PSA - Damage and Stat interactions

[Enorats]

So, I've not read anything about this before and just noticed it.. figured I'd put it out there for others to play with.

When you're putting your stats into things like weapon skills vs warfare.. both add 5% damage. I've been mostly putting points into weapon stats as it seemed objectively better, it not only adds 5% damage but also other bonuses like crit chance / dodge / crit multiplier.

It seems that's not necessarily the best idea. I've got two chests - one adds 2 finesse and 1 warfare (collectively, a 15% dmg increase.. right?). The other adds 5 finesse (25% increase). The thing is, the finesse/warfare chest raises my damage by something like 50 points more (from ~1100 average to 1150 average). On the surface, this doesn't make sense.

As far as I can figure, the various damage increasing stats actually stack with each other. Instead of being applied as a single figure, they're applied in sequence. For example a 5% increase on 1 damage raises it to 1.05, then a second seperate 5% increase raises that to 1.125.. whereas a single 10% increase would only achieve 1.1 damage. Thus, for my current stat levels a single point of warfare is better than 3 points of finesse.

After evening out my stats a bit more, taking a few points out of weapon skills and putting them into warfare instead.. I'm now doing something like 20-30% more damage than I was before.. which is rather hilarious considering my classic difficulty Lone Wolf archer tends to one shot two or three guys already on her first turn.

[corisai]

It's simply : weapons skills are cummulative with basic stats, while warfare skill is multiplicator (so it's far far more superior).

Lone Wolf is also multiplicative, so in DOS2 2 of them actually far more powerfull then 4-man party.

[aaronthuglife]

warfare vs ranged should be an even split. you should go more towards warfare if youre doing lonewolf because youre going to max be close to crit max anyways and you can take the warfare talent that gives you an extra 60% hp at 20 warfare

[Atma]

Is there a multiplier like Warfare for Int-based spells?

Warfare says it only works on physical damage.

[Khryst]

each spell school has it's multiplier.

Fire is affected by Pyro
Ice = Hyrdo
Earth = Geo and I think poison too.

thing is it's not just spells that are affected by it either, it's any dmg of the apprioate type. The fire dmg from Phoenix dive for example is made stronger by Pyro, same with wand dmg types and staff dmg types, or elemental dmg on swords/axes/etc.

[Atma]

Originally posted by kblaze13:

each spell school has it's multiplier.

Fire is affected by Pyro
Ice = Hyrdo
Earth = Geo and I think poison too.

thing is it's not just spells that are affected by it either, it's any dmg of the apprioate type. The fire dmg from Phoenix dive for example is made stronger by Pyro, same with wand dmg types and staff dmg types, or elemental dmg on swords/axes/etc.

Well.. that's not really the same thing.

Physical damage = Weapon + Skill + Stat x Warfare
Magical damage = Skill + stat

Scaling seems to be skewed toward physical damage in this game, although magic has the bonus of having way more utility.

[Khryst]

Originally posted by Atma:

Originally posted by kblaze13:

each spell school has it's multiplier.

Fire is affected by Pyro
Ice = Hyrdo
Earth = Geo and I think poison too.

thing is it's not just spells that are affected by it either, it's any dmg of the apprioate type. The fire dmg from Phoenix dive for example is made stronger by Pyro, same with wand dmg types and staff dmg types, or elemental dmg on swords/axes/etc.

Well.. that's not really the same thing.

Physical damage = Weapon + Skill + Stat x Warfare
Magical damage = Skill + stat

Scaling seems to be skewed toward physical damage in this game, although magic has the bonus of having way more utility.

There's definitly something people aren't seeing in with how magic scales, not sure myself what it is but I can tell you that despite the "paper" numbers my mages are hitting just as strong or stronger then the physcial dmg despite the fact that on paper the physical should be stronger.

and that's even with the enemy resistances from using loremaster/examine almost as if they are getting scaling based on level not just skill + stat.

[Rainy Skies]

Physical Damage seems to be calculated in this way.

Weapon Damage = Base
Damage stat (Finesse, Str, Int)
Weapon skill damage (two handed, two handed, ranged, dual wield)
Warfare
Crit modifier.

All of these sources are multiplicatively stacked onto eachother.

So assuming we have have 50 base damage, 2 ranged, 2 scoundrel, 2 warfare, 20 finesse, and the base 150 crit boosted to 160 from scoundrel, we will get this vallue.

50+10% (ranged) =55
55+10% (warfare) =60.5
60.5+50% (finesses) =90.75
90.75+60% (crit multiplier) =145.20

(quoted from another post of mine in scoundrel backstab thread a while back)

As for level playing a factor in magic, it certainly does. Magic damage is calculated by level, int, appropriate skill. The level assigns a base value of the damage of the skill.
Elemental damage on weapons is just boosted by skill ranks of that type.
Elemental damage bonus applied via skills is based on level, and then scaled further with appropriate skills when attacking.

[Atma]

Ah, so it does scale based on level as well, like kblaze said. Good to know. : )

[Khryst]

Ah I figured it was level, wasn't 100% certain but something just told/felt like it was as the same abilities I was using early on, were hitting drastically harder at 15-16 and completely viable then they were at 1-10 and even more so once I broke 20 on my mage characters, it explains why early on the mages feel weaker but by the time the levels start climbing they felt like they had outpaced their physcial counterparts.

Not that the physical wasn't still good, just that they got outpaced once they reached 21.

[Stratigamo]

So is necromancer physical skills based off of char level / warfare / current equiped weapon skill?

[Coffeepot]

on tooltip with an at level white 2h sword physical and magic damage from spell are roughly the same, the problem is physical has no resistances and accuracy is abundant so when you get a rare+ weapon with rune slots your damage skyrockets compared to magic, this goes for any weapon based physical build.

[Cheese Mogul]

Originally posted by Stratigamo:

So is necromancer physical skills based off of char level / warfare / current equiped weapon skill?

hmm. i dont know if necro scales with marfare, but weapon doesnt effect it, int does. so level, warfare (maybe?), and int

[Cheese Mogul]

Originally posted by Clunge plunger minge mangler:

on tooltip with an at level white 2h sword physical and magic damage from spell are roughly the same, the problem is physical has no resistances and accuracy is abundant so when you get a rare+ weapon with rune slots your damage skyrockets compared to magic, this goes for any weapon based physical build.

and thats hardly true, anyone with a fully geared mage with points loaded into int and something like pyro know the damage is pretty even. plus people never mention the fact there are ways to lower resistances, even into the negitives

[Rainy Skies]

Originally posted by Stratigamo:

So is necromancer physical skills based off of char level / warfare / current equiped weapon skill?

They should still be treated as if it was any other skill just modified by a % based on the skill itself. (like how barrage is weaker in a single hit than pin down) If an attack you use has a weapon being required, it scales off the weapon (and all that entails), otherwise it scales off of level.

I'll be honest, I haven't used necromancy skills, but if it's physical magic, then intelligence should apply.

[Rainy Skies]

Originally posted by The Illustrious Legend 27:

Originally posted by Clunge plunger minge mangler:

on tooltip with an at level white 2h sword physical and magic damage from spell are roughly the same, the problem is physical has no resistances and accuracy is abundant so when you get a rare+ weapon with rune slots your damage skyrockets compared to magic, this goes for any weapon based physical build.

and thats hardly true, anyone with a fully geared mage with points loaded into int and something like pyro know the damage is pretty even. plus people never mention the fact there are ways to lower resistances, even into the negitives

Flay skin is amazing for lowering resists, and the bonuses from warm, wet, shocked, chilled, can also add up nicely.