UI Improvement - Simple Suggestions

[socialautiste]

The keyboard and mouse controls are off-putting right now for NA players, but I have some suggestions for minor tweaks that would significantly improve the gameplay experience and make it much more accessible right from the start.

These are keyboard/mouse control suggestions:

1. Separate the use/interact keybind from the weapon quick attack keybind. (default "F=use/interact" and "left mouse=quick attack")
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2. When the quick attack keybind is pressed, if the weapon is sheathed, it will be drawn. This is actually very important, I think. I listed it as #2 because it requires the separate keybinds.
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3. Allow the player to use/interact with things while their weapon is drawn (and don't auto-sheath while doing things, that gets annoying). Rationale: "I can pick up a flower with my left hand, without putting away my rusty pipe in my right hand."

The player should auto-sheath when doing things like opening inventory, since the animation clearly shows both hands being used. Just not when doing use/interact things to loot/pick flowers/use a button.
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4. Set "Esc" as the key to go back in menus; having it as backspace is very awkward/counter-intuitive for NA keybinds. The issue is compounded by this keybind being locked, so even though we can see it on the keybinds list, we can't change it ourselves. I do like the "right mouse button to go back" alternate key, and if you made that the primary (so it shows up in place of "backspace" on the screen at the bottom), that alone would be a marked improvement. But honestly, "Esc" should always be the key to go back and "right click" as a novel alternative.
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This one isn't strictly UI, but it's related:

5. Add the option to "pause inside inventory/etc screens" for people who want that (which will be most).

I understand the design decision to make things continue to happen while the player is searching their bags, but not having the option is going to subtly deter wider audience interest in the game.

I do like things happening in the background while talking to people, but I'm just talking about while in inventory/skill screen etc. It would clearly also be more complicated to pause in scenes, rather than in static UI screens.

These kinds of "nitpick" issues are cumulative, so small things add up to a bad first impression even if players can't place the exact issues.
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This one is fairly trivial (quality of life/polish):

6. Add the option while in-game to "quit to desktop" in addition to the current "return to menu." Having to go through two different menu screens when the player wants to close the game is annoying, but not being able to return to the main menu would of course be worse. So both options is the ideal.

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I think these changes would make a lot of people more comfortable playing the game, and make the UI/combat feel less restrictive and clunky. Not having the default weapon draw when pushing left mouse is immensely frustrating for modern expectations, for instance.

Thanks, PB.

[Exile «Foxy» (Ryder17z)]

Whoever defined backspace to be used instead of ESC should be sent back to school.

[White Jam of Terror]

The only button this game need is "Hud on/off"

[One Stoned Bastard]

Originally posted by Elisarion:

The keyboard and mouse controls are off-putting right now for NA players,

Sucks for them. :P

No, but there's definitely room for improvement. The controls are actually worse than what they used to be in their older games up to and including Risen 1 (blame consoles?), while almost no attempts are made to improve them in any way.

The controls make more sense with controllers I guess, but yeah, K&M suffer in this game.

[socialautiste]

I loved the game, by the way; I have it on GOG, so I know it doesn't show here, but I've played around 90 hours and was very satisfied with the content.

My intention was to suggest very simple ways to polish the game quickly, to illicit better first impressions and higher review scores, so the game does better in sales and we can ensure more to come from PB.

I'm not sure the numbers, but I highly suspect they'd get a measurable boon in NA sales if the UI's were more intuitive to current design practices (I'm not sure how it plays in EU, but they do have a little bit different quicks judging from other games made in similar regions). People like myself, who have been playing PB games since Gothic (original), are going to play them either way, but it benefits everyone for them to get more people to appreciate the rich storytelling.

I'd never advocate for any substantive gameplay or story changes to appeal to broader audiences; just quality of life UI changes to better present the solid content properly to new players.

The game is still very playable, and I hope people give it the chance to shine. There are (at least when I played) glaring deficiencies in the intro scene and area, that really hurt the first impression: poor explosion and ship clipping intro scene; low quality "terrain blocks" in the small intro region.

For example, the visual quality of the environments is just unbelievably better out in the open world, so it'd be a shame for people to see clips from the ugly intro area and pass on the game; those blurry "old brick" minecraft-eqsue blocks to the left of the main path, with exceedingly poor blending into the terrain, made me expect the worst.

This is all easy to forget once you really get into the game, but like I've said, my concern was that people would be put off from brief first impressions and never give the game a chance. It's easy to be a snob, and say ♥♥♥♥ them, but it does hurt the company to sell fewer copies, which hurts us in the long run.

[Y Ddraig Ddu]

Great post/thread!

[ThomasMalton]

Originally posted by Y Ddraig Ddu:

Great post/thread!

Right! The OP suggested some very reasonable changes that will make this game even better.

Originally posted by Elisarion:

My intention was to suggest very simple ways to polish the game quickly, to illicit better first impressions and higher review scores, so the game does better in sales and we can ensure more to come from PB.

Sadly, you suggetions were never heard of by PB it seems.

[Wafflesaurus Supreme]

#3 is fine, just leave it alone. Every Piranha Bytes game has had this mechanic. It's a core feature of their engine and their gameplay. There is combat mode and interaction mode. That's why you have to put away your weapon when you climb a ladder. Not every game should play exactly the same way. That's how we end up with AAA copy/paste trash. At least PB's trash is unique and doesn't topple over to dump all over the entire game series.

#6 would possibly break the save game system.

[ThomasMalton]

Originally posted by Tired_David - Twitch.tv:

#3 is fine, just leave it alone. Every Piranha Bytes game has had this mechanic. It's a core feature of their engine and their gameplay. There is combat mode and interaction mode. That's why you have to put away your weapon when you climb a ladder. Not every game should play exactly the same way. That's how we end up with AAA copy/paste trash. At least PB's trash is unique and doesn't topple over to dump all over the entire game series.

With all due resoect to PB, I think that many of mechanics they used in ELEX are simply outdated by now. Including this one. If something was good in 2001 doesn't necessarily mean it will be good in 2018, right? The game developers should constantly find ways to perfect their games mechanics, but not to use the old ones over and over again.

Originally posted by Tired_David - Twitch.tv:

#6 would possibly break the save game system.

Why is that? Are you talking about autosave system? Personally, I'm not using autosaves in ELEX because I prefer to use quick saves instead. What harm can it done if before you decide to close the game it will save your progress automatically for example and only then it will exit to desktop?

[LzDK14]

So, 6+ months and NONE of simple pleasures of good UI desing were taken to heart.
Great game, great support, great devs! (sarcasm?)

[Wafflesaurus Supreme]

Originally posted by ThomasMalton:

Originally posted by Tired_David - Twitch.tv:

#3 is fine, just leave it alone. Every Piranha Bytes game has had this mechanic. It's a core feature of their engine and their gameplay. There is combat mode and interaction mode. That's why you have to put away your weapon when you climb a ladder. Not every game should play exactly the same way. That's how we end up with AAA copy/paste trash. At least PB's trash is unique and doesn't topple over to dump all over the entire game series.

With all due resoect to PB, I think that many of mechanics they used in ELEX are simply outdated by now. Including this one. If something was good in 2001 doesn't necessarily mean it will be good in 2018, right? The game developers should constantly find ways to perfect their games mechanics, but not to use the old ones over and over again.

Originally posted by Tired_David - Twitch.tv:

#6 would possibly break the save game system.

Why is that? Are you talking about autosave system? Personally, I'm not using autosaves in ELEX because I prefer to use quick saves instead. What harm can it done if before you decide to close the game it will save your progress automatically for example and only then it will exit to desktop?

First rule of game design: If it ain't broke, don't fix it. It's a good mechanic and some old mechanics are still good after many years. This happens to be one of them.

[ThomasMalton]

Originally posted by Tired_David - Twitch.tv:

First rule of game design: If it ain't broke, don't fix it. It's a good mechanic and some old mechanics are still good after many years. This happens to be one of them.

I've never heard of this rule. But I can't deny that you've got a point. Basically, I like ELEX as it is now otherwise I wouldn't play it for so many hours. However, what OP'd suggested certainly would make this game better.

[junkstarter]

Originally posted by Tired_David:

Originally posted by ThomasMalton:

With all due resoect to PB, I think that many of mechanics they used in ELEX are simply outdated by now. Including this one. If something was good in 2001 doesn't necessarily mean it will be good in 2018, right? The game developers should constantly find ways to perfect their games mechanics, but not to use the old ones over and over again.

Why is that? Are you talking about autosave system? Personally, I'm not using autosaves in ELEX because I prefer to use quick saves instead. What harm can it done if before you decide to close the game it will save your progress automatically for example and only then it will exit to desktop?

First rule of game design: If it ain't broke, don't fix it. It's a good mechanic and some old mechanics are still good after many years. This happens to be one of them.

It was garbage when they first did it, its garbage when you posted here, and it's ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ garbage now more than ever. Garbage idea remains garbage.