com/Gas

[Strygald]

Originally posted by MaebeKnot:

Originally posted by AlexMBrennan:

All gases have the same density in the game - take 50kg each of any two gases, put them in a 10x10 room, and observe that both gases take up the exact same space which would not be possible if they had different densities (e.g. helium balloons float but CO2 balloons don't because 1kg of helium displaces more air than 1kg of CO2)

So obviously it's not density that determines the behaviour of gases in this fictitious physics game, so trying to make sense of it is kinda pointless - just copy the best exploits from Youtube and win the game or whatever.

You are fake news.

https://oxygennotincluded.gamepedia.com/Gas

I was curious so I did a quick little test


https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1749373213

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1749373242

turns out there is no density in the game, I couldn't even find any references or stats regarding density within the game. Whoever created that wiki page probably thought it a good idea to add interesting but irrelevant information. I always take that info on that website with a grain of salt.

One other interesting thing I found was that both the hydrogen and carbon dioxide, for some unknown reason, was compressing more to the left side(see screenshots).

edit: it seems gasses like hydrogen, oxygen and carbon dioxide behave like ideal gas and take up the same molar volume... not an expert on the subject, but seems like ONI's gas model works well enough.

[MaebeKnot]

@Strygald - just because it's not listed in game doesn't mean it's not on the back end. How do you think they calculated what gas rises and what gas falls? I'm 100% Klei is smart enough to use math to figure this out instead of an if statement that would say H goes above O2 etc. If you think you know a better way for the game to sort, raise and lower gases I would love to hear it. Hell I would love to hear any other way this can be done that I didn't already cite.

I can't say I've ever seen that wiki page have inaccurate information and it's been around for nearly two years. Just because destiny doesn't control how much space a gas takes doesn't mean it is not in game. Pretty much ever physics simulation in the game is simplified way. Hell we don't even have 3D physics. We don't have real energy conversation. We don't have friction. I could go on.

This variable is absolutely a must have in game so modders and the developer can add additional gases into the game. Just because it doesn't work 100% like real life doesn't mean it's not part of the game.

Quote below directly from the wiki page on how this works. Everything the wiki page and I'm saying about is shown and evident in game. Prove me wrong and do it without a straw-man please. Or accept it as fact. Those are your choices.

"Elements with a lower density tends to rise above others. In the case of gases with the same density (e.g. Oxygen and Polluted Oxygen) they tend to stay on the same layer and move horizontally if there is no gas flow."