To all people that play with fog of war off(see enemy units on map)

[zaigre777]

Iv seen a lot of youtubers play with enemy units always visible.Im not judging,but please try to play with fog of war on (and with as little saves as possible).Youl develop a new style of play,with units covering each other,and care for as much of them as possible.Also the fight with enemy is more realisitc (even thogh AI is zombie most of times).Anyways just wanted to mention that.

[JonasIV]

Originally posted by ??:

imagine playing with no fog of war lmao. You can't see any units if your own units haven't spotted them yet. I really don't understand how people can't grasp simple concepts like this. Try using scouts/recon maybe? Yes the ai does know where you are at all times, but that's just because it's ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ ai. Try playing with no fog of war against a real player. Not very fun. You know why? BECAUSE FOG OF WAR IS AN INTEGRAL PART OF THE GAME!

its funny, because the ai absolutely DOES NOT know where you are at all times, you can very easily cheese every single campaign mission with a single sniper or stealth guy, fog of war on or fog of war off only affects what YOU see, not what your units see, not what enemy ai see, stop thinking this game is like other rts, if you really want to see how awful fog of war is, just 1v1 me and ill show you how being destroyed by infantry you cant even see until its too late isnt really enjoyable

[zaigre777]

Originally posted by JonasIV:

Originally posted by zaigre777:

anyways this isnt "you low skill players git gud" post....its try and see that the game plays better this way.Sudden shots,ambushes,incoming mortar attack-scater infantry.Tank duels that are intense af.Im sayin for your pleasure if you love the subject that you will find yourself more imerssed in the missions.I was suprised how many youtubers play campaigns with all enemy visible

try to play the campaign missions yourself on hardcore, there is no "sudden shots, ambushes" etc etc because all you have to do is grab a scout, hold fire and prone and then crawl around until you spot every single enemy

lets see you finish a mission this way...you always need to bring fire support.Offcourse there is no sudden shots and ambushes for you since you see everything.Try without seeing everything and as little saves as possible...for imersion sake

[JonasIV]

Originally posted by zaigre777:

Originally posted by JonasIV:

try to play the campaign missions yourself on hardcore, there is no "sudden shots, ambushes" etc etc because all you have to do is grab a scout, hold fire and prone and then crawl around until you spot every single enemy

lets see you finish a mission this way...you always need to bring fire support.Offcourse there is no sudden shots and ambushes for you since you see everything.Try without seeing everything and as little saves as possible...for imersion sake

i have bro, i have done nearly every campaign mission from ostfront, talvisota and scorched earth with fog of war on, on coop, so no saves, everything has to be done from the beginning if mission failed, and its not worth it, it is immersion breaking and downright awful when you have to redo the entire mission all over again because of a bug (and let me just tell you, this games campaign is absolutely full of bugs), having to play for 3 hours and then crashing, or having to look everywhere for a single soldier that you cant find for an objective (if theyre even on the map) is the biggest waste of time you can ever experience in your life, campaign is just 100x more enjoyable without fog of war (as i am doing it rn for liberation and all the skirmishes)

[I AM HIM]

Nah, while the AI is the way it is I refuse. You can't have your AT guns or tanks cover another flank, without turning to look through walls and through houses to aim at someone they can't even shoot at, then something comes up in their Area of responsibility and then they die. Because they wanted to rotate their turret 180 degrees to look somewhere they shouldn't.


When I can force units to hold and look a certain way I'll play with FOW back on and take my time scouting again. Without FOW on you're just playing at a disadvantage because you're forced to micro manage your key units so much. SO annoying seeing a tank come in, going to the tank you have in an ambush spot, only to find him looking somewhere completley different at something he can't even shoot. Even more infuriating when your tank crew gets knocked out caus of it.

And with how many reinforcements they can pop out before finally running dry.

Played USSR and USA campaign w FOW on... not doing it again until they can address certain unit issues. Which they won't.

[Devilman275]

i stopped using fog when i realised most mission are not skirmish style mission where you can call in additional force, and the way some mission are design to make you lose troop with cheap ambush or a 10:1 advantage for the ennemy

nah thanks fog can be permanent when i control more than a famished company

[Punished Miller]

- Soldiers: Heroes of World War 2: Meant to be played WITHOUT fog of war
- Faces of War: Meant to be played WITHOUT fog of war
- Men of War (2009): The first time that fog of war actually functions as intended, but it still merely an optional toggle and not the intended way to play

I rest my case. If you enjoy looking at gray graphics and having tanks or hordes of infantry disappear out of thin air like we're playing World of Tanks then go ahead and play with FoW on.
If you enjoy playing the terribly & lazily scripted stealth missions with a fog of war which doesn't even work properly then go ahead.

When the devs make the AI fair and let us disable the terrible "grayed out" effect of FoW then we might reconsider. Until then, we play these games like the founding fathers intended.

[??]

Originally posted by §Autistic_Fox22§:

Originally posted by zaigre777:

anyways this isnt "you low skill players git gud" post....its try and see that the game plays better this way.Sudden shots,ambushes,incoming mortar attack-scater infantry.Tank duels that are intense af.Im sayin for your pleasure if you love the subject that you will find yourself more imerssed in the missions.I was suprised how many youtubers play campaigns with all enemy visible

Tanks suddenly disappearing/reappearing isn’t very immersive…

true to your name lmao

[§_blima22_§]

Originally posted by ??:

Originally posted by §Autistic_Fox22§:

Tanks suddenly disappearing/reappearing isn’t very immersive…

true to your name lmao

Good one

[Saxhorn]

I've seen a lot of YouTube players with fog on.
I'm not sure why people are getting so invested in this.
There's no right or wrong answer.
It's just a personal choice.
When some other person plays it's their choice.

Some players want the added challenge. Others just find it too janky or frustrating.

Surely we can all be mature enough to say whatever floats your boat is fine?

[??]

Originally posted by Saxhorn:

I've seen a lot of YouTube players with fog on.
I'm not sure why people are getting so invested in this.
There's no right or wrong answer.
It's just a personal choice.
When some other person plays it's their choice.

Some players want the added challenge. Others just find it too janky or frustrating.

Surely we can all be mature enough to say whatever floats your boat is fine?

People will play the way they want to at the end of the day. Why do you care what others have to say about it if you're so sure about your choice? It's an option for this very reason. That said, the game does not work as intended by the developers when you remove fog of war. End of story.

[Saxhorn]

the game does not work as intended by the developers when you remove fog of war

Devs have confirmed on the forums that the AI behaviour for bots and player units not in direct control is no different no matter what setting a player chooses for Fog of War,

What changes is what the player sees on the minimap and on the screen nothing more nothing less.

Players "perceive" that units don't do this or don't do that with Fog off but that's just the players perception of what is happening being influenced by being able to "see" things that they actually can't see.

[??]

Originally posted by Saxhorn:

the game does not work as intended by the developers when you remove fog of war

Devs have confirmed on the forums that the AI behaviour for bots and player units not in direct control is no different no matter what setting a player chooses for Fog of War,

What changes is what the player sees on the minimap and on the screen nothing more nothing less.

Players "perceive" that units don't do this or don't do that with Fog off but that's just the players perception of what is happening being influenced by being able to "see" things that they actually can't see.

Nice reading comprehension bubba. How did you get that from my comments? I already said that the ai knows where you are at all times regardless of the setting. Where did I say that the ai behaves differently depending on if fog of war is enabled or not? You're the one (the player) that behaves differently. You're cheapening the game for yourself, hence why I suggested you play a match against another real player with fog of war on and see for yourself how dumb it is lol. All of the campaign missions, as well as conquest, have been designed to be played with fog of war.

Do you also play fps games with wallhacks so you know where everyone is? What's the point?

[zaigre777]

Again to all people,this isnt "git gud",its just my experience playing the game with fog of war on.I know there are many points of arguing back and forth but just wanted to suggest a style of play.We can also argue about game difficulty (which i go back and forth medium and hard).I had a blast playing hedgerow hell mission and wanted to see how other people played the mission,and thats where i saw all those youtubers playing with fog of war off,and just frontally assaulting the hills.I went all around the flanks having little bog fights,bring a tank forward,fire some shots - reverse the tank.Felt very satisfiyng (even though i lost all my american tanks and had to repair panthers and panzers to complete the mission)

[PeeWee]

Originally posted by kampfer91:

There is option for both type of player , no need to dictate how people should have fun .

+1

[struckat]

Fog of war is not the problem, vision and weapon range are.

I play only conquest and use a few mods. The one that really changed the game for me was the increased range and vision mod.

Range and vision is mostly doubled. IMO that makes it way more realistic. With FOW off, you can see everything and some may like that. I would rather not know.

And no, there are no endless hordes, just a few guys.

I have not had the game long and there is a sharp learning curve. What I found is I think new players can benefit from turning FOW off. That way you can get used to what is coming.

The other issue I found is that I want a full platoon or two plus support this and that. But that gives the AI more resources which makes if far more difficult to get used to the game.

I have started limiting myself to as few units as possible. Less than 1000 strength points.
That makes each unit very very valuable.

I play normal with low resources.
The first mission I have done with one Mk III with the 37mm gun. Just dont get too close to the infantry and hope you can find and out smart the one or two guns they will bring.
I did this after first trying it with FOW off. Otherwise I would have thought it not possible. I did go and attack the reinforcements before they could get to where they wanted to set up.

As I go further, I still limit size. I like to take one squad and break it into fire teams of 3 or 4. As a commander I kill way less of my men.

Recon recon recon. Especially with the range and vision mod.