Legendary Ore Farming Asteroid Reprocessing Must Be Nerfed

[Entropy]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3372251673


You will have so much legendary ores with these that you will need to get rid of them.
You need 4 legendary ore types. Iron ore for iron, sulfur and carbon for plastic/copper and steel, calcite for stone. When you have plastic (craft them in cyrogenic plant if unlocked), just do lds in foundry and scrap it to get steel and copper. Do not turn your iron into steel unless u need to do. Just make tier 2 legendary modules with these and you are set. I started this process with uncommon asteroid collectors and quality modules and made my way up in short amount of time.

So shortly, it is just too easy to setup self-sufficient roaming legendary asteroid collecting ship. If u don't care about the stone, asteroid process oxide too.

Note!!: Every asteroid chance roll is independent from each other meaning u can get many from one processing...

[Hurkyl]

I looked at the rates before, but just realized I had bug in my code so I was much more pessimistic when I looked at it. With 12.4% quality, the averages are:

• You need 3.02 asteroids to bump up (at least) 1 quality level
  
• You need 7.57 asteroids to bump up (at least) 2 quality levels
  
• You need 19.00 asteroids to bump up (at least) 3 quality levels
  
• You need 47.70 asteroids to bump up 4 quality levels

If you only have 10.0% quality (2 legendary tier 2 modules), then the numbers go up to

• You need 3.5 asteroids to bump up (at least) 1 quality level
  
• You need 9.80 asteroids to bump up (at least) 2 quality levels
  
• You need 24.44 asteroids to bump up (at least) 3 quality levels
  
• You need 76.83 asteroids to bump up 4 quality levels

This is, of course, much more efficient than self-recycling loops (like with iron plates) where your yield at 24.8% quality would be

• You need 13.10 items to bump up (at least) 1 quality level
  
• You need 77.62 items to bump up (at least) 2 quality levels
  
• You need 460.08 items to bump up (at least) 3 quality levels
  
• You need 2726.91 items to bump up 4 quality levels

My impression is that the yield is still going to be much lower than doing quality up the production chain and recycling finished products as necessary. But I do agree it should be lots easier to set up.

It's probably easier to make use of all the asteroids you are capable of harvesting, too, since the refining process will grind through the reserves.

[Entropy]

Postat inițial de Hurkyl:

I looked at the rates before, but just realized I had bug in my code so I was much more pessimistic when I looked at it. With 12.4% quality, the averages are:

• You need 3.02 asteroids to bump up (at least) 1 quality level
  
• You need 7.57 asteroids to bump up (at least) 2 quality levels
  
• You need 19.00 asteroids to bump up (at least) 3 quality levels
  
• You need 47.70 asteroids to bump up 4 quality levels

If you only have 10.0% quality (2 legendary tier 2 modules), then the numbers go up to

• You need 3.5 asteroids to bump up (at least) 1 quality level
  
• You need 9.80 asteroids to bump up (at least) 2 quality levels
  
• You need 24.44 asteroids to bump up (at least) 3 quality levels
  
• You need 76.83 asteroids to bump up 4 quality levels

This is, of course, much more efficient than self-recycling loops (like with iron plates) where your yield at 24.8% quality would be

• You need 13.10 items to bump up (at least) 1 quality level
  
• You need 77.62 items to bump up (at least) 2 quality levels
  
• You need 460.08 items to bump up (at least) 3 quality levels
  
• You need 2726.91 items to bump up 4 quality levels

My impression is that the yield is still going to be much lower than doing quality up the production chain and recycling finished products as necessary. But I do agree it should be lots easier to set up.

It's probably easier to make use of all the asteroids you are capable of harvesting, too, since the refining process will grind through the reserves.

Thanks for the numbers. It occupies zero space, easier and cheaper to setup and you can drop them any planet you want. I did this before i tried "quality up the production chain and recycling finished products" method and seemed easier. Space in planets are problem for me because i am mostly robot guy and don't deal with main buses (may be harder to setup what you mentioned if you lack space or consider bot travel time).

50 asteroids you can gather in 2-10 seconds in one trip in asteroid rush time. Wider you have, more you collect

[i2um1]

Postat inițial de Chastity Belt Enjoyer:

50 asteroids you can gather in 2-10 seconds in one trip in asteroid rush time. Wider you have, more you collect

I think lava from Vulcanus is better than slow and big platform wings. But it's funny that people said Factorio > Satisfactory a few month ago here because Factorio does not have infinite resources.

[Simon]

Factorio always had infinite resources, it's just the the process of setting up a new drilling site wasn't automatic and required going out and manual work every couple hours, which is no longer the case, now in space age you can basically afk for dozens of hours at a time, with only a couple things needing checking up on every so often, due to the new lower depletion rate of resources.

[Marosh]

Postat inițial de Simon:

Factorio always had infinite resources, ...

Akshully *moves the glasses up*, the map is finite and therefore the resources are finite on Nauvis.

I see myself out. No one likes people like me.

[Entropy]

Postat inițial de i2um1:

Postat inițial de Chastity Belt Enjoyer:

50 asteroids you can gather in 2-10 seconds in one trip in asteroid rush time. Wider you have, more you collect

I think lava from Vulcanus is better than slow and big platform wings. But it's funny that people said Factorio > Satisfactory a few month ago here because Factorio does not have infinite resources.

Well i tried it and to get amount of same legendary ore to get from Vulcanus compared to platform needed so much space in Vulcanus and machines (and electricity) too. Over 500-600 iron plates per second are needed to craft in Vulcanus to get same from space so i gave up on it.

[Khaylain]

Postat inițial de Marosh:

Postat inițial de Simon:

Factorio always had infinite resources, ...

Akshully *moves the glasses up*, the map is finite and therefore the resources are finite on Nauvis.

I see myself out. No one likes people like me.

But nobody will ever explore all of the map, which essentially is indistinguishable from infinite. It's technically finite, but effectively (for humans) infinite.

[Entropy]

Postat inițial de Khaylain:

Postat inițial de Marosh:

Akshully *moves the glasses up*, the map is finite and therefore the resources are finite on Nauvis.

I see myself out. No one likes people like me.

But nobody will ever explore all of the map, which essentially is indistinguishable from infinite. It's technically finite, but effectively (for humans) infinite.

Yeah technically space(not platform but area we can build) is infinite but we still consider it important so ;)

[Khaylain]

Postat inițial de Chastity Belt Enjoyer:

Postat inițial de Khaylain:

But nobody will ever explore all of the map, which essentially is indistinguishable from infinite. It's technically finite, but effectively (for humans) infinite.

Yeah technically space(not platform but area we can build) is infinite but we still consider it important so ;)

What? No, technically the area we can build is finite. In practice nobody is going to reach the limits of the whole map. DoshDoshington used recursive blueprints to build a trainline to one edge of the map, and that still took an amazing amount of time to do, on an extremely small slice of land, just a straight trainline in one direction.

[Nonotorious]

Oh you're reprocessing the chunks? That's a great idea because you get loads of ore per chunk, the copper balance on the advanced recipe sucks tho.

[Hurkyl]

Postat inițial de Nonotorious:

Oh you're reprocessing the chunks? That's a great idea because you get loads of ore per chunk, the copper balance on the advanced recipe sucks tho.

Actually, OP had the clever idea of using your surplus carbonite chunks for copper: quality plastic makes quality LDS in the foundry, and you can recycle to get copper and steel plates.

I think the numbers are in the same ballpark either way.

[Entropy]

Postat inițial de Hurkyl:

Postat inițial de Nonotorious:

Oh you're reprocessing the chunks? That's a great idea because you get loads of ore per chunk, the copper balance on the advanced recipe sucks tho.

Actually, OP had the clever idea of using your surplus carbonite chunks for copper: quality plastic makes quality LDS in the foundry, and you can recycle to get copper and steel plates.

I think the numbers are in the same ballpark either way.

At first, I just tried it at then dedicated two ships that doing legendary hunting and nothing else.

Yeah basic metalic one should be used, after a while plastic becomes the bottleneck. So maybe if certain " iron ore amount" is reached, i can start trying converting everything to carbonite.

[Entropy]

Postat inițial de Khaylain:

Postat inițial de Chastity Belt Enjoyer:

Yeah technically space(not platform but area we can build) is infinite but we still consider it important so ;)

What? No, technically the area we can build is finite. In practice nobody is going to reach the limits of the whole map. DoshDoshington used recursive blueprints to build a trainline to one edge of the map, and that still took an amazing amount of time to do, on an extremely small slice of land, just a straight trainline in one direction.

Sorry meant effectively infinite^^.

[brown29knight]

I have to disagree with the premise of this post.

(TLDR: Reprocessing asteroids is one of the best methods of getting legendary materials, but it is not so overpowered as to need nerfing in my opinion.)

Reprocessing asteroids IS extremely good at generating large amounts of legendary materials.

But so is scrap reprocessing with quality, and recycling everything to further increase quality.

So is using foundries to infinitely produce plates with quality from molten metal, and quality jumping up as you build with them.

and all 3 are endlessly expandable given time.

All have specific strengths:

Scrap produces a large amount of a wide range of things, and can give you top tier items right away.

Foundry lines let you customize your legendary goods to be exactly what you want them to be.

Asteroid reprocessing has the least waste, and can deliver the goods anywhere as needed.

For example, I have some basic systems in place to make legendary speed modules on Volcanus. I had just finished setting them up when I saw this post, and wanted to see for myself how it is so powerful.

So I retooled a ship to be able to reprocess asteroids all the way to legendary quality, crush them, and deliver the materials to Volcanus to compare.

Please note, both the ground setup and the space setup were minimal setups. The very smallest you would need to process all tiers of materials up to legendary processing units.

Here was my process: (all quality modules are legendary 3)

in space, asteroids were processed in tiers until they became legendary, the oxides were reprocessed again, the metallic and carbon broken down. Legendary coal was made on site, and the coal and iron ore was shipped to Volcanus for use. The ship would fly from Volcanus to Fulgora and back, stopping for 120 seconds at Volcanus to drop off goods, and re-arm/re-fuel.

Planet side, lava was made into copper coils and iron plates with quality, sorted by quality and sent to electromag plants that made them into electric circuits with quality. (except legendary, these are stored in a chest.)

Coal was mined without quality, and sent to chem labs that made plastic with quality.

Separately from the electric circuit line, copper cables were made with quality

Electric circuits, plastic, and copper coils were all sorted by quality, legendary are sent to a chest, (logistics network pending) everything else sent to another set of electromag plants to make advanced circuits.

These get sorted, the legendary are put in a chest, the rest get recycled with quality, legendary parts go to chests, and the rest go back around into the sorters to become advanced circuits again.

The results: The reprocessing gave me lots of extra unneeded legendary iron ore, too little plastic, and a tough choice between making LDS out of the plastic for the legendary copper, or keeping it for the additional plastic.

Meanwhile, the Volcanus line gave me very little at all, UNTIL I added that last recycle loop. Then it started giving a constant stream of legendary advanced circuits, AND all the parts for more. The Volcanus line makes a lot more waste products, but they are all recycled into more legendary parts.

If I MASSIVELY expanded the ship for reprocessing (or made a few dozen such ships), I would have enough plastic from it alone, but I would have even more waste iron and steel (and sulfur). Meanwhile, I could massively expand the ground setup, and get even more of exactly what I need.

Fulgora, meanwhile, has been a favorite of mine for a while, and I have passively filled a (legendary steel) chest with 12k legendary iron plates, just from scrap reprocessing. And that is not breaking down other legendary parts... Those are stored elsewhere.

So while I DO see this as one of the most powerful ways of getting legendary materials, and perhaps the most cost efficient materials wise to set up, I do not see it as game breaking or in need of a nerf... unless you believe that Fulgora's scrap recycling and Volcanus' infinite ore form lava also need nerfs. I see it as on-par with those.

All 3 blow away the other 3 planets though.

[Serendipitous]

Cost efficiency is not that important imo given that in both cases lava and asteroids are infinite and don't require extending outposts.

Vulcanus is my favorite place for many reasons. This is gonna be one of them.