Ideal Weapon Combos for MVM

[mewletter]

This is my very first post here in Steam Forums, so be nice to me. Anyway let's start. Since I already collected a fairly decent weapons for some time, I need to figure out which weapons combo suit best for each class. For example for my sniper class.

Sniper
Primary weapon: Machina. The bots don't seem to bother with fire trail caused by it & deals decent crit damage / headshots.

Secondary Weapon: Jarate. Very useful. Causes mini-crits to enemies, possible chance of revealing cloaking spy bots & best of all, get rid of Pyro bots' annoying afterburns.

Melee: Shahanshah. With many Robo Scouts & Spy Bots flooding in, chances are your health will be less than 50%, thus the additional damage will benefit. (It did for me at least)

Hope others will contribute their own ideal weapons combo against the metal onslaught!

[Crokadilla]

Spy: L'Etranger, Big Earner, Dead Ringer, Red-Tape Recorder.

[mewletter]

The Red-Tape Recorder. What does it do to the robots? I only seen it in action on Engineer's buildings only.

[sherk]

Whatabout Heatmaker? Max reload speed + max focus is deadly.

As heavy, never ever use tomislav. Using it in MvM means you're a noob or a wannabe pro.

[ErebusEtherie]

== Sniper ==

Machina + Buff Banner/Kritetzkrieg = tank/giant killer -> better dps then full up pyro after the max upgrade.

Sydney Sleeper -> can be discussed. Not for dmg itself, but for marking if you lack scout. This rifle boosts team's average dps.

Jarate -> nothing to add, best choice. Can use razorback if milk-scout is present. (But... why use sniper then? It will make team dps sooo poor.)

Hmm... I think that better weapon for melee is the one (I don't remember the name) that makes mini-crits crits. This can make some difference when attacking the tank before you max upgrade the rifle.

== Soldier ==

Buff Banner -> free crits for everyone! With two banners good team can have almost constant mini-crits. Effective team dps boost. Can do magic combined with sentries and widowmaker engie (Crit-sentry? Infinite-ammo widowmaker?)

Melee -> escape plan (no dmg penality) or equalizer (for finishing the tank -> you can dmg yourself with last two rockets left to boost the dmg output)

Main
Do anyone find faster rockets better? I did not test it...
Is Direct Hit good option? I don't think so, but I didn't test it...

My type: Black Box (+hp and late-game the clip penalty don't do much of a difference) or Beggars (rocket spam -> just click and spam one by one, rocket barrage -> for mass-waves, but usable only on maps with big ammo packs near the soldier's nest -> no dispensers available with this luncher)

Can discuss the early-game use of normal rocket luncher/original.


== Demoman ==

Two builds:

=Demoknight=
Melee -> katana (full hp with every kill and ability to overheal with HP-on-kill upgrades) + boots (+HP and because you can't switch from katana before first kill) + targe (resistance + charge for better relocation)

What is bad in this build?
- weak vs. giants (only soldiers can be killed solo),
- weak vs. pyro/heave (even with the resistances) -> this is weird*,
- bombs/soldier/engie/pyro are better at mass-killing,

What is good?
- the thrill and fun,
- taking giants attention.

*Why is it so weird? -> Pyros are overpowered, with max crit resistance, overheal, max fire resistance, kill-heal... you are dead.

=Demoman=
Standard demoman, better with the S. Resistance. Remember to put crit bombs before every wave (one teammate goes medic for a moment and changes to his class after placing the bombs).


== Engie ==

Wrangler + Wrench/Jag (or anything you like, but not Eureka or you will be uber-dependent) + Frontier/Widowkamer.

Frontier -> crit for every sentry-kill (good when fighting the scout-spam waves),
Widowmaker -> with crits you are the new heavy-guy in the team.


== Pyro ==

I don't like Phlog -> no random crits and you can be killed (by a spy? by a giant?) when taunting.

My choice is backburner (because I am not skilled juggler). Task: medic and giants rapist. Cool crit-firewall when good placed (under the stairs on coalmine or behind the shed on mannworks).

The best choice is standard flame-thrower or degreaser -> you can reset the bomb easily.

What axe? I don't know. Some people prefer 3rd degree because it can attack everyone connected by a medigun beam. But I don't like this style -> if you can hit them with the axe, you can back-burn them too.

Secondary? The scorch shot -> sometimes it can help to push the bomb back, but it is very hard and - at the end - not so effective.


== Medic ==

Krietzkrieg is a must... in the right hands can do the magic and win the wave. Soldier with krietz can rocket-spam critical rockets dealing the tank near 500 dmg per rocket. With Beggar soldier standing on an ammo crate that means infinite crit-rocket spam.

Melee -> ubersaw/vitasaw depending on your survivability. Medieval medic set is also good.


== Heavy ==

Hibernating Bear set is probably the best choice. Steak + Spirit can really help with the tank - even much more then mindless minigun spam.

Why? I every time lacked the time to eat or use the chocolate or sandwich and the medic packs are all around.

I don't understand people using Tomislav... Natasha makes sense, but Tomi? New minigun is also good, but only with constant ammo supply (with current spy AI it makes you backstab resistant -> burned spies run away from you to hide).

[mewletter]

Heatmaker's drawback is that it deals less damage on bodyshots. I tried sniping a large horde of Robo Scouts with it once & could only killed a third of them before a Giant soldier killed me. Deadly in last few waves I agree with max speed & focus, but strangely tough to use in mid-game for me.

As for Heavy's Primary weapon, I find Natasha very good in slowing large hordes. (I thinking of you, Robo Scouts) Huo-Long Heater is nice alternative (as long Heavy is near dispenser) since he's like a spy checker if there's no friendly Pyro in game.

[ErebusEtherie]

Natasha is too situational for me to be used as an main weapon. When we have one flexible player (can play every class and don't spend his money until the mid- or end-game) and we need to fight the robo-scouts, he changes almost always to the Natasha-Heavy.

[mewletter]

Sadly I don't have the set nor seen someone using them in MVM game with me. Still, the info on them in wiki did mention it's very good in defensive situations. It's even better with friendly Medics around of course.

[Darth Cannabis]

I have to say I tend to have an anti combo philosophy, In most cases I choose a weapon, (not alawys primary) and upgrade it to max. Have had great results doing so with riteous bison, or sandman, or widowmaker. Combos aren't that big, as it is ussually a 1 weapon focus and then resistances, health regen etc. where I have the best results. That being said the best actually combos are mad milk with anything, and jarate with anything. Other than that i find it best to focus on full upgrades on your 1 chosen weapon.

[uRBAN_Spaceman]

To much time wasted on Sniper. Honestly... Theres no logical reason to have a sniper unless you happen to have one of those friends who cries and pouts like a baby if you dont let them play sniper... Otherwise a scout is much more useful.

Best setup imo is Scout, Medic, Engi, Demo, Heavy, Pyro hands down

Scout - Milk and FoD giants, FaN for knockbacks, and collect cash

Soldier - Hes just a DPS monster that should be quick to react when needed. Bazooka is badass

Sniper- With logic applied... No need for him in MvM. Doesn't mean you can't win with a sniper... Just means if you are a TEAM PLAYER and HAVE A BRAIN... you will play something else.

Spy - Great for medics and collecting cash. A decent alternative to a Scout. Sappers can wreck large groups if applied correctly with some teamwork.

Heavy - Another DPS monster. Brassbeast for sure! Good for keeping the choke clear. Can spec for semi worthless knockback. With resists is great for tanking.

Engi - Pretty much the same as the Heavy in terms of Sentry. Needs to keep dispenser positioned and repaired for rest of team. Keep those ports up! Wrangler is a must but please learn when to use it and when to let sentry go on auto. If you plan on playing Engi you need to learn the simple idea of picking up your sentry and running to the Busters to blow them up. When you pick that sentry up you are basically in complete control of that Sentry Buster.

Demo - A DPS mosnter. Medics are your top priority! Keep traps setup for giant Scouts if you know they are coming. Just keep those grenades lobbing down range and assist on giants.

Pyro - resists, airblast, and ammo!!!! You are the crowd control of the group. Keep those knock backs coming and DPS when airblast isnt needed. Ive seen some pyros manage cash collection very well. But not advised.

Medic - Kritzkrieg all the way! Keep the front lines healed! Stay out of troubles way unless you know there is a low threat(ex. pyro rush, scout rush, fist heavy rush etc etc) Invest in sharing canteens asap. Be able to decide if uber or crits canteen is what your current team needs. Always try to keep every member overheal capped and dont play pocket medic. Share the love with the entire team. STAY ALIVE!

[The New Mrs. Nubby]

Soldier Bazooka is mandatory. You can fire up to 11 Rockets with 1 Crit Canteen, and with full damage, that can take out just about any large bot.

[ErebusEtherie]

Darth Cannabis - I completely agree with you. I just proposed the item sets. It is self-explanatory which weapon should be upgrades as a main weapon and which is just a good add-on to it.

In a good team I play every needed at the moment class - I don't upgrade anything until the last or very hard wave. I must stress that: "IN A GOOD TEAM". In the end I can concentrate on the most proper set-up to help my team win. Sometimes it is full support (lots of soldiers -> medic with kritz), sometimes it is dmg/support (giants -> sydney + jarate), or bomb reset + tank buster (pyro with max blast).

Once there was a need for a tank (low survivability, with dps), so I took Heavy with max resistances and hp regen + Metal fists. Don't try it... it is situational and stupid combination.

[Darth Cannabis]

While I agree that the phlogs lack of airblast can be a liability I have to point out that fully upgraded you can mmphh a giant bot alone in under 3 seconds. By far the most damaging you can be as pyro.

[== Heavy ==

Hibernating Bear set is probably the best choice. Steak + Spirit can really help with the tank - even much more then mindless minigun spam.] Bad name, Steak plus bear claws is better called a Bearzerker.


[/quote]
Its good for a backup weapon for bearzerkers. But yeah as a main weapon to focus upgrades on, better off with different minigun.

[ErebusEtherie]

Escrito originalmente por uRBAN_Spaceman ☞Internaut☜:

Sniper- With logic applied... No need for him in MvM. Doesn't mean you can't win with a sniper... Just means if you are a TEAM PLAYER and HAVE A BRAIN... you will play something else.

Every class in TF2, like every item can find it's proper place. Machina Sniper with Cantines is also DPS monster (even 1k dmg with one hit, and Machina after upgrades is like a pistol). Sydney Sleeper is team-friendly in the situation when you don't have anyone to mark giants with crits.

I disagree with you only about insulting people, who CAN play sniper and do it very good. You can freely insult the I-am-pro-sniper's and I-want-to-show-you-that-I-sniper-like-a-boss's. They talk too much, but shoot like my granny.

[ErebusEtherie]

Darth Cannabis - thx for advice. I will start up my home server and try the phlogi combination. I just don't like the idea that pyro is not for the crowd control...

Bad name, heh? I am not familiar with the community-used names, because I stick to the Polish servers. But thx for it - I will remember. :-)

[uRBAN_Spaceman]

Escrito originalmente por Erebus:Wkurwiłem się i nie gram.:

Every class in TF2, like every item can find it's proper place. Machina Sniper with Cantines is also DPS monster (even 1k dmg with one hit, and Machina after upgrades is like a pistol). Sydney Sleeper is team-friendly in the situation when you don't have anyone to mark giants with crits.

I disagree with you only about insulting people, who CAN play sniper and do it very good. You can freely insult the I-am-pro-sniper's and I-want-to-show-you-that-I-sniper-like-a-boss's. They talk too much, but shoot like my granny.

Sniper is a situational class if anything in MvM from my experiences. I have yet to play with a good group that willingly accept a sniper. No matter how good they are. Snipers only offer DPS. They are never close enough to collect cash and cant offer any kind of support tanking. Every other pure DPS class at least can offer those aspects of gameplay where as the sniper doesnt. Milk > Jarate. I respect your opinion but I still disagree.