Turtling is a big problem.

[sonicluke8]

When a round takes over 30 minutes, Your kdr is 1/100, And there's 50 engies, AKA turtling. No spy, Uber push or anything can stop it, And i'm sick of it. I'm sick of saying "Guys, Let me turn in my contract" or "Just end the round this map sucks" But everybody says friendlies ruin TF2, And tryhards ruin TF2. Well, Tryhards play the game to win, And friendlies play on silly servers, However 3,000 engies ruin the game. So is there any way to avoid idiots who get in 3 hours stalemates? I really need an answer, Or at least a way to make them quit or kill them all? Alright: So I found a few answers that are ok: Sapper+uber, Spies and demoes, Take over mid and medic/heavy combo. Thanks for the suggestions. I will mark an answer.

[aw dangit]

Originally posted by Libre Cuba:

Originally posted by chris_the_crafter763:

Uber + demo = ez

I've killed many 5+ engie nests with ease.

That won't work when the sentries are well spread out.

What kind of map is spread out yet chokey enough for engines to be a problem?

[Trusted]

Git 3 demomen with 3 medics, the 3 medics will pop the demomen and the demomens explosive balls will penetrate the nest.

[Ross the shucklenite]

Originally posted by Gespenstisch:

Git 3 demomen with 3 medics, the 3 medics will pop the demomen and the demomens explosive balls will penetrate the nest.

"Explosive balls" Sounds like a medical disorder

[Trusted]

Originally posted by Ross the shucklenite:

Originally posted by Gespenstisch:

Git 3 demomen with 3 medics, the 3 medics will pop the demomen and the demomens explosive balls will penetrate the nest.

"Explosive balls" Sounds like a medical disorder

It's a joke from winglet's taunt fortress 2

[Trollgineer]

Play medic yourself, you can lead the uber push.

[Mr. Jizzard The Tentacle Wizard]

Engi should be reworked to be more mobile, and his buildings should be nerfed to do less overall, with less upgrade costs. That would discourage turtling and encourge mobility.

[JumpingBarista]

Everyone says use an Uber, yet nobody plays medic and nobody has a brain to help.

[Trusted]

Originally posted by JumpingBarista:

Everyone says use an Uber, yet nobody plays medic and nobody has a brain to help.

I've seen alot of people play medic. But I only play on achievement engineer servers and minecraft "world" servers. So idk

[Kitt 🌟 Stargazer]

Originally posted by JumpingBarista:

Everyone says use an Uber, yet nobody plays medic and nobody has a brain to help.

I find that Engineers can still nullify ubers or at least stall them by himself to make them significantly less effective thanks to his weapon picks. Spreading out sentries well enough for starters is one of the biggest ways to do it. But then you can just poop out a wrangler and tripple the sentries health. There's also rescue Ranger to teleport your sentry away when it's about to die.

If there's enough sentries spread out though, it's significantly easier to set them up on places like pl_upward since the final point is right next to the defending teams spawn. While ubers take time to build altogether. If you can't destroy every sentry fast enough, the engineers will get everything back up and running faster then you can take them down.

Again though, I see that as a fault for the map pl_upward as much as a fault of engineers though. That last point is just ridiculous IMO...

[JumpingBarista]

No matter what, people always find loopholes to any strategy to keep against turtles and unfairly unbalancing teams.

In left 4 Dead, you can break through walls and go into outer limits of the map, and shoot away and survive basically forever, Valve attempted to fix this by spawning spitter acid (For the people who don’t play any games but TF2, it’s essentially ♥♥♥♥ that hurts you bad and quick) in places where the map deemed out of bounds, but people found areas where they acid can’t even spawn and the whole thing came back the way it was.

We can’t really fix a design flaw in Engineer that easily, it all depends on a multitude of factors that are sometimes out of valves control.

[Chaos Epoch]

Originally posted by Kitt 🌟 Stargazer:

Originally posted by Chaos Epoch:

Sniper. Demo and Spy are the strongest Engienest killers. Heavy is also powerful provided they can get into close range.

Machina or upgraded Bargain kills SG's incredibly fast. Not to mention the threat they pose to Engies.

Don't disregard the threat that Red Tape recorder poses. It's unlikely that you'll kill buildings with regular Sapper when there's a massive Engie buildup. But the metal wastage and suddenly unupgraded buildings that Red Tape causes can be critical.

Set up two engienests of your own. It's unlikely that they'll push and break yours but two tele setups will surely break them.

Machina I wish penetraited engineers buildings. I'd honestly consider using it more if it did. When they get around to removing the increase damage for fully charged shots, I hope they allow it to at least allow me to headshot engineers behind their buildings.

The problem with red tape recorder is that if it doesn't downgrade anything, it's usually worse then the stock. Even if it doesn't destroy a building, it still damages it forcing the engineer to repair it. It also stacks better if your team pushes in while your sapping stuff.

The problem with spy against engineers is that when he's found out he's done. If a sentry is up he has no means of defending himself without the sentry wrecking him. Spy is one of the easiest classes to shutdown in the game currently as well.

Last point is moot on attack vs defense maps were one team focuses attacking and the other defense. Which is where this problem is the most noticable.

While I beleive that the Machina should never have the damage bonus reduced on it, I'll leave that out of it. However I don't think Valve will ever allow penetration behind buildings, unless there is a severe damage reduction behind them. Engie was supposed to be able to hide behind them and repair them, before the abomanation known as Rescue Ranger came along. However a full charge followed by a quick shot will often kill a SG before engie has a chance to pull out the fair and ballanced Wrangler.

Red Tape will have downgraded one building by the time another one is desapped and the engie gets to it. Meaning that after 4 whacks there will be one level two building. (Assuming all are level three.)

Now, a dead building is far better then one which has been unupgraded. But you're unlikely to get a kill anyway in such a situation. However, damage which can be knocked out with one swing because of regular sapper required 8 swings (and 200 metal) because of Red Tape. Quickly draining Dispencer reserves and hopefully preventing much of a fight coming out of Engie on a push. Not to mention that it gives plently of distraction for a easy backstab. Red Tape is hot garbage but it does have it's uses. Sometimes.

I never play Attack/Defence or Capture the Flag for that very reason.

[skibidi rizzler]

thats why ctf sucks

[Trusted]

Originally posted by Sham!:

Originally posted by Gespenstisch:

Git 3 demomen with 3 medics, the 3 medics will pop the demomen and the demomens explosive balls will penetrate the nest.

yeah dude, coordinate half a pub team cause of 4 texan bois
and good luck if they have half a brain and run stuff like the wrangler

You don't have to be so r00d about it. I mean, half of it was a joke.

[Kitt 🌟 Stargazer]

Originally posted by Sham!:

Originally posted by Kitt 🌟 Stargazer:

Again though, I see that as a fault for the map pl_upward as much as a fault of engineers though. That last point is just ridiculous IMO...

last points are supposed to be hard to push, it's normal, and they work perfectly when there aren't 4 of the same (defensive) class

demo and heavy honstly suffer the same issue, pushing against stuff like 4 demos is a tumor especially if they can play the videogame

That map in particular over does it though. Allow another means for spies to get up to the upper sections by the defending teams spawn, fix it that engineers cannot build dispensers to block the stairs by the defending teams spawn.

That and fix the one room were offense teams can place a tele exit before the door shuts when the second to last point is captured by making it adding a "no build" zone in between the doors.

[GroovySoap]

Originally posted by Ross the shucklenite:

Turtles are majestic

Someone make a set of Turtle Engineer Cosmetics