Nerf the Darwin’s Danger Shield

[misut]

I feel that this weapon is a crutch. Mainly because it not only neutralizes Pyros main way to pester the sniper effectively, but it has no work on the snipers part. Why un-scope and dodge that flare when you can just stand there and click? It’s basically teaching new snipers to stand there without in-scoping, rather than un-scoping and moving out of the way.


If I had to nerf it, I would personally remove the 50% fire resistance, and just keep the afterburn immunity. Either that, or nerf he resistance by half, so it’s at least somewhat reasonable.

If the weapon should stay untouched, then I think that it should be because sniper itself is nerfed, which would make the DDS fair
Thoughts?

[Loving Wound]

Also reduce the effectiveness of the afterburn immune to the level of Pyro's because it's ridlcious that just equiping the Darwin's Danger Shield makes it impossible for a Dragon's Fury Pyro to get the increased damage on burning players. The fact that Dragon's Fury can get the damage increase on Pyro, BUT NOT DDS SNIPERS is ridiclious

[Uscari]

I actually think it's balanced, the fact that the Sniper has to change his secondary just to protect him from flares to me is quite rewarding.

It doesen't even counter pyros fully, since if a Pyro closes the distance, it's very easy to kill a DDS Sniper. Just airblast and melee, or use shotgun.

[i killed god]

In order to equip DDS, a sniper has to give up on:

• Rechargeable splash projectile that gives anyone hitting that target minicrits
  
• Passive health regen that completely nullifies flinch when fully charged
  
• 120 DPS fully automatic 25 bullet secondary
  
• Rechargeable one-time defense against backstabs

And what does the sniper get? Immunity to afterburn and lower fire damage. What does this mean? It means that pyros can't spam scorch shot on snipers all the way across the map and make them completely useless anymore. Does it mean that a sniper will stand a fighting chance against a pyro at close range? ♥♥♥♥ no, and if you're dying to a sniper at close range as a pyro, you should seriously uninstall. For one, he can't jarate>bushwacka you. If he has his sniper out, you can melee him or just WM1. If he has his melee out, airblast+M1.

[blue sphere]

I detect a salty Pyro main that doesn't want to accept the fact that he can't spam scorch shot like a dumbass

[Chinaball]

Change up your playstyle instead of relying on scotch shots to inflict damage.

[misut]

Originally posted by Daddy #removerandomcrits:

In order to equip DDS, a sniper has to give up on:

• Rechargeable splash projectile that gives anyone hitting that target minicrits
  
• Passive health regen that completely nullifies flinch when fully charged
  
• 120 DPS fully automatic 25 bullet secondary
  
• Rechargeable one-time defense against backstabs

And what does the sniper get? Immunity to afterburn and lower fire damage. What does this mean? It means that pyros can't spam scorch shot on snipers all the way across the map and make them completely useless anymore. Does it mean that a sniper will stand a fighting chance against a pyro at close range? ♥♥♥♥ no, and if you're dying to a sniper at close range as a pyro, you should seriously uninstall. For one, he can't jarate>bushwacka you. If he has his sniper out, you can melee him or just WM1. If he has his melee out, airblast+M1.

Good snipers shouldn’t be getting hit by scorch shots anyways. It’s a crutch since it takes no effort on the snipers part to dodge projectiles.

If there’s one argument I could see here being viable, it’s that you’re replacing the Jarate, which can be considered a bad trade off, considering the utility on that thing, but it’s most likely going to be nerfed, due to both casual and competitive complaints.

Losing out on an smg is nothing. Learning to quickscope outdamages using an smg, so that’s not a bad trade off. It’s a very positive one.

If you’re letting a pyro get to you as a sniper, then that’s the sniper or the teams fault. If that sniper or the team mananged to let the pyro get to the sniper (which in a considerable distance from spawns and sniper areas), then they deserved to be punished. Severely.

As for combatting pyros close range, it’s not about losing the fight to a sniper, but letting it take so long to kill the sniper. Yes you can melee him, but then you need to be even closer, and if that sniper knows how to headshot close range, than that’s suicide.

Shotgunning can work, but you have to realize that not all pyros use shotguns, they generally use flares. Especially in pubs, considering the average joe doesn’t use secondaries, most just their primary.

My main gripe isn’t that though, it’s that it further hardens the fact that sniper hard counters pyro. Classes shouldn’t be able to hard countered. They should have fights where there’s a chance for the weaker side to win. Shotgunning only really works in mid-close range, and trying to play pyro against sniper is just suicide. You have to get past the infinite range the rifle in order to use the shotgun effectively, which is mainly an issue on sniper being broken but regardless

[i killed god]

Originally posted by mints:

Good snipers shouldn’t be getting hit by scorch shots anyways. It’s a crutch since it takes no effort on the snipers part to dodge projectiles.

If there’s one argument I could see here being viable, it’s that you’re replacing the Jarate, which can be considered a bad trade off, considering the utility on that thing, but it’s most likely going to be nerfed, due to both casual and competitive complaints.

Losing out on an smg is nothing. Learning to quickscope outdamages using an smg, so that’s not a bad trade off. It’s a very positive one.

If you’re letting a pyro get to you as a sniper, then that’s the sniper or the teams fault. If that sniper or the team mananged to let the pyro get to the sniper (which in a considerable distance from spawns and sniper areas), then they deserved to be punished. Severely.

As for combatting pyros close range, it’s not about losing the fight to a sniper, but letting it take so long to kill the sniper. Yes you can melee him, but then you need to be even closer, and if that sniper knows how to headshot close range, than that’s suicide.

Shotgunning can work, but you have to realize that not all pyros use shotguns, they generally use flares. Especially in pubs, considering the average joe doesn’t use secondaries, most just their primary.

My main gripe isn’t that though, it’s that it further hardens the fact that sniper hard counters pyro. Classes shouldn’t be able to hard countered. They should have fights where there’s a chance for the weaker side to win. Shotgunning only really works in mid-close range, and trying to play pyro against sniper is just suicide. You have to get past the infinite range the rifle in order to use the shotgun effectively, which is mainly an issue on sniper being broken but regardless

Avoiding flares and whatnot actually does take effort; the sniper needs to unscope and lose his kill opportunity AND charge just to avoid your infinitely spammable garbage. This entire post honestly just sounds like major salt that a long range class is switched to their unlockable to counter your long range spam and instead of switching to spy or doing anything about it, you kept getting headshot while trying to spam scorch shots at them. Again, DDS is perfectly fine the way it is.

[misut]

Originally posted by Daddy #removerandomcrits:

Originally posted by mints:

Good snipers shouldn’t be getting hit by scorch shots anyways. It’s a crutch since it takes no effort on the snipers part to dodge projectiles.

If there’s one argument I could see here being viable, it’s that you’re replacing the Jarate, which can be considered a bad trade off, considering the utility on that thing, but it’s most likely going to be nerfed, due to both casual and competitive complaints.

Losing out on an smg is nothing. Learning to quickscope outdamages using an smg, so that’s not a bad trade off. It’s a very positive one.

If you’re letting a pyro get to you as a sniper, then that’s the sniper or the teams fault. If that sniper or the team mananged to let the pyro get to the sniper (which in a considerable distance from spawns and sniper areas), then they deserved to be punished. Severely.

As for combatting pyros close range, it’s not about losing the fight to a sniper, but letting it take so long to kill the sniper. Yes you can melee him, but then you need to be even closer, and if that sniper knows how to headshot close range, than that’s suicide.

Shotgunning can work, but you have to realize that not all pyros use shotguns, they generally use flares. Especially in pubs, considering the average joe doesn’t use secondaries, most just their primary.

My main gripe isn’t that though, it’s that it further hardens the fact that sniper hard counters pyro. Classes shouldn’t be able to hard countered. They should have fights where there’s a chance for the weaker side to win. Shotgunning only really works in mid-close range, and trying to play pyro against sniper is just suicide. You have to get past the infinite range the rifle in order to use the shotgun effectively, which is mainly an issue on sniper being broken but regardless

Avoiding flares and whatnot actually does take effort; the sniper needs to unscope and lose his kill opportunity AND charge just to avoid your infinitely spammable garbage. This entire post honestly just sounds like major salt that a long range class is switched to their unlockable to counter your long range spam and instead of switching to spy or doing anything about it, you kept getting headshot while trying to spam scorch shots at them. Again, DDS is perfectly fine the way it is.

I feel as though your whole argument is based off the salt that occurs when you get hit by the scorch shot as a sniper, and the salt that comes from pyro as a class itself.

I despise the scorch shot too, since the stupid knock back and second flare explosion shouldn’t exist.

But should the other flares like the flare gun and detonator that take somewhat aim be punished?

Anyways, counter classing is a solution, I already know that. However, sniper is basically a class without counters.

There’s a reason why the sniper is favored by script kiddies, it’s because a good sniper can always shut down every class in existence.

Spy? Situational Awareness, Team Comms, and quick scope. Spy is basically hindered by the fact that every class has access to the first two I mentioned, including sniper.

Bombing Soldier or Demo?

Charge body shot and crater, or headshot.

Literally no other classes have the able to somewhat counter sniper effectively other than sniper itself. So if you think it’s fine that no other classes should be able to somewhat fight back against the class with no counters. I don’t see no reason why a class like that should be able to permanently hard counter the second weakest class in the game, with a single weapkn

[Uncle Ben]

Originally posted by mints:

I feel that this weapon is a crutch. Mainly because it not only neutralizes Pyros main way to pester the sniper effectively, but it has no work on the snipers part. Why un-scope and dodge that flare when you can just stand there and click? It’s basically teaching new snipers to stand there without in-scoping, rather than un-scoping and moving out of the way.


If I had to nerf it, I would personally remove the 50% fire resistance, and just keep the afterburn immunity. Either that, or nerf he resistance by half, so it’s at least somewhat reasonable.

Thoughts?

Crutch means that this weapon limits the things a good player can do but helps a bad player. In this case the dds is completely usable for newbies and better players if there are lots of flare pyros in the enemy team. The unscope + dodge thing will only work if you see a pyro trowing flares at you. If not you will be flinching and burning for about 10 seconds.

[Uncle Ben]

Originally posted by mints:

Originally posted by Daddy #removerandomcrits:

Avoiding flares and whatnot actually does take effort; the sniper needs to unscope and lose his kill opportunity AND charge just to avoid your infinitely spammable garbage. This entire post honestly just sounds like major salt that a long range class is switched to their unlockable to counter your long range spam and instead of switching to spy or doing anything about it, you kept getting headshot while trying to spam scorch shots at them. Again, DDS is perfectly fine the way it is.

I feel as though your whole argument is based off the salt that occurs when you get hit by the scorch shot as a sniper, and the salt that comes from pyro as a class itself.

I despise the scorch shot too, since the stupid knock back and second flare explosion shouldn’t exist.

But should the other flares like the flare gun and detonator that take somewhat aim be punished?

Anyways, counter classing is a solution, I already know that. However, sniper is basically a class without counters.

There’s a reason why the sniper is favored by script kiddies, it’s because a good sniper can always shut down every class in existence.

Spy? Situational Awareness, Team Comms, and quick scope. Spy is basically hindered by the fact that every class has access to the first two I mentioned, including sniper.

Bombing Soldier or Demo?

Charge body shot and crater, or headshot.

Literally no other classes have the able to somewhat counter sniper effectively other than sniper itself. So if you think it’s fine that no other classes should be able to somewhat fight back against the class with no counters. I don’t see no reason why a class like that should be able to permanently hard counter the second weakest class in the game, with a single weapkn

Spy is the counter to sniper. Also the sniper can counter sniper.

[Lucki__Fan2011]

It's not a crutch. It's a passive use item.

Regardless, DDS is just a pyro-specific version of the CC. I cannot tell you how many times the CC has saved me from a lucky flare or a rushing pyro. The DDS is very specified and situational. It wouldn'tske sense to nerf it.

[misut]

Originally posted by Onyx:

Originally posted by mints:

I feel as though your whole argument is based off the salt that occurs when you get hit by the scorch shot as a sniper, and the salt that comes from pyro as a class itself.

I despise the scorch shot too, since the stupid knock back and second flare explosion shouldn’t exist.

But should the other flares like the flare gun and detonator that take somewhat aim be punished?

Anyways, counter classing is a solution, I already know that. However, sniper is basically a class without counters.

There’s a reason why the sniper is favored by script kiddies, it’s because a good sniper can always shut down every class in existence.

Spy? Situational Awareness, Team Comms, and quick scope. Spy is basically hindered by the fact that every class has access to the first two I mentioned, including sniper.

Bombing Soldier or Demo?

Charge body shot and crater, or headshot.

Literally no other classes have the able to somewhat counter sniper effectively other than sniper itself. So if you think it’s fine that no other classes should be able to somewhat fight back against the class with no counters. I don’t see no reason why a class like that should be able to permanently hard counter the second weakest class in the game, with a single weapkn

Spy is the counter to sniper. Also the sniper can counter sniper.

I think you skipped the parts where I addressed those two points in the comment you responded to. Reread those parts, and let men know what you think of it

[supadog]

it is a crap unlock for people who can't dodge flares, it needs no more changes, especially considering how it was before

[Lucki__Fan2011]

Originally posted by supadog:

it is a crap unlock for people who can't dodge flares, it needs no more changes, especially considering how it was before

"Lol how can you not dodge a flare when you can't see it"

[misut]

Originally posted by 6th 7th 8th 9th man:

It's not a crutch. It's a passive use item.

Regardless, DDS is just a pyro-specific version of the CC. I cannot tell you how many times the CC has saved me from a lucky flare or a rushing pyro. The DDS is very specified and situational. It wouldn'tske sense to nerf it.

No lie, the CC is my personal favorite sniper secondary.

With that out of the way, I don’t think a sniper with the DDS is fair.

It removes the most effective way for pyros to somewhat pester the sniper. Considering how overpowered he is in in the state he is right now, I don’t think giving him weapons that negate effective pester options is a good idea. Pyro by himself is countered by sniper, even without flares. To fully hard counter classes is a no go for me, since I believe that all classes should have the option fight back, regardless of weapons/loadouts.

Spy vs Pyro is a good example, since the Spy can be lit on fire, making his invisible watches useless, but he can fight back effectively with the spy cicle, dead-ringer, and revolvers, without guaranteed death.

But with sniper vs pyro, it’s essentially impossible for a pyro to somewhat “check” the sniper with the DDS. He can’t go up to him and use his primary since mostly likely the sniper will be holding down the sightline, and other pathways are defended by other classes like soldier or engineer. At least with flares, pyros can somewhat pester snipers, but with the DDS, there’s no viable way to fight back against a sniper. Which is why I dislike how the DDS is as of now

Looking back, I think I should’ve added in that for the option to keep the weapon it is, nerf sniper a bit.

Thank you though for making a response that doesn’t involve claiming that I’m the pyro that likes to spam scorch shots against snipers, but with thought.