Requested Bug Report: Coaster Values Not Updating Realtime

[Solodric]

Basically, while building a coaster, if I activate something like 'Air-Time' visualization, the actual air-time of any given component of my coaster won't ever update until/unless I exit that view and re-enter it, even if I sit back and let the ghost-train run its full course. I did a little testing and this may be related to another bug, whereby when I shut a ride down and edit it, it instantly wipes all visualizer data - I have to wait for the ghost train to run over a given piece of track, then turn on the visualizer to see what that piece is doing at a given moment.

Sebioff has already said that it doesn't work that way for them, so I'm not sure what's causing this on my end, as the only thing needed to recreate this bug is... literally just to edit any coaster, at any time, ever. It's omnipresent. If I turn off the visualizer, then turn it on after the ghost train has passed a given section of track, it does show the proper data - but if the visualizer is on when the train passes a piece of track, I have to click in and out of the visualizer to see the update. I had assumed this was intended (albeit clunky) behavior, but apparently it's not.

I also noticed I have to right-click on a ride two times to get a ghost car going - if I just close the ride and start editing, the ghost car doesn't start until I do that.

I have tested this out on steel coaster, junior coaster, wooden coaster, mini coaster, and log flume. I have screen shots, but no idea how useful they'll be and don't know how to post them here - they basically just show the ghost train being pretty far ahead of the current update progress on the ride, or rides that were open just a second ago but now don't have any visualizer data, that sort of thing.

[Sebioff]

So here's step by step what I'm doing to try reproduce this:
1. Start a new empty sandbox park
2. Build the "Junior Cruiser" blueprint
3. Right-click anywhere on the track to start the track builder
4. Pick the "Lateral G-Forces" visualization in the track builder window (easier to test than airtime)

The track is all gray now, but as the ghost train moves along the track it updates the individual track segments with the proper visualization colors for me.
What I tried next then:

5. Delete some track segments in a place where the train is fairly fast and add a small curve
6. Wait for the train to reach that new segment

The new segments start out gray for me, but then also update to the proper visualization color as soon as the ghost train reaches them.
From what I'm understanding the visualization update after step 6 is what's not happening for you, is that correct?
Are the other steps identical to what you're doing?

I can reproduce the ghost train not appearing when starting to edit a ride that is open, will look into that for one of our next patches (however, when manually closing the ride before editing I can not reproduce it).

[Solodric]

I have just done your step-by-step recreation, and you are correct, the visualization does not update automatically (unless I swap out of/back into the visualization). I tried this on the Western sandbox map with the Junior Cruiser blueprint, with lateral G-forces visualizer, same step-by-step process you have described.

For reference, when I first place the blueprint and go into the visualization, the visualizer doesn't update automatically (and isn't filled in to begin with) when I first open it up.
Deleting and replacing a piece of track greys it out, and it remains that way forever unless I swap into/out of the visualizer, no matter how many times the train runs over it. I've watched it run over that piece of track twice now, still grey (it's red normally for lateral Gs) and it's done so countless times in the background while I've typed this up, too.

(And yeah, the thing with the ghost train not starting is only if you right-click an already-open ride, it's such a minor bug I don't even really care that much, but I noticed it while trying to test this whole thing)

Are you on some kind of beta branch? Is there a graphics setting that might impact this? Should I try running in -force-d3d9 or something similar to see if that changes it up?

[Solodric]

Alright, I tried changing all of my visual settings (including swapping between windowed fullscreen and exclusive), I tried colorblind mode, I tried disabling all of my mods (I don't have many, just a few parts packs and the coaster cam and perspective cam mods), and I tried rebooting the map and so on. No dice, no realtime visualizer updates. I'll see if I can get a friend to try it later and see if they also have the bug, or if it's just me. For reference, I don't have either DLC pack, just in case that somehow ends up being relevant (I assume you have the DLC enabled, and I've seen weird situations where patches/updates got folded into DLC code before).

[Sebioff]

Hmm yeah what you're describing sounds definitely wrong... super odd and I can't think of any good reason currently that would explain how this can behave so differently on different systems :|
Yes, I'm using the normal public build.
Best explanation I have would be some graphics driver weirdness, but I'd expect the visualizations to not work at all then...

Are other visualizations like the park deco view also not updating in realtime for you or is it just the track ones?
For example try enabling the park deco view (from the views window in the left menu bar) and build a toilet next to a path (ideally try this in an empty park too, otherwise it can take a while for the calculations to be finished)

[Solodric]

Originally posted by Sebioff:

Hmm yeah what you're describing sounds definitely wrong... super odd and I can't think of any good reason currently that would explain how this can behave so differently on different systems :|
Yes, I'm using the normal public build.
Best explanation I have would be some graphics driver weirdness, but I'd expect the visualizations to not work at all then...

Are other visualizations like the park deco view also not updating in realtime for you or is it just the track ones?
For example try enabling the park deco view (from the views window in the left menu bar) and build a toilet next to a path (ideally try this in an empty park too, otherwise it can take a while for the calculations to be finished)

Decoration view is working as intended! I'm mid-way through designing a small park right now so I just threw it down there, it only took a couple of seconds to grind through the calculations. In general I have only seen this issue on coasters.

Sorry I haven't been of more help narrowing this one down, I'm not entirely sure what to try. I could of course send you a dxdiag or other stuff like that, but my system's pretty standard, so I don't know how much help that'd really be. Hmm...

Based on how you asked the question, it sounds like some codebase is shared between the different visualizers. But we can probably rule that portion of the codebase out, since it's only coasters that are exhibiting the issue. So there must either be some difference in how coasters calculate G-forces, or some difference in the code that tells the visualizer to update when it does so. Given that I've never seen a coaster pause and say 'Calculating', I'd kind of assume as much anyway. I'd probably suggest combing over the visualizer update code (I could only hazard a guess, but if you're using model-view-controller design pattern for this, I'd check the view object and cross-reference it with the view object used for decor visualizer and see if there's anything about its update sequence or timing that could present a bug.

[Sebioff]

Yeah the view update is shared between them so that doesn't seem to be the problem.
Some difference in how coasters calculate G-forces can be ruled out 100%, if that were the case the entire multiplayer mode wouldn't work (a calculation difference there between different systems would be a desync).

What's confusing is that if it is some problem with the game we should both get the same results, or if there was some sort of randomness like a timing issue it should at least work/fail some of the time (or should affect other people too, but this is the first report as far as I can remember).

That leaves only some system configuration issue, but yeah, seems pretty unlikely too :/
Could you please post your system specs anyways? (You can find them in Steam under Help -> System information)

Have you tried reinstalling the game yet?
We had some cases in the past where Steam corrupted the download somehow that resulted in similarly inexplicable issues.

[Solodric]

Computer Information:
Manufacturer: Alienware
Model: Alienware Aurora R5
Form Factor: Desktop
No Touch Input Detected

Processor Information:
CPU Vendor: GenuineIntel
CPU Brand: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-6700 CPU @ 3.40GHz
CPU Family: 0x6
CPU Model: 0x5e
CPU Stepping: 0x3
CPU Type: 0x0
Speed: 3408 Mhz
8 logical processors
4 physical processors
HyperThreading: Supported
FCMOV: Supported
SSE2: Supported
SSE3: Supported
SSSE3: Supported
SSE4a: Unsupported
SSE41: Supported
SSE42: Supported
AES: Supported
AVX: Supported
AVX2: Supported
AVX512F: Unsupported
AVX512PF: Unsupported
AVX512ER: Unsupported
AVX512CD: Unsupported
AVX512VNNI: Unsupported
SHA: Unsupported
CMPXCHG16B: Supported
LAHF/SAHF: Supported
PrefetchW: Unsupported

Operating System Version:
Windows 10 (64 bit)
NTFS: Supported
Crypto Provider Codes: Supported 311 0x0 0x0 0x0

Video Card:
Driver: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970
DirectX Driver Name: nvldumd.dll
Driver Version: 27.21.14.6079
DirectX Driver Version: 27.21.14.6079
Driver Date: 12 3 2020
OpenGL Version: 4.6
Desktop Color Depth: 32 bits per pixel
Monitor Refresh Rate: 60 Hz
DirectX Card: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970
VendorID: 0x10de
DeviceID: 0x13c2
Revision: 0xa1
Number of Monitors: 1
Number of Logical Video Cards: 1
No SLI or Crossfire Detected
Primary Display Resolution: 1920 x 1080
Desktop Resolution: 1920 x 1080
Primary Display Size: 62.99" x 35.43" (72.24" diag)
160.0cm x 90.0cm (183.5cm diag)
Primary Bus: PCI Express 8x
Primary VRAM: 4095 MB
Supported MSAA Modes: 2x 4x 8x

Sound card:
Audio device: Speakers / Headphones (Realtek

Memory:
RAM: 8094 Mb

VR Hardware:
VR Headset: None detected

Miscellaneous:
UI Language: English
Media Type: DVD
Total Hard Disk Space Available: 938769 Mb
Largest Free Hard Disk Block: 83075 Mb
OS Install Date: Dec 31 1969
Game Controller: None detected

[Solodric]

I'll try verifying the game cache now.

[Solodric]

Cache verified, and the problem isn't fixed. I guess I'll go for full reinstall just in case.

[Solodric]

Aaand that didn't work either.

To be honest I find this all kind of funny. I didn't even know for sure that this was unusual behavior, I just inferred it was a bug of some sort because the decoration view and so forth update in real time. But yeah, I am rather puzzled. Well, only one trick left to try - I'll uninstall my mods and see if they somehow messed this up. It'd be really odd, but I've seen weirder.

[Solodric]

That has also failed. I turned off the game, uninstalled every mod, turned it back on, nada. Still no realtime update from coasters on G-forces and the like. Still have to swap visualizers or exit/re-enable visualizer to get updates.

I'm gonna go check out a Youtube video of someone using the visualizer to see how it's meant to work, let me know if you come up with any more ideas. Heh, computers - magical, aren't they?

Edit: Watched a video, there's a delay but it did seem like the G-forces shading filled in over time. Yeah, that's definitely not the behavior I'm seeing in-game at all. Incidentally it was disturbingly hard to find a Parkitect video that wasn't about murdering park guests or making trollercoasters, especially when searching 'visualizer' or 'g-forces'.

[Solodric]

So, now I've run across a monumentally worse bug. Whenever I start up multiplayer, regardless of circumstances (mods installed, mods installed but disabled, mods uninstalled, with another person, without another person in the server, multiple maps, multiple coaster types, whatever, doesn't matter) the coasters I build won't update at all. They never read anything but 0.0 Excitement, Intensity, and Nausea, and the visualizers either show nothing at all, or they show bizarrely exaggerated data, like the coaster being blood-red on the velocity visualizer if it has any speed whatsoever.

It's made multiplayer effectively unplayable for the time being... and yet, the decoration visualizer is still working exactly as intended, updating in real time and everything. Are you absolutely positive they use the EXACT SAME code to update both?

I also don't know if this is just a weird multiplayer-based mutation of the same bug I had before, but whatever the case it's a big deal to me.

[Sebioff]

I guess the last thing to try is updating your graphics driver then. It's a year old, which is not really ancient, but who knows :/

I've recorded a video of my reproduction steps for you so you can compare:
https://youtu.be/5YwZWQr-XHU

When you open the info window of the coaster that you're editing and go to the graphs tab, does it update the graph there in realtime (as the ghost train moves along the track) or does that not update either?

The multiplayer thing is intentional for now, it only updates the stats if you run the ride in test mode there (since everything needs to have the same stats for all players, and the other players don't run the ghost train simulation while you're building).
But I agree that this isn't ideal at all and we can probably improve that.

[Solodric]

Originally posted by Sebioff:

I guess the last thing to try is updating your graphics driver then. It's a year old, which is not really ancient, but who knows :/

I've recorded a video of my reproduction steps for you so you can compare:
https://youtu.be/5YwZWQr-XHU

When you open the info window of the coaster that you're editing and go to the graphs tab, does it update the graph there in realtime (as the ghost train moves along the track) or does that not update either?

The multiplayer thing is intentional for now, it only updates the stats if you run the ride in test mode there (since everything needs to have the same stats for all players, and the other players don't run the ghost train simulation while you're building).
But I agree that this isn't ideal at all and we can probably improve that.

Alrighty, so I updated my drivers (did nothing), checked the info window of the coaster (the graph updates just fine but it's not reflected in the visualizer)... and then I got curious about what you said about multiplayer. It implies the code must be different between Test Mode and the regular ghost train, so I figured, why not give Test Mode a go and see if it updates the coaster visualizer?

And it does! My coaster's visualizer updates in real time when I run test mode. So that got me really curious about that video you posted - had you paused when testing the coaster, or did you let the ghost train run while you had the game unpaused? This came to mind because, of course, I usually build coasters with the game paused - and test mode can't be used when the game is unpaused.

Well, so of course your test video had the game UNpaused, and I have no confirmed the visualizer updates in realtime whether it's using the ghost train or test mode as long as I unpause the game. I spend so much time building in pause mode, it had never even remotely occurred to me that it might be the issue. And bear in mind, the Decoration visualizer updates when the game is paused, so that's clearly a difference in code right there. But I think we've finally pinned down the issue.

Also, regarding the multiplayer thing, that makes sense. Just toss a note about it on the multiplayer screen underneath the bit about cross-compatibility not being ready, sorry for misidentifying a bug with that one.

[Sebioff]

Ahh yeah, there's the missing puzzle piece :)
With the game paused I can reproduce it now.
Thanks for your patience and helping to figure this out!