How many people are actually using mods?

[Popcorn]

So many screenshots around here or on twitter are showing characters who've been altered so much and don't even look close to the original design of the game. There's even subreddits just for people who are modding - and there's not just a few people in there.

How many people are actually modding in this game? How BIG is the modding scene? Is everyone seeing their characters differently than I am with using no mods at all?

[tap and die]

I wouldn't be surprised at least 50% of the active sub playerbase is using a mod or plugin of some sort, which includes basic ones like ACT.

There's basically no repercussions if you don't brag about them like an idiot. Frankly, mods show how much QoL FF14 is missing and pushes SE to do better with the game.

[Yürei]

Escrito originalmente por causality:

Honestly you sound jealous and bitter now because there are people who stream getting world first clears without plogons or video guides.

Nah, I don't really care at all. I haven't even cleared any of the latest savage raids let alone ultimates. I only know of what happen with the latest Ultimate clear due to friends who do clear ultimates. I just don't spewing bs and twisting other people's words to fit my narrative.

Meanwhile, you've been upset about anyone who uses mods constantly. This is why I said, you sound like someone who has been kicked for trying to join a clear party without knowing what to do. You probably got kicked and need to find something to blame outside your own laziness.

[Yürei]

Escrito originalmente por Giganx:

Escrito originalmente por Integrity:

PF strats are usually posted somewhere for people to look at and are usually the easiest strat. They usually never use a parse strat that is harder. I like PF because people are held accountable. You screw up a few times you get kicked. If I mess up I deserve to be kicked. That's how it should be. Don't be a burden to others.

Which is why Mods are so popular in MMOs. In a "1-2 mistakes and you're blacklisted" situation you don't want to be the only person trying to read and react to mechanics as they happen.

It's why mods shouldn't be illegal. Making them illegal does literally nothing to stop people from using them; it only punishes the players who want to follow SE's rules by leaving them no legal way to be on an even playing field with everyone else.

If I decided to start doing prog, especially in PF, I'd 100% use mods. There's absolutely no reason not to. A rule that can't be enforced isn't a rule; it's nothing.

It stops people from openly telling people. While this seems like its not much, it does help when PF is made up of randoms. This leads to people being able to play without fear of being forced to play with a mod.

The main issue WoW is facing with Mythic Raids is that the devs are developing raids around the plugins. This forces the players to need them and the difficulty being crazy high.

[Giganx]

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

It stops people from openly telling people. While this seems like its not much, it does help when PF is made up of randoms. This leads to people being able to play without fear of being forced to play with a mod.

That's only really true with DPS parsing, because you can't attack someone for low DPS without revealing that you've been parsing their DPS.

If you're a bit behind everyone else on mechanics, because an AI isn't walking you through them 4 seconds before they happen, people can pile on you without incriminating themselves, though.

End of the day making mods "illegal" isn't accomplishing anything or helping anyone. Until SE comes up with a way to enforce that rule it's just wind blowing out their asses. The only people being punished are the ones following the rule.

[Yürei]

Escrito originalmente por Giganx:

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

It stops people from openly telling people. While this seems like its not much, it does help when PF is made up of randoms. This leads to people being able to play without fear of being forced to play with a mod.

That's only really true with DPS parsing, because you can't really attack someone for low DPS without revealing that you've been parsing their DPS.

If you're a bit behind everyone else on mechanics, because an AI isn't walking you through them 4 seconds before they happen, people can pile on you without incriminating themselves, though.

End of the day making mods "illegal" isn't accomplishing anything or helping anyone. Until SE comes up with a way to enforce that rule it's just wind blowing out their asses. The only people being punished are the ones following the rule.

I mean depending on the PF, you could be kicked for just not doing the mechanics right. As I've stated before, clear parties/farm parties expect people to know the mechanics and where they hit beforehand. They won't kick you for a few mistakes, but if you keep repeating the same one over and over, they probably will. You don't even need the excuse of not using Catabot. Meanwhile, most practice parties are pretty chill on mistakes that happen. I don't think I need to comment on blind prog.

I would say try PF out before saying more. Its honestly not as strict as some people make it out to be. That said, its definitely a time waster with how some people can keep messing up on the same mechanics.

Also, as you already stated, it does prevent players from telling someone that their dps is bad. It is already doing something.

[Alternity]

Escrito originalmente por Giganx:

Escrito originalmente por Integrity:

PF strats are usually posted somewhere for people to look at and are usually the easiest strat. They usually never use a parse strat that is harder. I like PF because people are held accountable. You screw up a few times you get kicked. If I mess up I deserve to be kicked. That's how it should be. Don't be a burden to others.

Which is why Mods are so popular in MMOs. In a "1-2 mistakes and you're blacklisted" situation you don't want to be the only person trying to read and react to mechanics as they happen.

It's why mods shouldn't be illegal. Making them illegal does literally nothing to stop people from using them; it only punishes the players who want to follow SE's rules by leaving them no legal way to be on an even playing field with everyone else.

If I decided to start doing prog, especially in PF, I'd 100% use mods. There's absolutely no reason not to. A rule that can't be enforced isn't a rule; it's nothing.

He is the minority. I prog in PF and I never have this issue. People are generally patient with slower learners (to an extent, obviously, nobody wants to be in a trap).

It is quite funny that you see one person that agrees with you and you're "that's the situation right there" when this person is a very tiny minority. lol

[Giganx]

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

I mean depending on the PF, you could be kicked for just not doing the mechanics right. As I've stated before, clear parties/farm parties expect people to know the mechanics and where they hit beforehand. They won't kick you for a few mistakes, but if you keep repeating the same one over and over, they probably will. You don't even need the excuse of not using Catabot. Meanwhile, most practice parties are pretty chill on mistakes that happen. I don't think I need to comment on blind prog.

I would say try PF out before saying more. Its honestly not as strict as some people make it out to be. That said, its definitely a time waster with how some people can keep messing up on the same mechanics.

Also, as you already stated, it does prevent players from telling someone that their dps is bad. It is already doing something.

I'm sure some people will say PF is chill and some will say they devolve into arguing and disband after 2 wipes. It's why discussing anecdotes is generally pointless. The issue is still that mods are part of prog in this game, and completely legal in every way that actually matters. Saying they're illegal and not doing a single thing to enforce it just leaves the people who want to follow the rules in a bad situation.

And it's debatable whether or not being able to discuss DPS is a good or a bad thing. Making mods illegal just to prevent that conversation from happening is lazy and hurts everyone; it forces groups to just disband instead of trying to figure out DPS issues.

Escrito originalmente por Alternity:

He is the minority. I prog in PF and I never have this issue. People are generally patient with slower learners (to an extent, obviously, nobody wants to be in a trap).

It is quite funny that you see one person that agrees with you and you're "that's the situation right there" when this person is a very tiny minority. lol

He's not even close to the only person I've heard say that. Individual experiences will always vary.

It's like I said above; anecdotes aside mods are 100% a part of prog and raiding in this game. SE saying they're illegal and yet operating like they're 100% legal puts players who want to follow the rules in a difficult position. Glad your experiences have been good but it seems like others haven't.

[Yürei]

Escrito originalmente por Giganx:

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

I mean depending on the PF, you could be kicked for just not doing the mechanics right. As I've stated before, clear parties/farm parties expect people to know the mechanics and where they hit beforehand. They won't kick you for a few mistakes, but if you keep repeating the same one over and over, they probably will. You don't even need the excuse of not using Catabot. Meanwhile, most practice parties are pretty chill on mistakes that happen. I don't think I need to comment on blind prog.

I would say try PF out before saying more. Its honestly not as strict as some people make it out to be. That said, its definitely a time waster with how some people can keep messing up on the same mechanics.

Also, as you already stated, it does prevent players from telling someone that their dps is bad. It is already doing something.

I'm sure some people will say PF is chill and some will say they devolve into arguing and disband after 2 wipes. It's why discussing anecdotes is generally pointless. The issue is still that mods are part of prog in this game, and completely legal in every way that actually matters. Saying they're illegal and not doing a single thing to enforce it just leaves the people who want to follow the rules in a bad situation.

And it's debatable whether or not being able to discuss DPS is a good or a bad thing. Making mods illegal just to prevent that conversation from happening is lazy and hurts everyone; it forces groups to just disband instead of trying to figure out DPS issues.

I mean we could argue the opposite then. Allowing mods in the open could hurt people as it allows people to put that as a requirement for PF or worse. You could argue back and forth on what ifs, but it doesn't change that there are both upsides and downsides for making that change.

[Giganx]

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

I mean we could argue the opposite then. Allowing mods in the open could hurt people as it allows people to put that as a requirement for PF or worse. You could argue back and forth on what ifs, but it doesn't change that there are both upsides and downsides for making that change.

If mods are legal then there's nothing wrong with making them a requirement. It's SE's "mods are illegal, but we're totally not going to enforce that rule so we'll let the community sort it out," position that's a problem.

Now mods are just a lowkey requirement that you're not allowed to use; but you actually are completely, 100% allowed to use. It's a ridiculous system and sucks for people who are trying to follows SE's half assed rules. Just make them legal officially and stop the BS.

[Yürei]

Escrito originalmente por Giganx:

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

I mean we could argue the opposite then. Allowing mods in the open could hurt people as it allows people to put that as a requirement for PF or worse. You could argue back and forth on what ifs, but it doesn't change that there are both upsides and downsides for making that change.

If mods are legal then there's nothing wrong with making them a requirement. It's SE's "mods are illegal, but we're totally not going to enforce that rule so we'll let the community sort it out," position that's a problem.

Now mods are just a lowkey requirement that you're not allowed to use; but you actually are completely, 100% allowed to use. It's a ridiculous system and sucks for people who are trying to follows SE's half assed rules. Just make them legal officially and stop the BS.

I honestly think you should experience PF and raiding before saying that. You're letting experiences from WoW or other MMORPGs make you bias.

[Alternity]

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

Escrito originalmente por Giganx:

If mods are legal then there's nothing wrong with making them a requirement. It's SE's "mods are illegal, but we're totally not going to enforce that rule so we'll let the community sort it out," position that's a problem.

Now mods are just a lowkey requirement that you're not allowed to use; but you actually are completely, 100% allowed to use. It's a ridiculous system and sucks for people who are trying to follows SE's half assed rules. Just make them legal officially and stop the BS.

I honestly think you should experience PF and raiding before saying that. You're letting experiences from WoW or other MMORPGs make you bias.

He is totally biased. ACT is the only thing that's relatively widespread and it is technically not a mod (though it is a third party tool as described in ToS).

He also keeps talking about raiding experience in other threads about mechanics and gameplay being slow without actually experiencing what the game is like at a high level. Watching videos or streams is not the same as playing.

[Giganx]

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

Escrito originalmente por Giganx:

If mods are legal then there's nothing wrong with making them a requirement. It's SE's "mods are illegal, but we're totally not going to enforce that rule so we'll let the community sort it out," position that's a problem.

Now mods are just a lowkey requirement that you're not allowed to use; but you actually are completely, 100% allowed to use. It's a ridiculous system and sucks for people who are trying to follows SE's half assed rules. Just make them legal officially and stop the BS.

I honestly think you should experience PF and raiding before saying that. You're letting experiences from WoW or other MMORPGs make you bias.

Nothing I've said there was contingent on PF experience; it was all just the reality of how mods work in this game.

Mods are illegal, but they're 100% a part of raiding in this game because that rule isn't enforced.

[lilac]

most people dont use them

[Giganx]

Escrito originalmente por Alternity:

Escrito originalmente por Yürei:

I honestly think you should experience PF and raiding before saying that. You're letting experiences from WoW or other MMORPGs make you bias.

He is totally biased. ACT is the only thing that's relatively widespread and it is technically not a mod (though it is a third party tool as described in ToS).

He also keeps talking about raiding experience in other threads about mechanics and gameplay being slow without actually experiencing what the game is like at a high level. Watching videos or streams is not the same as playing.

First, you have no idea who's using what in any PF group you've been in, so I'm not sure what you think your anecdotes prove. How many people are using what mods is a completely unknowable number for us, and for every person like you there's plenty claiming the opposite.

And yes, you can talk about the pace of FFXIV's gameplay without doing prog. It's not like the GCD or your rotation changes in Savage. Savage is basically Normal with some additional mechanics and an Enrage timer; it's not a different game.

[Alternity]

Escrito originalmente por Seraphita:

Escrito originalmente por sasha:

most people dont use them

https://i.imgur.com/mixHZjP.png

Define "most people". 4,5 millions of people seems like a lot of people to me...

Just to clarify this metric here, this is the number of downloads, not people. Every time this mod gets updated it's a new download from every users.

They also just revealed that there are 30 million accounts. So if that's what you base your knowledge if most people use or don't use mods, then he's right, most people don't.