Magic damage

[Grumpy Old Guy]

If I'm trying to max out damage with a character who uses magic is it more effective to put skill points into the skill itself or into polymorph and invest the points into intelligence?

They both say 5% but I've seen recently that the 5% is not added the same way one is multiplied and one is added so which is better? If I want super fire damage should I go pyro or poly?

[Råb!d]

I'd put it into Intelligence. It is useful across all branches. Plus it can help with persuasion, it seems.

[Grumpy Old Guy]

yeah but if intelligence is added not multiplied than it's not anywhere near as strong as putting points into the elements themselves. Strength is additive I know and a point in strength isn't as effective as a point in warfare for damage.

[Chmeva]

I -THINK- the way it works is that damage = base skill damage * skill bonus * stat bonus.

Let's say you're level 1 and have no int bonus or skill bonus yet, and the base spell damage is 100. If you invest 3 points into intelligence, your total damage would be 100 (base damage) * 1.15 (int bonus) * 1.00 (skill bonus), or 115 damage. If you invest 2 points in int and 1 point in the appropriate skill, you would get 100 (base damage) * 1.10 (int bonus) * 1.05 (skill bonus), or 115.5 damage. If this is correct, you get more damage from the skill, but lose on the persuasion bonus, the flexibility (int benefits all magic damage, skills benefit just that skill's damage), and the bonus magic armor.

I could be wrong though, haven't really tested

[Izunyami]

Point up to 3 in the skills you want, invest into polymorph -> intelligence (you'll hit max int pretty quick that way), blow ♥♥♥♥ up.

Plus poly level 5 skill (source skills cost 0 source) + storm spells is great. You'll get way more mileage on int than the skill itself from what I've seen but I don't know the exact formulas. I would assume int affects the total while the skill affects the base (so (100% base + 5%*X)*Y) where X = skill level and Y = stat). if you're trying to focus on one or two skills specifically, it'd be a good idea to focus on those heavily after you reach max int. You could probably hit max int by poly 5 or 7.

I could be wrong though.

[Hope]

So correct me if I'm wrong... Wand and Staff basic attack range has NOTHING to do with magic spell damage? That only has to do with INT and level?

[Hobocop]

Yes, most spells don't scale from weapon damage. INT, points in the spell's associated ability school, and level are the main factors. Which is nice since you can just keep a wand/weapon with good +stats and +crit%/a rune slot on it and not care. If a skill/spell scales off weapon damage, it'll specify that in the skill description.

[Hope]

Originally posted by Hobocop:

Yes, most spells don't scale from weapon damage. INT, points in the spell's associated ability school, and level are the main factors. Which is nice since you can just keep a wand/weapon with good +stats and +crit%/a rune slot on it and not care. If a skill/spell scales off weapon damage, it'll specify that in the skill description.

Awesome thanks.

[Exilo]

Well, to be honest if you want to max out your fire damage for exemple you will want to max out pyro AND intelligence. Out of the +/- 43 physical points, you cant invest more than 30 in intelligence. That said i dont see the point in investing in polymorph before maxing out pyromancer. After pyro, you may invest in another elemental school or supportive abilities but ditching 10 in poly only to gain 10 points in wits (for critical chances) does not seem very worth it

[Chaoslink]

Originally posted by Råb!d:

I'd put it into Intelligence. It is useful across all branches. Plus it can help with persuasion, it seems.

I have to say something in regards to this as so many people get this wrong. Persuasion is pretty much only affected by the persuasion stat. The governing skill does NOT add to the skill in any significant way other than breaking ties. If your persuasion skill is 3 and the check requires 3 to pass, your intelligence will be compared to that of the NPC and if yours is a few points higher, it will pass. In most cases, if you put only into persuasion (as you should, civil skills basically scale with your level directly, splitting them up is going to make many of them useless) the governing skill isn’t going to matter. 99% if the times you fail to persuade is because the persuasion skill was too low, not the stat.

[Revolucas]

Originally posted by Chmeva:

I -THINK- the way it works is that damage = base skill damage * skill bonus * stat bonus.

Let's say you're level 1 and have no int bonus or skill bonus yet, and the base spell damage is 100. If you invest 3 points into intelligence, your total damage would be 100 (base damage) * 1.15 (int bonus) * 1.00 (skill bonus), or 115 damage. If you invest 2 points in int and 1 point in the appropriate skill, you would get 100 (base damage) * 1.10 (int bonus) * 1.05 (skill bonus), or 115.5 damage. If this is correct, you get more damage from the skill, but lose on the persuasion bonus, the flexibility (int benefits all magic damage, skills benefit just that skill's damage), and the bonus magic armor.

I could be wrong though, haven't really tested

Correct, the bonus from the skill is most important, since it factors total damage after the main stat bonus is applied. But, I'm going to show a few examples myself.

Using your example of 100 base damage. If you have 40 Int, you'll do 150% base damage multiplied by the skill bonus:

40 Int (+150% base damage)
• 0 in the skill would be 250 damage.
  
• 1 in the skill would be 263 damage.
  
• 2 in the skill would be 275 damage.
  
• 3 in the skill would be 288 damage.
  
• 4 in the skill would be 300 damage.
  
• 5 in the skill would be 313 damage.
  
• 6 in the skill would be 325 damage.
  
• 7 in the skill would be 338 damage.
  
• 8 in the skill would be 350 damage.
  
• 9 in the skill would be 363 damage.
  
• 10 in the skill would be 375 damage.

41 Int (+155% base damage)
• 0 in the skill would be 255 damage.
  
• 1 in the skill would be 268 damage.
  
• 2 in the skill would be 281 damage.
  
• 3 in the skill would be 293 damage.
  
• 4 in the skill would be 306 damage.
  
• 5 in the skill would be 319 damage.
  
• 6 in the skill would be 332 damage.
  
• 7 in the skill would be 344 damage.
  
• 8 in the skill would be 357 damage.
  
• 9 in the skill would be 370 damage.
  
• 10 in the skill would be 383 damage.

Now lets say you have 3 in a skill and are considering increasing Int to 41 versus increasing the skill to 4. As you can see from above, you are missing the opportunity of 6 damage placing a point into Polymorph for the Int increase versus the skill. With a base damage of 500, you'll lose out on 34 damage.

My conclusion is early in the game, prior to level 16+ you are better off using Polymorph to boost Int to max, since you'll most likely be relying on high damage AoE spells from each school. With lower levels (Skills scale with character level) and lower damage the amount of damage you miss out on pumping Int versus a skill is rather low. It's only higher levels when skills start to do 1k-2k damage that you'll notice you are much better off with maxing a single school versus pumping Polymorph up. By this time anyway, you can max Int without Polymorph anyway, so definitely remove those points in mirror later and invest them into your favorite magic skill. If you use some of the Polymorph skills, keep the bare minimum.