Dahl weapons and their burst-fire

[Tao314zdin]

Does it have any uses except for making rng to screw you more often (by not giving you full+semi version)?

It is slower than both full and semi auto in the long run (takes longer to empty the mag), does not have any damage bonuses like semi and due to the delay between bursts it make target swapping awkward quite often.

[Jerubius]

Honestly, I find myself going to the burst fire mode whenever a weapon has it. Pretty sure I can always empty the mag at least as fast as full auto can, if not faster, with less spread, and Dahl weapons just don't have the punch per bullet or accuracy to make single fire mode feel good. Though I also really liked Dahl weapons in 2, and consensus on those is that they're just bad with very little exceptions.

[Cubicle.Dexter]

I remembered liking Dahl burst-fire in BL2 specifically because the burst put a more accurate spray of bullets into that burst. The higher the burst, the better, and getting my hands on a 5-shot burst was usually golden. Oddly, most of my "that was awesome" mental images were while fighting bots in BL2, so maybe it was because a quick burst to a crit joint could remove an arm or leg.

As a side note, I much preferred the design of bots in BL2. Even the same shaped bots in BL3 seem to have smaller crit points.

Back on topic, I don't tend to use Dahl guns that aren't fully auto in BL3. I haven't sat down and analyzed why, but I just don't get the same fun-feel with them.

[Tao314zdin]

Originalmente postado por Jerubius:

Honestly, I find myself going to the burst fire mode whenever a weapon has it. Pretty sure I can always empty the mag at least as fast as full auto can, if not faster, with less spread, and Dahl weapons just don't have the punch per bullet or accuracy to make single fire mode feel good. Though I also really liked Dahl weapons in 2, and consensus on those is that they're just bad with very little exceptions.

Well here is 2x slowed comparison between semi and burst on the gun I currently have:

https://youtu.be/7wU2sSrqqBY

Semi is something like 10% faster due to the delays between bursts and I do not think that auto is slower than semi.

On the other hand it is 3 rounds burst-fire, so mb 5 rounds can be on par.

[Jerubius]

Originalmente postado por Tao314zdin:

Originalmente postado por Jerubius:

Honestly, I find myself going to the burst fire mode whenever a weapon has it. Pretty sure I can always empty the mag at least as fast as full auto can, if not faster, with less spread, and Dahl weapons just don't have the punch per bullet or accuracy to make single fire mode feel good. Though I also really liked Dahl weapons in 2, and consensus on those is that they're just bad with very little exceptions.

Well here is 2x slowed comparison between semi and burst on the gun I currently have:

https://youtu.be/7wU2sSrqqBY

Semi is something like 10% faster due to the delays between bursts and I do not think that auto is slower than semi.

On the other hand it is 3 rounds burst-fire, so mb 5 rounds can be on par.

I'll need to find a burst fire I like again, because I don't remember that delay being there at all. Also a lot of Dahl weapons have a fairly slow full auto fire rate in my experience. Probably should do some actual testing.

[Ant Ra]

For me, the burst is just a lengthy work to complete the Dahl challenge. The burst is difficult to use while moving, swallows and wastes ammunition and hits inaccurately at longer distances. Why Burst Dahl sniper with 5 burst drops is a mystery to me too. Different class/equipment skills that increase the fire rate don't make it any better

After that only fully automatic and single shot - then Dahl weapons are fun again.

[Tao314zdin]

Originalmente postado por Jerubius:

I'll need to find a burst fire I like again, because I don't remember that delay being there at all. Also a lot of Dahl weapons have a fairly slow full auto fire rate in my experience. Probably should do some actual testing.

Here found one auto+burst smg:

https://youtu.be/s2fdUoYcvJY

Burst is slower even with 5 rounds per go.

2 examples are surely not an evidence in general, but so far it seems only NH really benefits from burst-fire. At least I did not see any other Dahl gun that would be better with burst.

[Jerubius]

So I did some testing. Clicking as fast as you can with burst fire leaves some significant delays between bursts. Slowing down your clicks to match the cadence of the bursts allows you to pretty much continuously fire bursts. I'm not set up to record anything, and the test weapon I used was a vanquisher that dropped which might not be the best test case given that it's legendary. So I'd call it anything but definitive, but it's something that warrants further investigation.

[Frosty]

In a game that's difficulty mostly revolves around bullet sponges and the race to constantly pump out more DPS and status effects; burst-fire is extremely annoying. Since burst fire seems to simply be 3-5 actual rounds firing and they all have individual damage and drift (unlike some early games were burst damage was calculated by the first round impacting a target and the other 2-3 were just for show), there isn't a significant bonus to using burst.

The pauses in burst fire can cost DPS compared to a similar full-auto weapon and generally the accuracy isn't that much better due to recoil. Not to mention the inherent wastefulness of burst-fire to begin with. Since you can't control your firing rate because it's chunked out in bursts you end up wasting rounds that could be transitioned to another target before the magazine runs empty resulting in more preemptive reloads to compensate for running out mid-fight.

When it comes down to it, you're better served with a full-auto weapon than a burst fire in the majority of cases as you can replicate the burst feature if you want with some trigger discipline, in my personal opinion. Would be nice to see some testing and such to see if that proves out; but that's been my experience so far in the game.

[76561198041967849]

it's a good way to make a gun ♥♥♥♥.
seriously, if not for how many guns get ♥♥♥♥♥♥ over by having some crazy whackadoo fire mode like burst or semi automatic, then maybe i'd finally go at least one hour without a hellshock legendary literally carrying me through the entire game.

i would pay money for a functioning trainer or cheat that could force any gun be to full auto instead.

[PsychoDino]

Originalmente postado por Tao314zdin:

Does it have any uses except for making rng to screw you more often (by not giving you full+semi version)?

It is slower than both full and semi auto in the long run (takes longer to empty the mag), does not have any damage bonuses like semi and due to the delay between bursts it make target swapping awkward quite often.

its easier

[Jerubius]

Originalmente postado por ♥♥♥♥♥ tried to steal my nut:

it's a good way to make a gun ♥♥♥♥.
seriously, if not for how many guns get ♥♥♥♥♥♥ over by having some crazy whackadoo fire mode like burst or semi automatic, then maybe i'd finally go at least one hour without a hellshock legendary literally carrying me through the entire game.

i would pay money for a functioning trainer or cheat that could force any gun be to full auto instead.

Say what you want about weird firemodes, but the game would be worse without Devil's Foursome. The crack as you one tap an enemy with a perfectly placed shot mid slide on move speed Zane is incredibly satisfying, even if suboptimal.

[Tao314zdin]

Originalmente postado por Jerubius:

So I did some testing. Clicking as fast as you can with burst fire leaves some significant delays between bursts. Slowing down your clicks to match the cadence of the bursts allows you to pretty much continuously fire bursts. I'm not set up to record anything, and the test weapon I used was a vanquisher that dropped which might not be the best test case given that it's legendary. So I'd call it anything but definitive, but it's something that warrants further investigation.

I checked with my current non-legendary gun and it does work, the delay is significantly reduced if you do not spam clicks.

Thanks! Looks like burst is not that bad after all.