Wits Archer = Ifan's best build

[YSeung]

Definitely

[Vipirio]

wits is nice and all but no finess aint going to do much for ya

[YSeung]

Originally posted by Vipirio:

wits is nice and all but no finess aint going to do much for ya

Yeah finess is the second priority

[Yojo0o]

Crits don't do much if you don't have a base damage worth multiplying.

[YSeung]

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

Crits don't do much if you don't have a base damage worth multiplying.

Yes, but wits Archer is more of a support than a damage dealer

[Yojo0o]

You may need to expand on the idea you're talking about, because in my experience, the best way for an archer to "support" the team is to actually kill the enemies they're firing at.

[YSeung]

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

You may need to expand on the idea you're talking about, because in my experience, the best way for an archer to "support" the team is to actually kill the enemies they're firing at.

Yeah that's the role of finess archer. You need a glass cannon supporter in your team whose wits must be higher than the fastest enemy. That role + bow is wits archer. well, You don't know anything about Wits archer? It's not my idea. I guess you can just go and wreck the game with lone wolf build. Maybe that would be your best

[YSeung]

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

You may need to expand on the idea you're talking about, because in my experience, the best way for an archer to "support" the team is to actually kill the enemies they're firing at.

Wits archer also can kill the next turn enemy or stun him or gather enemies for next unit or etc.

[phenir]

Originally posted by YSeung:

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

You may need to expand on the idea you're talking about, because in my experience, the best way for an archer to "support" the team is to actually kill the enemies they're firing at.

Yeah that's the role of finess archer. You need a glass cannon supporter in your team whose wits must be higher than the fastest enemy. That role + bow is wits archer. well, You don't know anything about Wits archer? It's not my idea. I guess you can just go and wreck the game with lone wolf build. Maybe that would be your best

Damn coming in hot with those assumptions.

[BIG E.]

Problem is wits build suffer if you are not playing with lone wolf.

If you are playing lone wolf wits, meaning crit, builds are insane.

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

Crits don't do much if you don't have a base damage worth multiplying.

And it is for this exact reason. With lone wolf you can get both your wits and main stats very very high.

But i played crit builds without lone wolf aswell. They work but they are nowhere near as broken as it is with lone wolf and i often had to spec into neromancer and polymorph for extra stuff which you don't really have to with lone wolf.

[Chaoslink]

First off, why is Ifan any better than anyone else for this role? The "best" archer if you ask me is an elf as you get easy and free access to bloody arrows using their racial. See, archers are the highest damage weapon based builds the game offers. Using them for support sacrifices much if you don't intend to run a second archer. Probably better to delegate this role to a rogue honestly. They are already a crit build through backstabs true, but you're using Wits for initiative, not crit.

You want the best build for an archer? Go full Elemental Ranger. This lets you go magic damage if you choose to help your mages or full physical if needed as well as proper hybrid dealing both simultaneously. All are viable options pretty much at will. There's no match for damage using an archer than this.

There are no "best" builds for a given character really since there's not enough difference between them to say one is better than the others. The only exception being elf racial and Fane's Time Warp and those are very debatable as to which builds make best use of their effects. Fane's ability for instance, is best cast on an ally, not himself. So Fane's build isn't particularly important when using that ability.

[BIG E.]

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

See, archers are the highest damage weapon based builds the game offers.

After two handed.

[Chaoslink]

Originally posted by BIG E.:

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

See, archers are the highest damage weapon based builds the game offers.

After two handed.

Not even. Two Handed still falls short. There's just too much damage to be gained through multipliers like high ground that melee simply can't compete with, not to mention the lack of any need to gap close making your AP economy better on ranged builds.

[BIG E.]

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

Originally posted by BIG E.:

After two handed.

Not even. Two Handed still falls short. There's just too much damage to be gained through multipliers like high ground that melee simply can't compete with, not to mention the lack of any need to gap close making your AP economy better on ranged builds.

There is not a single weapon damage build in the game that can outDPS a crit 2h build.

Read what two-handed skill does. Its mathematically impossible to outDPS because it directly multiplies your crit damage. High ground bonus doesn't do that.

I also know this as a fact from experiance aswell since i ran tons of ranged builds and i ran tons of 2h builds. Damage is not even close 2h crit is just broken and there is a reason why its one of the best honor lone wolf builds, because it makes you delete whatever you hit.

[Chaoslink]

Originally posted by BIG E.:

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

Not even. Two Handed still falls short. There's just too much damage to be gained through multipliers like high ground that melee simply can't compete with, not to mention the lack of any need to gap close making your AP economy better on ranged builds.

There is not a single weapon damage build in the game that can outDPS a crit 2h build.

Read what two-handed skill does. Its mathematically impossible to outDPS because it directly multiplies your crit damage. High ground bonus doesn't do that.

I also know this as a fact from experiance aswell since i ran tons of ranged builds and i ran tons of 2h builds. Damage is not even close 2h crit is just broken and there is a reason why its one of the best honor lone wolf builds.

Note that unless otherwise stated, I'm not talking about lone wolf. I don't consider it standard and won't compare it to non-lone-wolf builds.

Also, it very much is possible. Two-Handed isn't the only crit scaling stat and Warfare baseline scales damage for bows and two handed weapons the same. High ground boosts that base damage in a similar way. You also can stack damage buffs to your base damage more on ranged attacks than melee attacks. Simply put, you can get the base damage of your weapon to be much higher than that of a two hander. Crit isn't everything if the number you're multiplying with it is lower.

Overall the attack abilities offered by ranged attacks are typically better as well. I've run something like 1000 hours in this game as well as multiple thousands on the forum here. Its a common agreement that archery is the strongest weapon based build. Its also the most versatile.

[YSeung]

Originally posted by Chaoslink:

First off, why is Ifan any better than anyone else for this role? The "best" archer if you ask me is an elf as you get easy and free access to bloody arrows using their racial. See, archers are the highest damage weapon based builds the game offers. Using them for support sacrifices much if you don't intend to run a second archer. Probably better to delegate this role to a rogue honestly. They are already a crit build through backstabs true, but you're using Wits for initiative, not crit.

You want the best build for an archer? Go full Elemental Ranger. This lets you go magic damage if you choose to help your mages or full physical if needed as well as proper hybrid dealing both simultaneously. All are viable options pretty much at will. There's no match for damage using an archer than this.

There are no "best" builds for a given character really since there's not enough difference between them to say one is better than the others. The only exception being elf racial and Fane's Time Warp and those are very debatable as to which builds make best use of their effects. Fane's ability for instance, is best cast on an ally, not himself. So Fane's build isn't particularly important when using that ability.

Man, I mean Wits archer is just Ifan himself. His character. And actually Wits archer is fit to his original abilities. In other words "Ingenious", "Encourage" and "Summon Ifan's Soul Wolf". Glass cannon wits archer makes them "viable" In chapter 1. That's the exact point. And you can also use Mask of the Shapeshifter for changing Ifan to elf and use Flesh sacrifice. You guys will find that wits archer can do a lot of things.