When should I start slotting materia?

[Aloe]

As the title says I'm wondering when i should start putting materia in my gear. Just starting shadowbringers and I really don't want to be a damper for my team (dunno if i used that right). I'm just usually changing gear constantly up until this point I didn't see a reason to use them. Genuinely curious. Thank you ^^

[causality]

Originally posted by Seraphita:

Max tenacity for a tank has a damage multiplier of 1.12

That is a pretty moot point since there is not enough substat allocation at our current gear levels to even reach that specific breakpoint.

It's like trying to argue, "Can pigs fly?"
"Well sure, let me put pigs on a rocket to the moon."

Originally posted by Seraphita:

In short, for the cost of 4% damage (which is not that much for a tank), you can also block 12% damage away at all time. It adds up to the mitigation skills as well. Like, in the best of worlds, det and DH are indeed better (and crit is priority as far as things go) but does it make tenacity useless? Well... depends. I'd say no unless you care about that 4%. But otherwise?

Your math is painfully wrong here. I don't even know where to start or if I even want to address why you're wrong. Tenacity stacks multiplicatively with the tank passive and all their defensive CD. You're not mitigating 12% more damage with full tenacity melds, it is realistically around 1-2%.

[Stormy Dawn]

Originally posted by Seraphita:

Well, provide proof, then? Proof on my side says mitigation at maximum (if it's even max) tenacity = 87.9%. The damage taken instead of higher damage. at 400 tenacity, you get hit 100% of damage. While at 2700 or so, you only get hit 87%. So please do explain with any evidence you have why I am wrong. I'll be waiting and I'll be glad to admit to be wrong. lol

https://www.akhmorning.com/allagan-studies/stats/ten/#explaining-tenacity

Oh and also, your irrelevant comparison is nothing but an attempt to be condescending (like before, since we know you enjoy this kind of thing.) so do bring out some numbers instead of laying bait like last time. Surely you have something better than "Because I said so."

The link you provided shows your math is off. Just look at the values in the table.

If you could actually get 12% resistance from Tenacity melds that would be insane. That would almost be the same as having a permanent Aquaveil on yourself.

[GeminiEclipse]

You'd need 64 materia to get that much tenacity at 36 per piece (going from 400 to 2700). Assuming every piece of gear allows tenacity with 2 slots the most you could get is 22 materia I think. I think? I'm just quick counting in my head.

[GeminiEclipse]

My PLD is only 564 IL and has 957 tenacity. I don't think it's possible to get that high until next expansion.

[causality]

Originally posted by Seraphita:

Well, provide proof, then? Proof on my side says mitigation at maximum (if it's even max) tenacity = 87.9%. The damage taken instead of higher damage. at 400 tenacity, you get hit 100% of damage. While at 2700 or so, you only get hit 87%. So please do explain with any evidence you have why I am wrong. I'll be waiting and I'll be glad to admit to be wrong. lol

https://www.akhmorning.com/allagan-studies/stats/ten/#explaining-tenacity

Originally posted by Seraphita:

Sooo. Where is my math off? Because if it is, I'd be happy to reiterate what I said.

Your math is off because you claimed having 'max tenacity' equates into 'you can also block 12% damage away at all time' which is objectively wrong when proven with basic middle school math.

Rampart mitigation: 100*(1-0.2) or 20%
Rampart with Sentinel mitigation: 100*(1-.2)*(1-.3) or 44%
Rampart with 2699 Tenacity mitigation: 100*(1-.2)*(1-.12) or 29%

You're not mitigating 12% more damage with 2699 tenacity as you suggested earlier. The table exists to display approximate flat % values, breakpoints and stat tiers to help BIS theorycrafters or why tank BIS does not include tenacity in any of it's melds. Now I know what you're thinking, why not include the 2699 tenacity mitigation by itself in my above math?

"The mitigation it(tenacity) provides stacks multiplicatively with other damage reduction cooldowns and passives."
https://www.akhmorning.com/allagan-studies/stats/ten/#explaining-tenacity

Originally posted by Seraphita:

Originally posted by Tsurayu:

The link you provided shows your math is off. Just look at the values in the table.

If you could actually get 12% resistance from Tenacity melds that would be insane. That would almost be the same as having a permanent Aquaveil on yourself.

Because right now, you're telling me my maths are off by the table I myself linked but you're not saying how. You're only saying that 12% would be insane, which is more your opinion than any fact given by the evidence itself. Also, the stats from the sheet are not stats given by meld alone. We're talking of a total by everything. Gears, melds, all of that.

There is not enough substat allocation at our current gear levels to even reach that specific tenacity breakpoint. Unless you can stream us your screen with a tank that has 2700 tenacity. I'll give you 27 million gil if you can do that right now.

[causality]

Technically every substat is useful. Tenacity might have more value if tanks had less defensive cooldowns? But even then I can't imagine SE designing content around having a full tenacity meld/set being the difference in surviving an unavoidable mechanic. Tenacity might be good if you're trying to solo dungeons on a warrior? But warriors could solo dungeons in ShB using their raid BIS which had 0 tenacity.

Usually the problem is not surviving, it's doing enough damage to pass an enrage.

[Lusus Symphonia]

I remember reading a thread that calculated that defensive gear for Bardams mettle wasn't actually as important as people think, it's correct usage of CDs that matter, not the stats of said player.

This was brought up often by healers who wondered why the tank took so much damage from that specific dungeon even when they had synced gear level.

I honestly wouldn't worry about stats until you reach endgame OP, I've wall pulled as a healer near the minimum ilvl of entry, correct usage of abilitie gets the job done, all you're doing melding is potentially increasing values by a fraction that only matters in very specific endgame content or world first runs.