Who wrote this ♥♥♥♥?

[Antik]

To anyone considering buying this game, DON'T

The story and the quests are garbage that i can't force myself to care for. In BL2 i would beat the whole main story every time a friend got the game, and it would never get boring. Why? Because i cared for the characters that were all unique with a right balance of comedy and seriousness. Hell even in BL1 even though it was scuffed i cared way more about the characters and the universe than in BL3.

This game has some liberal arts undergrad tier writing which makes me cringe non-stop. The characters and the story are so quirky and cookie you almost feel like you're playing Tumblr: The Game. Loved characters from previous games got butchered and/or have little importance to the story. Remember how cool it was to reunite with BL1 gang in BL2? Wellll ♥♥♥♥ that ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ make sum place for muh self-inserts!

I finally uninstalled without finishing the game. What a waste to everyone who worked on gameplay.


TL;DR: Game has no soul, so unless you have Tik Tok tier attention span and can't follow a story anyway, steer clear.

[Junipercat]

Ava does need proper realization and growth shown, either in a BL3 DLC or through the main part of BL4. I just don't want BL4 to be a time skip to that point as I want to see her growth so it can be accepted, otherwise would feel simply like they created a new character.

[Bankai9212]

Originally posted by Junipercat:

Ava does need proper realization and growth shown, either in a BL3 DLC or through the main part of BL4. I just don't want BL4 to be a time skip to that point as I want to see her growth so it can be accepted, otherwise would feel simply like they created a new character.

There will be another timeskip, and they'll add more characters and do nothing with them besides move the plot forward. Heck at least in BL2 if a character was gone from 1 they would explain why.

[kukuhimanpr]

i'm sure ava could have been written better in b3 if there's more of the b2+tftb characters present that were written as awesome mentors that could guide her to grow up wisely and quickly as a siren. rather than ava being written as angsty magnet for trouble that makes the adults fumble around like clumsy newbies in parenting rather than hardened veteran survivors of pandora.

pickles and tiny tina were close to ava's age, they could've become ava's close friends that would teach her how to survive against borderlands baddie. yet pickles got poofed completely from canon, and i don't recall tina and ava ever interacting with each other from b3 playthroughs and lore videos i've seen in yt. its all so disjointed with so many missing links and wasted potentials.

[Antik]

Originally posted by Junipercat:

Ava does need proper realization and growth shown, either in a BL3 DLC or through the main part of BL4. I just don't want BL4 to be a time skip to that point as I want to see her growth so it can be accepted, otherwise would feel simply like they created a new character.

Ava should be nuked out of the story, this self insert garbage is not acceptable, how can you even consider fixing this? You don't give antibiotics to someone who has a toe that is rotting from necrosis, you cut it off.

Krieg should rip Ava's head off after being done ripping all other of her limbs off, then toss the remains to skags. At least she will be useful feeding the local ecosystem.

[Bankai9212]

Originally posted by Antik:

Originally posted by Junipercat:

Ava does need proper realization and growth shown, either in a BL3 DLC or through the main part of BL4. I just don't want BL4 to be a time skip to that point as I want to see her growth so it can be accepted, otherwise would feel simply like they created a new character.

Ava should be nuked out of the story, this self insert garbage is not acceptable, how can you even consider fixing this? You don't give antibiotics to someone who has a toe that is rotting from necrosis, you cut it off.

Krieg should rip Ava's head off after being done ripping all other of her limbs off, then toss the remains to skags. At least she will be useful feeding the local ecosystem.

Not sure who she was an insert for, The issue is that she was never developed as a character. If she did players could understand why Maya chose her of all people. With the deleted scenes it seemed to be a focus at some point but was dropped.

[Antik]

Originally posted by Bankai9212:

Originally posted by Antik:

Ava should be nuked out of the story, this self insert garbage is not acceptable, how can you even consider fixing this? You don't give antibiotics to someone who has a toe that is rotting from necrosis, you cut it off.

Krieg should rip Ava's head off after being done ripping all other of her limbs off, then toss the remains to skags. At least she will be useful feeding the local ecosystem.

Not sure who she was an insert for, The issue is that she was never developed as a character. If she did players could understand why Maya chose her of all people. With the deleted scenes it seemed to be a focus at some point but was dropped.

A self insert is when a writer, as the word obviously indicates, inserts themselves into a story. Who self inserted in particular doesn't matter for us, it matter for the company as they have to fire the person who did that on the spot. I can't believe i have to explain this...

Also she was developed, idk why you pretend she wasn't but she's a big ♥♥♥♥♥♥ part of the story. She got enough screen time to make everyone hate her. If you want an example of underdeveloped characters then look at the vault hunters from previous games. In BL2, BL1 characters got developed greatly, BL3 did nothing of this sorts. In fact, it did the opposite.

[Bankai9212]

Then you assume she is an insert without evidence, which is why I asked "who she was an insert for" Ava is just poorly written like most characters in 3. Your explanation of the insert isn't needed as that isn't what I asked. She is more of a Mary sue if anything

She isn't though, all we know is Maya saw something in Ava and that's it. As for the story like the twins she does barely anything unless the plot needs them to and characters making her the leader despite not showing any traits of this in the plot.

[Hook Master]

This game's story feels like it just didn't want to address anything significant from the past and acts way more like a filler game
I have hope for BL4 being way higher stakes and I have to assume this game is the sendoff to Pandora as it will inevitably get destroyed in the 4th game in yet another attempt to wake up the destroyer because there's no way that wasn't the war the watcher was talking about
The Destroyer is simply way to big of a plotpoint to not address now that we know it's still alive and just biding it's time inside of Pandora the writers for sure want to end it's story so we can move on to infinitely more interesting concepts in the universe

[Bankai9212]

Originally posted by StaticSpark:

This game's story feels like it just didn't want to address anything significant from the past and acts way more like a filler game
I have hope for BL4 being way higher stakes and I have to assume this game is the sendoff to Pandora as it will inevitably get destroyed in the 4th game in yet another attempt to wake up the destroyer because there's no way that wasn't the war the watcher was talking about
The Destroyer is simply way to big of a plotpoint to not address now that we know it's still alive and just biding it's time inside of Pandora the writers for sure want to end it's story so we can move on to infinitely more interesting concepts in the universe

After wonderlands and new tales, I highly doubt that barely anything to TPS is ever mentioned in 3.

[Antik]

Originally posted by Bankai9212:

Then you assume she is an insert without evidence, which is why I asked "who she was an insert for" Ava is just poorly written like most characters in 3. Your explanation of the insert isn't needed as that isn't what I asked. She is more of a Mary sue if anything

She isn't though, all we know is Maya saw something in Ava and that's it. As for the story like the twins she does barely anything unless the plot needs them to and characters making her the leader despite not showing any traits of this in the plot.

Evidence? This is self evident, she's a perfect little girl everyone loves even though she's annoying as ♥♥♥♥, which is only enough to be a Mary Sue. Add a little liberal arts mindset into the dialogue and quirky yassss girl behavior from a college campus and you have a self insert.

I'm not explaining more than this, it's not possible for me to have a conversation with you about this topic if you don't have the background necessary to talk about this.

[Bankai9212]

Originally posted by Antik:

Originally posted by Bankai9212:

Then you assume she is an insert without evidence, which is why I asked "who she was an insert for" Ava is just poorly written like most characters in 3. Your explanation of the insert isn't needed as that isn't what I asked. She is more of a Mary sue if anything

She isn't though, all we know is Maya saw something in Ava and that's it. As for the story like the twins she does barely anything unless the plot needs them to and characters making her the leader despite not showing any traits of this in the plot.

Evidence? This is self evident, she's a perfect little girl everyone loves even though she's annoying as ♥♥♥♥, which is only enough to be a Mary Sue. Add a little liberal arts mindset into the dialogue and quirky yassss girl behavior from a college campus and you have a self insert.

I'm not explaining more than this, it's not possible for me to have a conversation with you about this topic if you don't have the background necessary to talk about this.

She isn't perfect at all, barely anyone in the game ever gives her any attention or even cares about her, also again doesn't answer who is she as self-insert for. If you can't answer or prove it don't make baseless claims. Also what you said is an archatype not an insert.

Also funny you state you're attempting to explaining something you yourself don't seem to understand.

[kukuhimanpr]

ava's teenage angstiness and tendency to rebel resembles many self-insert teenage characters that people generally sees in these days in many medias. even the twins also resemble ava's angstiness but were basically evil teenager versions of the archetype.

archetype or self-insert or whatever, the b3's decision to focus most of b3 main story on ava is detrimental to the franchise. and even with all the diverted assets and energy they've spent on ava, there's still a lot of disjointed interactions and lack of reactions from many characters to ava... especially characters which can relate to ava's problems and help ava grow out of it. as an example, moxxie is a very motherly character when she interacts with ellie and scooter which were her children from her many marriages in the past, but she didn't get written to have motherly mentor scenes to ava except some small random quip from the wiki about moxxi & zane banning ava from drinking alcohols due to being underage.

[Bankai9212]

Ava would be an archetype like most characters in BL. It’s been awhile but I don’t recall Moxxie ever being motherly to scooter or Ellie. Heck we only know this from scooter and Ellie, best thing she did was get them away from the Hill Billy gang in 2.

[Antik]

Originally posted by Bankai9212:

Ava would be an archetype like most characters in BL. It’s been awhile but I don’t recall Moxxie ever being motherly to scooter or Ellie. Heck we only know this from scooter and Ellie, best thing she did was get them away from the Hill Billy gang in 2.

So your argument is she's an archetype, and? This doesn't mean she's not a self insert.

[kukuhimanpr]

in b1, scooter is shown and implied to be overprotective of his mother moxxie to the point he brutalized some zaford lucky to death in shallow grave or something off-screen because lucky harassed moxxie. in b2 there's some echo tapes about moxxie wanting ellie to live with her and work as waitress, and she's both disappointed and worried that ellie rebelliously takes the route of becoming independent lone car mechanic in the dust that likes to aggravate the hodunks and zaford. when scooter and ellie give their blessing to b2 hunters before they go to hero's pass to face jack, scooter said to ellie that their mom moxxie really cares about them both despite their implied disagreements. and in b2 lilith dlc moxxie grieves a lot for scooter's death in which ellie also somberly asked b2 hunters to help her make fiery/electrical catch a ride send off to honor scooter's memory.

those scenes i mentioned already give pictures how caring moxxie, ellie and scooter to each other as familyl. but moxxie barely gets much involvement in the b3 main story while moxxie and ellie feels as if they're lacking interactions with each other.