Team Fortress 2
Why 2 scouts, 2 soldiers, demoman and medic?
I mean, about that very strange 6vs6 "meta".Even that word "meta" is idiotic, because it is kind of forced rule. So... why? Why two scouts? It's low-health class, heavy with good aim can counter him. Yeah, why no heavy? Why medic? 6 damage class would be good, it's not MvM, he even has no shiled.Two soliders, well, it's okay, it's universal class. No engineer... well, 6vs6 is dynamic battle, but gunslinger maybe could help. Explain, please.
Originally posted by BROCCOLI:
Competive got some beef with weapon balances. bans natasha cause its too effective... might as well ban all weapons that have stats and just stick with the stock weapons

And the meta.. might as well make that a fixed thing for 6s sinces you dont want games being ruined

Goodbye to diverse and versatile gameplay that tf2 was really made for(many weapons and classes) thanks to restrictions and meta mind set.
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Showing 1-15 of 147 comments
aw dangit Jul 24, 2018 @ 7:49am 
Is this for real? I guess I'll explain.

Scout has the fastest base movement speed in the game along with the base best mobility (without the use of weapons) because of the double jump. The reason scout is chosen over heavy or engie is purely because of mobility. Sure heavy is better for defending last point, but you cant win if you dont push, and heavy is just too low to initiate fights compared to scout. Heavy does not counter scout as scout can play corners and can run away and get health quickly if needed.

Medic is absolutely crucial as healing from the medigun is infinite while health packs are finite for a certain amount of time. The ability to have +24 health per second for your team is essential for winning team fights.

There's nothing stopping you from running other classes, the meta has been established as the best combination of classes to win. Using offclasses is common when defending or pushing last points, because heavy and engie are better than scout at defending, and sniper is better at getting crucial picks at a safe range.
Last edited by aw dangit; Jul 24, 2018 @ 7:52am
Trusted Jul 24, 2018 @ 7:50am 
Medic heals the soldiers and demomen. Scouts get health packs. Scouts are very speedy, and can usually take a heavy out if they have an idea of what this thing called "dodging" is. Plus, there wouldn't even be another heavy on the enemy team. But overall, metas are stupid. Play how you want, don't let other players tell you how to play.
Last edited by Trusted; Jul 24, 2018 @ 7:51am
fakeloo Jul 24, 2018 @ 7:53am 
Originally posted by Fission Power:
Why medic? 6 damage class would be good, it's not MvM, he even has no shiled.
how are you still asking this at 3k hours
Fission Power Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:00am 
Okay, scouts are just for mobility, I get it.
Originally posted by chris_the_crafter763:
Heavy does not counter scout as scout can play corners and can run away and get health quickly if needed.
Natasha heavy? Good wweapon created special to counter that colibries.
You cannot hide, coward.

Originally posted by chris_the_crafter763:
I

Medic is absolutely crucial as healing from the medigun is infinite while health packs are finite for a certain amount of time. The ability to have +24 health per second for your team is essential for winning team fights.
Well, two 200 HP soldier can more than 300 HP and healboi, am I right? Or 200 HP soldier and 300 HP heavy.

Originally posted by chris_the_crafter763:
the meta has been established as the best combination of classes to win.
Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. So team with heavy or engineer is weaker than with 2 scouts?
Is it game disbalance?
76561198357292090 Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:23am 
Originally posted by Fission Power:
So... why? Why two scouts? It's low-health class, heavy with good aim can counter him.

Yes, Heavy has not met a man who can outsmart bullet. However what makes scout so reliable in sixes is both his decent range due to the pistol, his amazing burst damage due to the scatter gun, and most importantly his speed. His speed is not just in terms of mobility and how fast he moves his nimble little ass, but his cap speed. Scouts make it perfectly viable for back caps to happen, very rarely is a spy needed for a back cap.

Originally posted by Fission Power:
Yeah, why no heavy?

Because the heavy is too slow against the likes of two soldiers, a demo man and scout. He's basically free food unless he has godly tracking skills, game sense and a god tier medic.

Originally posted by Fission Power:
Why medic?

Being able to build kritzkrieg is really fast, specially with the Scout you seem too eager to ♥♥♥♥ on.


Originally posted by Fission Power:
No engineer... well, 6vs6 is dynamic battle, but gunslinger maybe could help. Explain, please.

Engineer with gunslinger, IF HE CAN SET UP, is a great antiscout, the problem is that without that extra scout there's no one to harass the Roamer Soldier and Demoman constantly and get away with it.

With that said "offclassing" is allowed, and can be useful, pyro armed with the detonator or scorch shot is used by b4nny to deny roamers, and scouts. Heavy, sniper, and engineer is used by most teams to create chokes, or guard the last point. However running any of these, specially pyro, after the blue moon update is suicide in an OFFICIAL high level competitive environment.
Last edited by 76561198357292090; Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:23am
76561197975748082 Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:24am 
Dude just don play 6s unless your good at scout,soldier,demo or medic. They already build it towards that structure, theres really no point in arguing about it. The real qns is why 6 players ?
trash Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:26am 
Originally posted by Fission Power:
Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. So team with heavy or engineer is weaker than with 2 scouts?
Is it game disbalance?
heavy/engie are slow, lack flexibility, and take time to be effective
they're used nearly all of the time to defend last points since they're good at that
they're just not used for situations where you need to be able to quickly move around or switch from defending to attacking
Last edited by trash; Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:26am
76561198357292090 Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:48am 
Originally posted by BROCCOLI:
The real qns is why 6 players ?

The reason why the paid pro scene for TF2 is 6 players is because it's cheaper to sponsor 6 players an their subs than it is 9 plus their subs. The reason why Valve chose to make the "official" comp mode abomination right now 6s is because it's less of a logistical nightmare than 9s. As is right now comp's matchmaking takes 20 mins to an 1 hour to find a match, and half the time the teams are unbalanced with a bunch of noobs and a couple of ranked people.
Originally posted by Fission Power:
I mean, about that very strange 6vs6 "meta".Even that word "meta" is idiotic, because it is kind of forced rule. So... why? Why two scouts? It's low-health class, heavy with good aim can counter him. Yeah, why no heavy? Why medic? 6 damage class would be good, it's not MvM, he even has no shiled.Two soliders, well, it's okay, it's universal class. No engineer... well, 6vs6 is dynamic battle, but gunslinger maybe could help. Explain, please.

Demomen are restricted to 1, if they were it'd probably be 3 demomen and 3 medics...

Scouts and Soldiers get picked next because of them being generalists. They've got great power and mobility options going for them. They're less situational then the other classes and they're fun to both play and to watch.

And no, it's not forced either... Scouts and Soldiers off class all the time during matches. More so when it comes to defending the final point you'll start seeing them do this.
Last edited by Kitt 🌟 Stargazer; Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:53am
76561197975748082 Jul 24, 2018 @ 8:57am 
I think this meta needs to change. Or a new 6s that allows all classes. to be run full time and not just situational anymore
Last edited by BROCCOLI; Jul 24, 2018 @ 9:07am
Originally posted by BROCCOLI:
I think this meta needs to change. Or a new 6s that allows all classes.

It actually changes depending on game mode from what I've seen... Some cater better to specific classes then others. It's just that 5CP is really dominate towards Soldiers, Scouts, Demomen and a Medic since they're great at both attacking and defending and getting around the map quickly.

Also, there's no chance you'll get a meta that allows all classes to be generalist, that's just not impossible. Not to mention they wouldn't really be generalist if all classes could be equally played at the same time.
Last edited by Kitt 🌟 Stargazer; Jul 24, 2018 @ 9:01am
trash Jul 24, 2018 @ 9:04am 
Originally posted by BROCCOLI:
I think this meta needs to change.
it has
a lot over the years
scouts are now considered much stronger than they used to be since the players have gotten better
demo was nerfed in 2014 and now holds less stopping power than he used to
Or a new 6s that allows all classes.
all classes are used
they're just situational
Fission Power Jul 24, 2018 @ 9:19am 
Oh by the way, anothe question. About that "restrictions". Was is so necessary for 6vs6? What, two demomen are too OP, they will fuse and create DemoArchon? Or 6 soldiers? Cannot more balanced team destroy 6 soldiers? So what point of that limitations?
Originally posted by Fission Power:
Oh by the way, anothe question. About that "restrictions". Was is so necessary for 6vs6? What, two demomen are too OP, they will fuse and create DemoArchon? Or 6 soldiers? Cannot more balanced team destroy 6 soldiers? So what point of that limitations?

3 Demoman and 3 medics would close off all ways around the map with stickies. You'd just be shut down the entire game.
trash Jul 24, 2018 @ 9:25am 
Originally posted by Fission Power:
Oh by the way, anothe question. About that "restrictions". Was is so necessary for 6vs6? What, two demomen are too OP, they will fuse and create DemoArchon? Or 6 soldiers? Cannot more balanced team destroy 6 soldiers? So what point of that limitations?
it's not fun nor skillful to play with class stacking
some stacks are above and beyond any other team composition by far
having 2+ medics for example fundamentally destroys the concept of uber advantage while making it significantly harder to kill a single medic all the while slowing the game to a crawl since neither team's players can die

2scout/2soldier/1demo/1medic is by far the most skillful, fun, and flexible team comp you can run
it enables easy offclasses without requiring the enemy team to run their own counter to them

ironically, by de-limiting some of the other classes, the meta would shift to team comps with even less class variety due to how strong stacking can be
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Date Posted: Jul 24, 2018 @ 7:45am
Posts: 147