Aside from bankruptcy, is there any sort of failure state in this game?

[Thysios]

Unless your a brand new player, making money is pretty easy and aside from my first few games, the threat of bankruptcy has been non-exiostant.

Originally I thought the campaign levels had a time limit similar to the original RCT games but on a closer look it seems those time limits are only for the optional objectives. None of the primary objectives (from what I've played so far) have had time limits.

This was my biggest complaint in Planet Coaster as it means there's no challenge. There's no real threat of losing and you can just plod along at your own pace and you'll eventually win.

I guess I'm not expecting this to change at this point, it's just a huge disappointment as everything else was starting to look pretty good. Especially after playing Planet Coaster...

[Aldehydra]

You can't fail to achieve the main objectives of a scenario (aside from going bankrupt), but the optional challenge objectives all have deadlines. And as far as I can tell, the challenge objectives aren't just for bragging rights and achievements, but change how you can progress through the campaign (though it's not really obvious until later on).

But yeah, the challenge deadlines are all a bit overly generous. I think they'd feel a bit more challenging if the time you get was reduced by 30-50%.

[Thysios]

Damn, i guess that's better than nothing but it's still a bit disappointing.

Thanks for the reply.

[Sebioff]

The first 4-5 levels are supposed to be easy. It will get harder the further you progress.

[Thysios]

Publicado originalmente por Sebioff:

The first 4-5 levels are supposed to be easy. It will get harder the further you progress.

How though? If there is no failure state there is no challenge. The difficult in the old RCT games came from completing the objectives within the time limit. Without the time limit you can do what ever you want and just finish the goals at your own pleasure.

[Sebioff]

Bankruptcy is a failure state, and so are the time goals. We only removed the punishment from the time goals by making them optional, to not force you to replay the same thing over and over again if you don't want to. It makes them less punishing, not less challenging.
Even if you ignore the time goals though and only go for level completion I think you should feel challenged by the campaign. At least I am, and I know the game inside out :)

[Aldehydra]

Publicado originalmente por Sebioff:

Even if you ignore the time goals though and only go for level completion I think you should feel challenged by the campaign.

It does take a while before the more interesting objectives show up, though. Early on it's mostly just having X guest and Y in some rating. It's not until HappyCo Harbor that goals like "have 3 rollercoasters with an excitement rating over 50" and requirements for high decoration ratings show up, followed by Honey Hills that requires you to make at least $2000 per month.

[Thysios]

I just don't see how that's challenging if you don't have a time limit tbh. I'll try play more and see how it goes, but tbh it started getting boring as soon as I realised I couldn't actually lose.

It doesn't matter how hard the goals are if you can just take your time and complete them when ever you feel like.

I'm aware bankruptcy is there as a failure state, but money hasn't been an issue for me since my first hour of playing.

[Romans]

I dont like time limits. I'd rather the guests be more picky, more vandals or whatever, just not time limits...

That said, the game does feel pretty easy so far. I will also play more, but I hope to see some addtional challenges or "fail states" added - other than time limits and backruptcy.

[JonnyKnows]

Publicado originalmente por Thysios:

I just don't see how that's challenging if you don't have a time limit tbh. I'll try play more and see how it goes, but tbh it started getting boring as soon as I realised I couldn't actually lose.

It doesn't matter how hard the goals are if you can just take your time and complete them when ever you feel like.

I'm aware bankruptcy is there as a failure state, but money hasn't been an issue for me since my first hour of playing.

Well I mean, you're not wanting to take on the time goals, which pretty much dictates the challenge. So unless you're satisfied with non gold finishes in the campaign I don't see too much of an issue here.

Maybe it's not specifcally a fail state, but I mean, implementing what you want into campaign would just be adding difficulty settings and making the time limit a real fail state instead of just a marker on the campaign map.

It's really not that big of a deal. I mean, not getting the gold finish is sort of a reminder of how you haven't completed all the challenges anyways.

[Thysios]

I was thinking about that today. I think a difficulty selector would be good.

The current game could be easy, normal would make the optional objectives mandatory and they could even add new goals for a hard mode.

[McFuzz]

I think OP wants meteors to hit your park and for that to be the failure state!

[Aldehydra]

Publicado originalmente por JonnyKnows:

Maybe it's not specifcally a fail state, but I mean, implementing what you want into campaign would just be adding difficulty settings and making the time limit a real fail state instead of just a marker on the campaign map.

I think the main issue isn't that the challenge objectives are optional, but that most of them aren't challenging at all if you've been playing for a while. A proper "hard" setting with much less starting cash and a requirement that all loans are paid off would be nice. I know that some of the later scenarios are like that, but the first ten or so aren't much of a challenge. On some maps you start with enough cash to build a park that can complete all the objectives on its own, and you can just pause the game, build, and then press play and walk away.

Something for the future, perhaps. But simply reducing starting cash to always be $10-15k with a "no loans" requirement on every map would make a big difference. The starting conditions for the Kaiserberg scenario are pretty much what I want in every scenario.

[Thysios]

Publicado originalmente por Frank McFuzz:

I think OP wants meteors to hit your park and for that to be the failure state!

I just want a failure state that actually makes the game a challenge. It's the problem I've had with pretty much every theme park game I've played since RCT 3. It's the same problem I had with Planet Coaster, it takes no skill to win becaues you can't fail.

This game at has the bankruptcy mechanic at least, but after playing more than an hour and learning how things work, money isn't an issue. But otherwise, the problem isn't if you win, it's when you win. Because you'll eventually win no matter what you do, it'll just take longer if you're bad.

[Thysios]

Publicado originalmente por Aldehydra:

I think the main issue isn't that the challenge objectives are optional, but that most of them aren't challenging at all if you've been playing for a while. A proper "hard" setting with much less starting cash and a requirement that all loans are paid off would be nice. I know that some of the later scenarios are like that, but the first ten or so aren't much of a challenge. On some maps you start with enough cash to build a park that can complete all the objectives on its own, and you can just pause the game, build, and then press play and walk away.

Something for the future, perhaps. But simply reducing starting cash to always be $10-15k with a "no loans" requirement on every map would make a big difference. The starting conditions for the Kaiserberg scenario are pretty much what I want in every scenario.

I was thinking about the 'no loans' as a requirement as well today. Except I was thinking you should start with a loan as well.

So instead of starting with $20,000 with no loans. You start with a $20,000 loan that you have to have paid off (or what ever amount of money they decide to go with) Combined with an actual time limit, this could actually be a difficult level.

I also thought about what if they removed the pause game option. Being able to build while paused means, as you said, you can just pause, build you're entire park, press play and win soon after.

If you had a time limit and you couldn't pause (or at least build while paused) it would mean you can't ♥♥♥♥ around too much because the finish line will always be approaching.

Publicado originalmente por Thysios:

Publicado originalmente por Frank McFuzz:

I think OP wants meteors to hit your park and for that to be the failure state!

I just want a failure state that actually makes the game a challenge. It's the problem I've had with pretty much every theme park game I've played since RCT 3. It's the same problem I had with Planet Coaster, it takes no skill to win becaues you can't fail.

This game at has the bankruptcy mechanic at least, but after playing more than an hour and learning how things work, money isn't an issue. But otherwise, the problem isn't if you win, it's when you win. Because you'll eventually win no matter what you do, it'll just take longer if you're bad.

[Phade]

Publicado originalmente por Thysios:

Publicado originalmente por Frank McFuzz:

I think OP wants meteors to hit your park and for that to be the failure state!

I just want a failure state that actually makes the game a challenge. It's the problem I've had with pretty much every theme park game I've played since RCT 3. It's the same problem I had with Planet Coaster, it takes no skill to win becaues you can't fail.

This game at has the bankruptcy mechanic at least, but after playing more than an hour and learning how things work, money isn't an issue. But otherwise, the problem isn't if you win, it's when you win. Because you'll eventually win no matter what you do, it'll just take longer if you're bad.

Well think about it irl. the only thing that would shut down a theme park would be poor sales. if there isnt enough interest in it, they'd lose money and it wouldn't be sustainable.