Support - Cleric vs. Enchanter

[Steve]

I’m starting to plan my next play through and I just can’t make up my mind how I want to build my support character. I know both can work equally well but I would love to hear your experiences and suggestions on how to build a support character.

The basic premise here is a Hydro / Geo focus whose main role is to restore Physical Armor, Magic Armor and Vitality and clear debuffs. Secondary role is control the battlefield which could be anything from apply status effects, moving people around (crowd control), matching damage type to resistances, or exploiting surfaces, etc. Having a mix of magical and physical damage options through either Necromancy or Warfare is nice too.

Enchanter (ranged, intelligence focused support, wears robes & mage gear, wand or staff)

Pros – Can focus ability points on Intelligence and use intelligence gear to match. Most ability points can go into Hydro & Geo, maybe a couple points into Aerotheurge, Pyromancer or Necromancy (physical damage and bone summon) to add more options.

Cons – As a ranged spell caster, spells like Soothing Cold and Mend Metal which only effect allies around caster are less useful and therefore limit your ability to carry out your primary role, in fact you really only have one option for each armor type and then you’re waiting for them to come off cooldown. Also low physical armor and lack of any real aggro control from tanks means you may need to carry a shield anyway even as a ranged caster.


Cleric (melee range, support, Strength & Intelligence, 2H or sword & shield, heavy armor)

Pros – Better suited to be up in melee range where spells like Soothing Cold and Mend Metal can be used in addition to Fortify and Frost Armor which doubles your ability to restore armor not to mention all the other close area spells like smoke screen or contamination (and many others). Melee weapon and shield along with Hydro & Geomancer spells gives a good balance of physical and magic damage options.

Also, being able to mix Strength and Intelligence gear can give you a good balance of Physical and Magical armor. Basically combines the tank and the support into one character which frees up a spot in the party for something else.

Cons – Splitting attribute points between Intelligence, Strength, Memory or Constitution (if you want a shield) means you are really spreading yourself thin. Ability points are also spread thin if you try to work in Warfare, Hydro, Geo and maybe splash some Aero or Necro.



So which do you prefer and why? Do you have a different idea for a support character? Do you even use a support character or do you make sure each character has a way to heal & restore themselves?

[Keyastian]

Well, I'm with a cleric now and I'm a bit confused if it can be called a "cleric''. Spending points on strength and int make it seems more like a Paladin than a cleric, but nvm, let's to the topic. I'm not investing any points on geo since I am increasing hydro as fast as possible, thus my heals get better. Besides hydro, I spent only 2 points on warfare to get warrior skills. The point is: is it necessary to spend pts on Intelligence, if I'm making a "warrior cleric"? Cuz when you mouse over int, it says it just increase spells dmg attcks, and nothing about heals. If so, I can invest only on strgth, con and memory, since it's magic damage isnt great thing ( At least i'm not finding it)

[Brakiros]

Should take Cleric they can take way more punishment then Enchanter, Enchanter are more useful as a damage dealer with CC mixed in its that shocked + wet status effect.

[Senenleigh]

Soothing Cold and mend metal do affect the caster. The Cleric archetype tends to deal damage to physical armor. The idea of a cleric at earlier levels is to cast decaying touch on enemies so he can use his healing spells offensively or defensively as the situation requires. Of course it becomes more complex at higher levels, your scoundrel has an ability to cast decay with an attack, you can do combos with him or add hydromancy damaging spells to your rep. I think your main question should be what you need in your party. Enchanters tend to do damage magic armor and cc with magic armor checks, so the two archetypes are very different.

[dergefata]

Support character doesn't need Int unless you're going to forego Summoning. With 10+ Summoning for the strong Incarnate Champion, you may find - as I have, anyway - that having lots of skills is preferable to having strong effects. Movement skills (like Teleport), terrain modifying skills, many buffs (like Haste), and most of your emergency "oh crap" buttons (like Cryogenic Stasis) don't need to be cast hard, they just need to be cast.

Yes, there's of course value to having your Fortify/Frost Armor/Regen/damage spells do more when you cast them, but is it worth getting 15% more shielding (that's 3 points) from your Frost Armor when you could instead get teleport, nether swap, haste, clear mind, fortify, and more instead? For me, no. But your playstyle may differ enough that my advice isn't helpful to you =)

[JugsOfHolyness]

Aerotheurge 2
*Teleportation
*Nether Swap


Polymorph 2
*Spider Legs

Spider Legs gives you "Spin Web", a ground targeted AOE that makes it so the enemy cannot move. It goes through all Armor.


Geomancer 2
*Fossile Strike
*Impalement

Both of these skills are ground targeted oil puddles, and as we all know, Slow goes through Armor.


Huntsman 2 OR Warfare 2
*Tactical Retreat IF Huntsman
*Phoenix Dive IF Warfare

Telekinesis 5
Strength (as much as you can)



Find a large painting, such as this one:
https://imgur.com/sAo8Doq

And carry it around with you. Having 2 could help (hence the high STR). Typical fight starts like this:

1. Using your Support's high Telekinesis, drop down the large painting(s) in front of your other party members so it acts as a portable cover, blocking enemy's LoS

2. Phoenix Dive/Tactical Retreat into the largest group of enemies standing together (let's assume 2 enemies)

3. Nether Swap yourself with an enemy far away (so now 3 enemies are clumped together)

4. Teleportation another enemy into that group (now 4 enemies are clumped together)

5. Spider Legs. Spin Web. Now 4 enemies can't move.

6. If there are any enemies besides those 4, you can toss an Impalement at them or Fossil Strike


If you're not Lone Wolf, you're gonna have to change the priority in which you do things to suit the battle (which will most likely be always you starting off with Spider Legs instead of the Telekinesis for portable cover).

You should always remember to save enough AP with your other party members so that after they attack they can move back behind the cover to break enemies' LoS.

If you're a full melee party this strat won't work at all.

[Gamebot]

1. Tank doesn't work well in this game because enemies often ignores the fattest tank.
2. and attribute points should be spent for dealing, not tanking.
3. All I needed for cleansing work was these 5 tool skills; Frost Armor, Fortify, First Aid, Clear Mind, and 1 Mass Cleanse Wounds(from source orb). I didn't use it, but Soul Mate is also great. In my opinion and experience, if your armor is down, enemies should already be dead or CCed, and you shouldn't fill up your HP or armor, but rather use that AP for attacking or CCing enemies. Tool skills are not for healing, but for clearing CC status. I kept Frost Armor, Fortify, and First Aid for all characters, and Clear Mind for 2 characters. It costs only 3 memory, but worth more than 6 memory. I didn't use any heal, Soothing Cold, or Mending Metal etc. Also the problem of 1 support is that 1 character can't do everything. We can't know where your team mate will go, or how turn order would change, so everyone has to be everyone's support, and it costs only 3 memory. Your mileage may vary, but that was my experience.
4. So it makes healing class useless, and all 4 characters can be dealers.
5.
Elf + Elemental Affinity + Flesh Sacrifice : - 1 AP for all Necro skills
Elf + Elemental Affinity + Rain : - 1 AP for all Hydro skills
Elf + Elemental Affinity + Jellyfish + Flesh Sacrifice : -1 AP for all Aero skills
Elf works great for Necro Enchanter. Give her a shield and pour tons of spells at close range.
6. Ignore everything and choose what your heart wants. Both Enchanter and Cleric are pretty interesting. Choose one of them and focus on 1~2 schools.

[Senenleigh]

Originally posted by Keyastian:

Well, I'm with a cleric now and I'm a bit confused if it can be called a "cleric''. Spending points on strength and int make it seems more like a Paladin than a cleric, but nvm, let's to the topic. I'm not investing any points on geo since I am increasing hydro as fast as possible, thus my heals get better. Besides hydro, I spent only 2 points on warfare to get warrior skills. The point is: is it necessary to spend pts on Intelligence, if I'm making a "warrior cleric"? Cuz when you mouse over int, it says it just increase spells dmg attcks, and nothing about heals. If so, I can invest only on strgth, con and memory, since it's magic damage isnt great thing ( At least i'm not finding it)

Only thing that will increase heals is Hydromancy. You can also crit with heals on undead offensively or with decay. Splitting points between str and int wasn't very appealing to me. I decided to invest my points into wits instead and get Savage Sort.