Should I use force a nature or soda popper or stock scattergun

[76561199235611981]

Should I use force a nature or soda popper or stock scattergun

[Hamburg]

stock

[Big Sloppie]

Soda Popper is easiest to use and the most friendly of the bunch in dealing damage with increased mobility.

[Eighteen-Counts Trevor]

Do you like dealing more damage or do you like having more shots?

[Rando the Crit Clown]

Not the Force a Nature.

[Graceful Jabberwocky]

anything but the force a nature

[Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp]

Stock vs Soda Popper is consistency vs burst. The stock Scattergun lets you fight for longer while the Soda Popper has two fast shots until it has to reload.
Ultimately, between those two, it's mostly preference. Try them out, and see which you prefer.

However, the Force-A-Nature is a beginner's trap. It's not bad, but it is more gimmicky and more hit-and-run than the other two. Also, the knockback will mess you up a lot. Force jumping is very addictive though. I advise against it unless you have gotten somewhat good at the game, and even then, it will take a long time to master it, if it's even worth the effort.

[Rando the Crit Clown]

Originally posted by Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp:

Stock vs Soda Popper is consistency vs burst. The stock Scattergun lets you fight for longer while the Soda Popper has two fast shots until it has to reload.
Ultimately, between those two, it's mostly preference. Try them out, and see which you prefer.

However, the Force-A-Nature is a beginner's trap. It's not bad, but it is more gimmicky and more hit-and-run than the other two. Also, the knockback will mess you up a lot. Force jumping is very addictive though. I advise against it unless you have gotten somewhat good at the game, and even then, it will take a long time to master it, if it's even worth the effort.

The Soda Popper has such insane firing & reloading speeds that the only shot that stock has an advantage over the Soda Popper is the third. The first, second, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, and every other shot will have the Soda Popper's fire first, frequently by a large margin, while the stock is only a little faster on exactly the third shot. Stock also doesn't have the ridiculously overpowered hype jump mechanic.

I use stock because I think it's more fun, but the Soda Popper is clearly better.

[Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp]

Originally posted by Rando the Crit Clown:

Originally posted by Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp:

Stock vs Soda Popper is consistency vs burst. The stock Scattergun lets you fight for longer while the Soda Popper has two fast shots until it has to reload.
Ultimately, between those two, it's mostly preference. Try them out, and see which you prefer.

However, the Force-A-Nature is a beginner's trap. It's not bad, but it is more gimmicky and more hit-and-run than the other two. Also, the knockback will mess you up a lot. Force jumping is very addictive though. I advise against it unless you have gotten somewhat good at the game, and even then, it will take a long time to master it, if it's even worth the effort.

The Soda Popper has such insane firing & reloading speeds that the only shot that stock has an advantage over the Soda Popper is the third. The first, second, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, and every other shot will have the Soda Popper's fire first, frequently by a large margin, while the stock is only a little faster on exactly the third shot. Stock also doesn't have the ridiculously overpowered hype jump mechanic.

I use stock because I think it's more fun, but the Soda Popper is clearly better.

From my experimenting, I found that stock could at least compete until the 6th shot (minus the second shot), where it has to reload. These calculations were done a long time ago, but I always had my doubts that the statement (that Soda Popper is better on the fourth shot and onwards) was true. They didn't make sense to me because when you reload after two shots and stock fires the third shot faster afterwards, the same must be true for the fifth shot, or else, where does the advantage come from?
In super extended fights, the Soda Popper definitely comes out on top. Out of those two, I still prefer stock because it's more consistent.

[Rando the Crit Clown]

I will re-do the math to fact check verify

Stock	Pop
0.00	0.00
0.62	0.31
1.25	1.44
1.87	1.75
2.50	2.89
3.12	3.20

I was wrong but the Soda Popper is still 100% faster on that second shot, which can kill everyone but Heavy, then the rest of the shots are pretty comparable. After the 6th shot the Soda Popper would obviously get an enormous lead due to the Scattergun now needing to reload.

Plus it has OP Hype Jump

[Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp]

Originally posted by Rando the Crit Clown:

I will re-do the math to fact check verify

Stock	Pop
0.00	0.00
0.62	0.31
1.25	1.44
1.87	1.75
2.50	2.89
3.12	3.20

I was wrong but the Soda Popper is still 100% faster on that second shot, which can kill everyone but Heavy, then the rest of the shots are pretty comparable. After the 6th shot the Soda Popper would obviously get an enormous lead due to the Scattergun now needing to reload.

Plus it has OP Hype Jump

I'm getting different numbers from what I just recorded, which also roughly match up with a LibreOffice document I just found. The outcome is the same though. Excuse the slight inacurracies though.

Shot	Stock	Pop
1	0.00	0.00
2	0.63	0.31
3	1.26	1.73
4	1.90	2.03
5	2.51	3.45
6	3.15	3.76

The document also covers anything beyond the 6th shot, and says that with optimal reloads, Stock beats Soda until the 9th shot (Stock 6.7s vs Soda 7.033s), assuming optimal reloads. At the 10th shot and beyond, Soda wins, hands down. I dunno how much I can trust this data due to its age though, but I definitely trust the recording.
Hype is incredibly busted though, mainly for denying Soldiers and Demos so hard, among other things. This and super long fights are clear advantages Soda has over stock.

One thing's for sure - I need to do more science.

[Rando the Crit Clown]

Originally posted by Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp:

Originally posted by Rando the Crit Clown:

I will re-do the math to fact check verify

Stock	Pop
0.00	0.00
0.62	0.31
1.25	1.44
1.87	1.75
2.50	2.89
3.12	3.20

I was wrong but the Soda Popper is still 100% faster on that second shot, which can kill everyone but Heavy, then the rest of the shots are pretty comparable. After the 6th shot the Soda Popper would obviously get an enormous lead due to the Scattergun now needing to reload.

Plus it has OP Hype Jump

I'm getting different numbers from what I just recorded, which also roughly match up with a LibreOffice document I just found. The outcome is the same though. Excuse the slight inacurracies though.

Shot	Stock	Pop
1	0.00	0.00
2	0.63	0.31
3	1.26	1.73
4	1.90	2.03
5	2.51	3.45
6	3.15	3.76

The document also covers anything beyond the 6th shot, and says that with optimal reloads, Stock beats Soda until the 9th shot (Stock 6.7s vs Soda 7.033s), assuming optimal reloads. At the 10th shot and beyond, Soda wins, hands down. I dunno how much I can trust this data due to its age though, but I definitely trust the recording.
Hype is incredibly busted though, mainly for denying Soldiers and Demos so hard, among other things. This and super long fights are clear advantages Soda has over stock.

My numbers were wrong again

Either way, it's still 100% faster on the second shot (which can do up to 210 without boosts) & pretty comparable on the fourth. You shouldn't usually be shooting 5+ times in a row, but if you are it'd start pulling ahead once stock needs to start reloading.

Maybe not as big of an upgrade to stock as I previously thought, but combining the at worst sidegrade to stock results of the primary fire with the additional Hype Jump secondary fire makes it clearly better. 312ms is unreactable, it's basically able to oneshot people.

[riZn]

If you're a beginner, Stock.

Force-A-Nature is fun but will mess with your muscle memory.

[Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp]

Originally posted by Rando the Crit Clown:

Originally posted by Fireschlong #2Broke4MannUp:

I'm getting different numbers from what I just recorded, which also roughly match up with a LibreOffice document I just found. The outcome is the same though. Excuse the slight inacurracies though.

Shot	Stock	Pop
1	0.00	0.00
2	0.63	0.31
3	1.26	1.73
4	1.90	2.03
5	2.51	3.45
6	3.15	3.76

The document also covers anything beyond the 6th shot, and says that with optimal reloads, Stock beats Soda until the 9th shot (Stock 6.7s vs Soda 7.033s), assuming optimal reloads. At the 10th shot and beyond, Soda wins, hands down. I dunno how much I can trust this data due to its age though, but I definitely trust the recording.
Hype is incredibly busted though, mainly for denying Soldiers and Demos so hard, among other things. This and super long fights are clear advantages Soda has over stock.

My numbers were wrong again

Either way, it's still 100% faster on the second shot (which can do up to 210 without boosts) & pretty comparable on the fourth. You shouldn't usually be shooting 5+ times in a row, but if you are it'd start pulling ahead once stock needs to start reloading.

Maybe not as big of an upgrade to stock as I previously thought, but combining the at worst sidegrade to stock results of the primary fire with the additional Hype Jump secondary fire makes it clearly better. 312ms is unreactable, it's basically able to oneshot people.

Can agree on that. The second shot is exactly why I consider Soda vs Stock a burst vs consistency tradeoff. Any Medic that gets hit by two near-instant meatshots just dies. Beyond that, stock becomes stronger for a while, until Soda catches up again. It's a perfect sidegrade as far as I'm concerned (at least if we ignore hype).

[pocketful of sunshine]

soda popper fun and a direct upgrade
stock feels better.. you dont see many good scouts using sp for a reason (idk the reason im not a good scout)
and for fan... plz.. i cant interfere as swearing by fan is a canon event for scout mains