Bazaar Bargain = worst sniper?

[Balanced]

The Bazaar Bargain is probably the most useless sniper rifle in this game. The other sniper rifles have attributes that justify using it in game.

The classic: gives a massive field of view advantage over other sniper and can one shot weak classes without having to scope

the Sydney Sleeper: applies jurate which can be useful in forcing enemies to retreat that survived the shot, (pretty much makes bad players seem useful)

The hitman heat maker: allows you to shoot without having to unscope between shots and a faster charge just for doing damage

machina: + 15% damage and penetration

And the Bazaar Bargain, is just the stock sniper rifle that charges slower but with a twist. for each headshot it speeds up the charge. getting three headshots allows the sniper rifle to charge faster then stock which is good but the problem happens when getting a body shot or missing decreases the bonus. This is why I think the Bazaar bargain is bad because unless you can get headshots consistently above 3 every time, it is a downgrade from stock. Now don't get me wrong, I like the idea of the Bazaar Bargain: to reward and encourage getting headshots but in game, so many things can cause a missed shot in this hetic game it is not reliable.

What do you guys think, is the Bazaar Bargain a good or bad weapon? do you guys like the idea but not the exacution? what would you change?

personally, a better buff would to keep the stats the same but remove the penalty for bodyshots, that way the rifle can still encourage getting headshot while only decreasing your count for missing a target.

[Frantastick]

I find all the Sniper Rifles have irrelevant upsides. The unlocks are more punishing than stock. And for what? constant zoom? Faster charge? Meh.

[Ravenant]

I'm not that great of a Sniper but I still like it. It's attribute is a pretty helpful trade-off if you're good enough with it.

The Sydney Sleeper isn't that bad, it just really encourages bodyshots (applies Jarate AND unable to headshot anyway) but it's not all that bad depending on how you use it. Soaking enemies in Jarate from a distance can help out other teammates trying to push forward or just helping out a distant teammate save his skin from another enemy. It's a very different playstyle, but sadly few Snipers ever use it when using the Sleeper. Indeed, most Sleeper users just use it to bodyshot the hell out of people. I don't see many people using the Sleeper in general, though.

[Frantastick]

Publicado originalmente por Ravenant:

I'm not that great of a Sniper but I still like it. It's attribute is a pretty helpful trade-off if you're good enough with it.

The Sydney Sleeper isn't that bad, it just really encourages bodyshots (applies Jarate AND unable to headshot anyway) but it's not all that bad depending on how you use it. Soaking enemies in Jarate from a distance can help out other teammates trying to push forward or just helping out a distant teammate save his skin from another enemy. It's a very different playstyle, but sadly few Snipers ever use it when using the Sleeper. Indeed, most Sleeper users just use it to bodyshot the hell out of people. I don't see many people using the Sleeper in general, though.

Sydney Sleeper is for fast paced matches where aiming is more difficult. I think.

[n00b3rt]

Publicado originalmente por Mannular:

I find all the Sniper Rifles have irrelevant upsides. The unlocks are more punishing than stock. And for what? constant zoom? Faster charge? Meh.

The Machina is almost a straight upgrade to the stock. The enemy knowing where you are doesn't matter much if your team protects you and that also makes the lack of noscope shooting irrelevant. In exchange, at full charge you can bodyshot base-health Pyros/Demos and, most importantly, Medics hiding behind their teammates.

[Frantastick]

Publicado originalmente por n00b3rt:

Publicado originalmente por Mannular:

I find all the Sniper Rifles have irrelevant upsides. The unlocks are more punishing than stock. And for what? constant zoom? Faster charge? Meh.

The Machina is almost a straight upgrade to the stock. The enemy knowing where you are doesn't matter much if your team protects you and that also makes the lack of noscope shooting irrelevant. In exchange, at full charge you can bodyshot base-health Pyros/Demos and, most importantly, Medics hiding behind their teammates.

Besides Machina. lol

[JarateKing (very rusty)]

Publicado originalmente por Mannular:

Publicado originalmente por Ravenant:

I'm not that great of a Sniper but I still like it. It's attribute is a pretty helpful trade-off if you're good enough with it.

The Sydney Sleeper isn't that bad, it just really encourages bodyshots (applies Jarate AND unable to headshot anyway) but it's not all that bad depending on how you use it. Soaking enemies in Jarate from a distance can help out other teammates trying to push forward or just helping out a distant teammate save his skin from another enemy. It's a very different playstyle, but sadly few Snipers ever use it when using the Sleeper. Indeed, most Sleeper users just use it to bodyshot the hell out of people. I don't see many people using the Sleeper in general, though.

Sydney Sleeper is for fast paced matches where aiming is more difficult. I think.

There's such thing?

I mean no matter how fast-paced the game gets, the classes still move the same speed as they always do. I actually always end up getting more headshots when the game gets more fast paced because I'm more pumped up.

Publicado originalmente por n00b3rt:

Publicado originalmente por Mannular:

I find all the Sniper Rifles have irrelevant upsides. The unlocks are more punishing than stock. And for what? constant zoom? Faster charge? Meh.

The Machina is almost a straight upgrade to the stock. The enemy knowing where you are doesn't matter much if your team protects you and that also makes the lack of noscope shooting irrelevant. In exchange, at full charge you can bodyshot base-health Pyros/Demos and, most importantly, Medics hiding behind their teammates.

Having your team protect you is only really viable in competitive or something. And there you'll rarely fully charge anyway, whereas visually alerting the enemy team to your teams' whereabouts as you're pushing (how else will you stay protected and be able to get picks) saves them all a few vital seconds, so it's still not all that good.

[Male]

I find the machina to be the worst. I just do. Every sniper that has ever tried to kill me with it has failed trying to do so because they bodyshot me. (Unless the sniper is pro.)

[Fumo Bnnuy n Frends]

Publicado originalmente por Stone Cold Steve Harvey:

I find the machina to be the worst. I just do. Every sniper that has ever tried to kill me with it has failed trying to do so because they bodyshot me. (Unless the sniper is pro.)

i thought the machina is used more for one shotting sentries/buildings or if lucky enough the engy in front then the building
it also helps against resistance users like battalion soldiers fists of steel heavies or vaccinator medics as the extra damage and crits on headshots sorta get a little over it enough to weaken them

[100% Recycled Awesome]

Publicado originalmente por Horrow:

Machina is one of the best because it gives you the most damage. You can kill with body shots now against even soldiers.

The whole "Its the worst because it supports body shots!1!!1" is childish.

Are you F-ing kidding me?

You're a noob. Straight up.

Machina is the worst sniper rifle out there. Yes, it incentivized body shots, but that's not WHY it's the worst. The only benefit a Machina offers is the scoped in damage boost, but that pushes players towards being scoped in all of the time which results in them having virtually no clue about what's going on around them. Which means they are easy pickings for ANYONE that gets behind them or simply not in their scope.

No other sniper rifle has this problem all of the time. A sniper that is oblivious to their surrounding is a sniper that dies alot. And a dead player is not a helpful player.

[100% Recycled Awesome]

Publicado originalmente por Woobie :3:

They didn't say it was bad because it supports bodyshots. They said it "promotes nearly complete obliviousness", which (from my interpretation) is referencing the requirement of a full charge. Having to fully charge your Machina for the damage bonus supports a campy style of playing where you just stand in one place scoped in. It also removes a lot of your enviromental awareness.

Horrow is a noob, partially why he can't read properly. It's fairly hard to sneak up on a bowman, where I've beaten machina snipers to death with a fish because they're just so oblivious. The lack of situtational awareness is a horrible downside to the weapon. You basically have to use the Razorback which then requires you to melee spies. Overall, it's a bad situtation to be in.

[[SOP] GeT ExPoSeD]

Publicado originalmente por Walrus on LSD:

It's fine, it just has a much higher skill floor.

I rather take the Bargain over the Sleeper.

[100% Recycled Awesome]

Publicado originalmente por Balanced Insanity:

i have to agree. I can justify hating on the weapon for that reason but to say its a bad weapon because of it is nonsense

How is being completely unaware of your surrounding "nonsense?"

Machina is bad weapon because you don't know what's going on around you. Oblivious players are dead players and the Machina incentivized being ignorant to what's going on.

Thing is, if you cannot reliably get headshots don't play sniper.

[NotReallyRoyal]

The B.Bargain requires skill and it benefits you.
More headshots you do, the more charge r8 you have.
If you keep missin', your charge r8 will slow down making your rifle weak.

[NotReallyRoyal]

Machinima is weapon used to kill multiple players at once. You don't need to headshot.

[100% Recycled Awesome]

Publicado originalmente por Mr.M1:

Machinima is weapon used to kill multiple players at once. You don't need to headshot.

But if you're a good sniper, the stock/heat/bargain would let you kill more players with headshots faster than with the Machina in the same amount of time.

And if you're a bad sniper, you shouldn't be sniping anyways.

Machina, Classic and Sleeper shouldn't even be used. The bargain is the hardest to use because it basically requires aimbot like skill.