airport catchment area

[Blue [ITA]]

I am playing on a huge USA map, and i have several airports from 1920, i am now in 1980 but my planes fly always close empty, i followed all the hints that i could find on the net, bus connection and even a underground rail line that connect 3 big city with the airport.
I will like to use planes on a huge map, i looked for mods that will increase the airport catchment area, but i didn't find anyone.
I will like a hint how can i mod by myself the airport catchment area.
Any1 can help please.
Thx

[canophone]

If flying with Concorde... the distance passengers are willing to travel is less than if you were to fly an airbus. But none will go across the huge map...

[viic_fahrer]

They say frequency is the key to attracting passengers... I don't know if that mechanic applies to planes in the same way, but with a frequency of around 5 minutes, my planes are if not full, at least profitable, but it takes a loooong time.

[Vimpster]

Some how I doubt that increasing the catchment range of the airport would result in any noticeable increase in people using it. Even if the catchment were to encompass the entire town, there still remains the budgeting and travel prefrence restrictions that would prevent people from using the airport if they had to walk a considerable distance at either end.

[canophone]

Originally posted by Vimpster:

Some how I doubt that increasing the catchment range of the airport would result in any noticeable increase in people using it.

Oh, it can give a noticeable increase in people using the airport, provided the top speeds of the planes, frequency and lines are within the limited ranges to ensure maximum usage (ie. neither too close nor too far for the type of plane used, and not too much competition among modes). You may want a mixture of top speeds among lines serving different cities -- to a point.

Even if the catchment were to encompass the entire town, there still remains the budgeting and travel prefrence restrictions that would prevent people from using the airport if they had to walk a considerable distance at either end.

[chrisasnyder]

Airports work fine provided you pay attention to the game mechanics. Since planes are always fast and expensive, having any competing path with the planes will reduce possible traffice. Like train stations, and bus stations, provide fast travel from each district of the city to the airport. Best setup is have one airport close to residential, the other airport near commercial or industrial. Cargo will boost the industry or commercial buildings creating more jobs or shopping opportunities, which are the reasons people travel. Stong industry in one city and strong commercial in another will encourage travel in both directions.

Trying to start an airport in a city with already well established train lines will always be hard, because the build up near those other travel points will be cheaper or faster than anything you try to do with the airport.

However, try starting a game in the 1920's, create airports instead of train stations to connect cities on each side of the map. Feed cargo to the main hub cities, bus and trains to connect nearby cities to the cities with airports. This creates the city growth around the airports and those become primary travel between cities and quickly outpace the capcity of early airplanes.

[joshb91]

^ very true, also can be more of a challenge with the larger airports between two established cities with a dedicated line for airport link service.

If i have an aiport close to a city i put a express tram line ie 3 stops only airport, major terminal bus or train and a commerical ie shopping, and public usually bus to tram then to airport

[ajax_post]

I only have one air route at the moment, in the 1950s, and it didn't take too long to become reasonably profitable.

The two air connected cities are on either side of a map-wide river and there are no other fast routes connecting the two halves of the map. Each of the cities has good internal bus services and rail connections to other cities on their respective sides of the river, so there should be enough passenger demand/supply on each side.

The little people love to travel between cities and will make multiple routes to get to their destination so make sure your airports are well connected but, as has been said, try to avoid having any competing fast/expensive routes that they could use as alternatives between the cities connected by air.

[Blue [ITA]]

i am playing in the map United States Extra Large (With Industries) world size 32 x16 medium difficulty and i did a test to understand better the game mechanic: i have a east coast area with philadelphia center well developed ( cities between 1k-2k) and a east cost undeveloped ( cities around 200-300)
I connected San Francisco with trains, boats, trams and bus to all the cities in east coast and then i placed an airport in San Francisco, close to the city using landscape and demolition trying to make the best catchment area with a route to to philadephia airport, then i connected philadelphia and 2 more cities to the airport with dedicated undergroud rail lines with a traffic around 150 and a bus terminal with 3 dedicated lines to the cities with tram and bus, the guests like both the lines a lot, but use them not to go to the airport but to travel faster between cities, they go to the airport switch the lines and go to other cities :)
There is no way for guests to go from east coast to west coast except airplanes, i have a route frequency around 3 minutes, results 1-5 guests after 10 years.
i can't try anything more, so please help me to understand better how i could make it working.
Thx for any help or hint

[chrisasnyder]

Always remember the game mechanics for people: Travel to work or shopping and they get there fast or cheap. People will have pre-determined destinations, and will use your paths to get to them. Not sure when or how often they change their destinations, if at all. Those might just get set when the person "arrives" in the city. Re-assignment happens probably when buildings upgrade, get destroyed, town growth, or routes to their destination go away. These happen usually first of the month, where some of the population might look for a new work/shop endpoint.

Given this, when you have a well established city, good bus lines feeding an efficient train station to get to other cities equally connected. Each city with strong industries, high value commercial and residential. The preferred destinations for both cheap and fast are readilly avialable in several directions.

Putting an airport on the outskirts, will always have a difficult time competing for travel compared to the high value buildings built up near the existing rail system. Not impossible, just difficult. To make it work you have to think in terms of the game mechanic for people first selecting end points and their preference.

If there is a several highrise residential buildings right next to the train station, and a train is running a 60s intrevals with high speed to neighboring city with commercial buildings built up next to that train station, why would the person living in that building going to shop, choose to take the cross town trolley, jump on an expensive plain, take the long flight, another long bus ride? it doesn't satisfy either the fast or cheap. They will not use it.

My point is when adding an airport to a city, select a location to support the game's people mechanic. Choose cities that make sense. This isn't a city builder game, where people will just start using an airport because it's there, adjust your thinking.

[canophone]

Originally posted by Blue ITA:

There is no way for guests to go from east coast to west coast except airplanes, i have a route frequency around 3 minutes, results 1-5 guests after 10 years.
i can't try anything more, so please help me to understand better how i could make it working.
Thx for any help or hint

No passengers means that it's beyond the distance passengers are willing to travel with the planes you're using (ie. try a lower top speed plane). Few passengers also means (in addition to the above) that there's too much competition with other modes, and with rezonings of commercial and industrial areas, that they change their workplace or shop to something that is closer via trains, ending up only taking the plane line once.

[Blue [ITA]]

thx for all kind explanations, but there is only a airplane route to go from east to west coast, guest cannot go with rail, so there is no competition.
I think that the game mechanic doesn't like long distance trip in huge maps.

[chrisasnyder]

Originally posted by Blue ITA:

thx for all kind explanations, but there is only a airplane route to go from east to west coast, guest cannot go with rail, so there is no competition.
I think that the game mechanic doesn't like long distance trip in huge maps.

Not true. I am currently playing on a 1:1 mega map, with 8 airlines crisscrossing the map. Edge to edge in some cases. All lines running full in both directions. Only about 1950, so the expensive modern planes are not in service yet, but I expect it to keep working given how I've setup the map.

[canophone]

Originally posted by chrisasnyder:

Originally posted by Blue ITA:

thx for all kind explanations, but there is only a airplane route to go from east to west coast, guest cannot go with rail, so there is no competition.
I think that the game mechanic doesn't like long distance trip in huge maps.

Not true. I am currently playing on a 1:1 mega map, with 8 airlines crisscrossing the map. Edge to edge in some cases. All lines running full in both directions. Only about 1950, so the expensive modern planes are not in service yet, but I expect it to keep working given how I've setup the map.

Interesting... I've noticed declines when using the Concorde top speed versus using an Airbus. As well as various cutoffs at certain distances for passengers continuing to use certain lines.

[chrisasnyder]

@canophone faster more expensive ticket price vehicles will reduce the usage of a line, or at least shrink the range of people that what will use it. The counter measure for this is using cargo to increase the value of the buildings. This will put more people and destinations closer to the stations at higher densities to compenstate for the higher travel price.

Personally I am not fond of this particular effect. I would prefer to have direct control over the ticket price of a line instead of it being determined automatically. We don't, so the linear relationship between speed * distance = ticket price gives us the shinking city effect.

[Blue [ITA]]

chrisasnyder what do u think is wrong in my setup of lines?