Ifan

[CTHOMP]

I decided to play my first playthrough building ranger/summoner Ifan.

Will i get the animal talking talent when I get the collar off or did I need to take it when first building character in order to converse with the black cat and the squirrel)?

[Stormwind]

When you remove the collar you get the ability to absorb and cast source, not pet pal.

You could have taken pet pal at the start, but you do get more talents eventually as you go up in levels so you can choose it later.

[Chaoslink]

*cringes at the ranger/summoner comment*

I’ve never been that sure about how Ifan and his apparently innate Pet Pal talent works. Never really use Ifan much to have learned, generic human male with tragic backstory, so edgy *yawn*. If you didn’t start with it, you probably have to take it manually.

[CTHOMP]

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

*cringes at the ranger/summoner comment*

I’ve never been that sure about how Ifan and his apparently innate Pet Pal talent works. Never really use Ifan much to have learned, generic human male with tragic backstory, so edgy *yawn*. If you didn’t start with it, you probably have to take it manually.

Is ranger/summoner not a good first time build for ifan? What do you recommend?

My goal is to do some achievements and I know Ifan is one character that you need to play as main character.

[Chaoslink]

Technically all characters have an achievement specifically for playing as them. So who you pick first time doesn’t necessarily matter as you’ll eventually play them all if you’re going for achievements.

As for Ranger/Summoner, it won’t matter too much on a lower difficulty setting. However, there’s literally no synergy between the two skills. Nothing you do with one skill is helping the other function and Summoning naturally has high scaling early game and low scaling late game. This is because it lacks a scaling attribute. So to see Summoning at full power, you want to invest only summoning until you cap the skill at 10 points.

Ideally, you’d want to break this build into two characters, having one dedicated summoner and a dedicated archer. They just don’t have enough skill points to split between what each skill demands and still be effective. If you’re on a lower difficulty It’ll be fine, but even on Classic this setup won’t be doing you any favors.

[Chaoslink]

If you like the concept, do it. Especially if you’re on Classic or lower. Just know that Summoning tends to fall off in the later game due the the lack of a scaling attribute, though it’s still viable. However, to make the best use of it you’ll need 18 of your 21 skill points by the end of the game to do that. Doesn’t leave much room for archer stuff. Archers are the hardest hitting weapon based class the game offers and can be the most versatile as well. They also need more of their points to achieve that. If you go half and half, neither will reach their full potential as you get into the later game and your action economy will start getting messy.

[CTHOMP]

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

If you like the concept, do it. Especially if you’re on Classic or lower. Just know that Summoning tends to fall off in the later game due the the lack of a scaling attribute, though it’s still viable. However, to make the best use of it you’ll need 18 of your 21 skill points by the end of the game to do that. Doesn’t leave much room for archer stuff. Archers are the hardest hitting weapon based class the game offers and can be the most versatile as well. They also need more of their points to achieve that. If you go half and half, neither will reach their full potential as you get into the later game and your action economy will start getting messy.

So this guide is either wrong or incorrect/outdated?
https://youtu.be/anbtJ1pnKcg

[Chaoslink]

Originally posted by CTHOMP:

So this guide is either wrong or incorrect/outdated?

Would it surprise you to know that I assumed you were looking at a Fextralife build guide before you linked that? It’s a known build guide to veterans of the forum here and is rather notorious. Many new players use it then come to the forum asking for help because the game proves hard.

It’s more that Fextralife builds are made for flavor rather than effectiveness. They’re almost all full of various inefficiencies of some degree, some much worse than others. Many can be relatively decent builds overall, and still viable to play with, but often there’s many things that are just unnecessary or take more from the build than they add. This is one of the most notorious of them simply because it’s the first result when you search ranger builds for DOS2 on google.

There’s just no synergy in it. Never was.

[Stormwind]

Summoner seems powerful and even OP at the beginning, but by mid or late game your once scary summoned Demon will seem more like Bruce Banner and less like the Hulk.

[CTHOMP]

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

Originally posted by CTHOMP:

So this guide is either wrong or incorrect/outdated?

Would it surprise you to know that I assumed you were looking at a Fextralife build guide before you linked that? It’s a known build guide to veterans of the forum here and is rather notorious. Many new players use it then come to the forum asking for help because the game proves hard.

It’s more that Fextralife builds are made for flavor rather than effectiveness. They’re almost all full of various inefficiencies of some degree, some much worse than others. Many can be relatively decent builds overall, and still viable to play with, but often there’s many things that are just unnecessary or take more from the build than they add. This is one of the most notorious of them simply because it’s the first result when you search ranger builds for DOS2 on google.

There’s just no synergy in it. Never was.

Thanks.

Do you have a good ranger build guide with Ifan I could reference for first playthrough?

I just picked up companions and reached level 2, so it will be easy to startover.

[Yojo0o]

Seconding Chaoslink's assertion that Fextralife builds for this game are generally ass. They range from accidentally decent to entirely nonfunctional.

I don't know a good ranger build guide offhand, but I'd suggest not using one. Build guides in generally are not good in this game, once you've learned what the skills and attributes do. Getting good at this game involves keeping your builds versatile and fluid as you learn what works and what doesn't, as you get the ability to freely change your builds relatively early. Following a strict guide will make you too rigid to adapt when things stop working.

Want to play an effective archer? Stack finesse for better ranged damage, plus a bit of wits for crit and initiative, and put enough points into memory for exactly enough skill slots for your chosen skills. Put a couple points into Huntsman to unlock all the archery skills you need, then pour the rest into Warfare for maximum physical damage scaling, switching to Ranged Weapon skill once Warfare is capped (weapon skills are always secondary to Warfare because their damage bonus is additive, not multiplicative). If you want a bit of utility, put the odd point into other skills for more versatility depending on what the party needs, such as a point in Pyromancy for Haste and Peace of Mind.

[Chaoslink]

Pretty much the above describes a good archer build.

However, you can build a true hybrid damage archer by following the above while also picking up the Venom Coating spell (crafted by combining any Geo book with any Scoundrel book). Use this while buffing your weapon with Elemental Arrowheads from the Huntsman skill for strong magical damage without giving up your physical damage.

Also be on the look out for weapons that have innate magic damage and a rune slot for a magic damage rune. Craft a little poison onto that and you will be dealing more magic damage than physical, while retaining that base physical damage. Very potent if you also have mages in the party, two or more. Otherwise just following the above instructions will yield a good archer.

Just about all build guides focus on flavor. However, you should always be considering what the rest of your team does as well. You want to build a team, not four individuals. They should play off each other just as much as they function solo.

[Chaoslink]

For the team, I’d pair the archer with:

-A dual weapon Rogue or a Two handed knight.
-two mages of your choosing, similar or opposite element types, depending on your preferences.
-If you choose instead, go with one mage and make a dedicated summoner for the second build.

I’ll note that dedicated summoner builds function very well as supports/healers and tanks all in one. Your weapon doesn’t matter much so taking a shield is a good move and you’ll be dipping into every element at some point, meaning you’ll have access to all the healing spells. They summon their incarnate and buff it first turn, then spend the rest of the fight healing and buffing the team.

If you opt into the elemental ranger concept, I’d recommend making that character an elf and using Ifan as the summoner. This gives Ifan the Encourage ability for more buffs and elves can use their racial ability to get the AP needed to buff their magic damage effects and still get the usual two attacks first turn.

[CTHOMP]

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

For the team, I’d pair the archer with:

-A dual weapon Rogue or a Two handed knight.
-two mages of your choosing, similar or opposite element types, depending on your preferences.
-If you choose instead, go with one mage and make a dedicated summoner for the second build.

I’ll note that dedicated summoner builds function very well as supports/healers and tanks all in one. Your weapon doesn’t matter much so taking a shield is a good move and you’ll be dipping into every element at some point, meaning you’ll have access to all the healing spells. They summon their incarnate and buff it first turn, then spend the rest of the fight healing and buffing the team.

If you opt into the elemental ranger concept, I’d recommend making that character an elf and using Ifan as the summoner. This gives Ifan the Encourage ability for more buffs and elves can use their racial ability to get the AP needed to buff their magic damage effects and still get the usual two attacks first turn.

If I wanted to party up with 4 main chars how is this.

Ifan - Ranger/wayfarer
Red Prince - 2-handed fighter, not knight, since he will be tank.
Sebille - Rogue, someone to sneak, steal, etc. Dual wield.
Lohse- Enchanter/healer?

I feel I'm lacking a heavy magic damage dealer. I'd prefer to do a run with Fane in future as main.

[Yojo0o]

Originally posted by CTHOMP:

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

For the team, I’d pair the archer with:

-A dual weapon Rogue or a Two handed knight.
-two mages of your choosing, similar or opposite element types, depending on your preferences.
-If you choose instead, go with one mage and make a dedicated summoner for the second build.

I’ll note that dedicated summoner builds function very well as supports/healers and tanks all in one. Your weapon doesn’t matter much so taking a shield is a good move and you’ll be dipping into every element at some point, meaning you’ll have access to all the healing spells. They summon their incarnate and buff it first turn, then spend the rest of the fight healing and buffing the team.

If you opt into the elemental ranger concept, I’d recommend making that character an elf and using Ifan as the summoner. This gives Ifan the Encourage ability for more buffs and elves can use their racial ability to get the AP needed to buff their magic damage effects and still get the usual two attacks first turn.

If I wanted to party up with 4 main chars how is this.

Ifan - Ranger/wayfarer
Red Prince - 2-handed fighter, not knight, since he will be tank.
Sebille - Rogue, someone to sneak, steal, etc. Dual wield.
Lohse- Enchanter/healer?

I feel I'm lacking a heavy magic damage dealer. I'd prefer to do a run with Fane in future as main.

You should have a 2/2 split between physical and magical damage, or else focus entirely in one direction or the other. With your setup, you'll have three physical damag edealers, leaving Lohse unable to do enough damage to break through magic armor on her own.

You also really don't need to worry about dedicated tank/healer in this game, this isn't that sort of game.

[CTHOMP]

So confusing just trying to figure out how to setup a team. The game seems to have almost too much freedom of choice.

What sort of mages should sebille and lohse be?

Can Red Prince be a fighter with pyro amd geo abilities (that would seem to tie in with his racial bonuses/skills)? Can he "dual class"?