Damage meter

[Osicat]

Game look fantastic, just started to play and about to start enter some dungeons soon. Just trying to find some info about dmg meter. Is there not one thru workshoop/mods? Its the one thing that make a game not only good but great if there is a way to acctivly improve and min max my dmg. Feel a bit emty if I cant see my preformance.

[chipofsalt]

Първоначално публикувано от Osicat:

Първоначално публикувано от Kethriss:

Organized raiding is done perfectly fine without one because the high end raids are more about call-outs, knowing mechanics, organizing positioning, and being able to memorize specific attack patterns and where to go and when. As long as you're at the Item Level minimum required to enter savage or harder and can play your class even semi-competently, your party's DPS will be fine.

DPS meters are really only wanted by people going for world first or world record clears or people that want a very clear gauge of how good at their job they are, but they aren't necessary.

Tbh I just don’t find dungeons and rading fun without a meter. And how will I know if me or someone else in my guild is underperforming without a meter.

It’s like play tennis or football without keep the score. Don’t have to be pro league for it to be something to do. It’s just not fun without.

In an organized group (Fc,statc) it is very easy to tell when your group is underperforming through kill times. Sure, it's not as easy to nail down who is underperforming in this case, but if your entire group has an ilvl that is close to max (530 right now) and your kill times are still near enrage, something is wrong. Regardless, there are 8 people in a group. If you're in an organized group chances are at least one person is parsing, so just have them upload to FFLogs if you are unwilling to / can't (ps4/5) parse.

But, I disagree that parsing is necessary in pugs. If you're pugging a tier for example, you should give up any hope of decent kill times. Also, if you have some foundation knowledge of your rotation, you should know immediately when you ♥♥♥♥ up. You don't need a parser to know - you just need to have the job foundation necessary to know you messed up your rotation. Plus, these are people you will likely rarely see again. Also, who in god's name cares about dungeon parses.

I agree parsing is an extremely useful tool in the context of individual improvement or organized groups, though.

[BrokenG3ars]

Първоначално публикувано от Kethriss:

Първоначално публикувано от Osicat:

Ok, and understand this, even if I hope there is a little challenge on dungeons/raids endgame or it feel like I will be disappointed. I played several MMO,s over the years and yes I done alot of wow and chased world ranking. But also like action games like vermintide 2 or even turnbased RPG,s or LOL Common core for games I like is fantasy. But if any kind of group content I want to be able to measure myself and compete especialy with myself.

Even in starter dungeons I wanna see a meter and have a goal to chase, and next time I do it I wana do better. IF I dont see a performance and just hit the boss I dont see a reason to do a dungeon at all.

I just find a game fun if I cant see the result of my performance and make it a competition, at least with myself. Otherwise I might as well afk

There's plenty of challenge in current tier raids and savage content. That user has a history of lying about the game to assert their unpopular views of the game are objective when they aren't.

If your enjoyment of the game is improved by a DPS meter, then pick up ACT. Just don't post about it in-game, don't share it with anybody in-game, and if your friends want to know how they're doing, then let them know privately.

There's quite a lot of mods for FF14, but they all operate under a Don't Ask, Don't Tell rule. If you keep it to yourself and use it for your own enjoyment, you will have no problems.

Just because you disagree with an objective fact doesn't make it a "lie" I'm sorry to inform you. Not a single thing I have ever said about FFXIV is a lie. The worst you could say is something I've said that's subjective is based upon my own personal experience but never have I lied about anything in the game. If you really need to character assassinate me like that to make yourself feel better about the game go for it I suppose.

Also NOWHERE did I say that there isn't challenge in the game. Maybe learn how to read yeah?

[chipofsalt]

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

Първоначално публикувано от Kethriss:

There's plenty of challenge in current tier raids and savage content. That user has a history of lying about the game to assert their unpopular views of the game are objective when they aren't.

If your enjoyment of the game is improved by a DPS meter, then pick up ACT. Just don't post about it in-game, don't share it with anybody in-game, and if your friends want to know how they're doing, then let them know privately.

There's quite a lot of mods for FF14, but they all operate under a Don't Ask, Don't Tell rule. If you keep it to yourself and use it for your own enjoyment, you will have no problems.

Just because you disagree with an objective fact doesn't make it a "lie" I'm sorry to inform you. Not a single thing I have ever said about FFXIV is a lie. The worst you could say is something I've said that's subjective is based upon my own personal experience but never have I lied about anything in the game. If you really need to character assassinate me like that to make yourself feel better about the game go for it I suppose.

Also NOWHERE did I say that there isn't challenge in the game. Maybe learn how to read yeah?

This you?

"The games actual core combat is so brain dead easy that having a DMG meter is pointless. Literally all you have to do on your end is faceroll the exact same basic handful of key rotations as everyone else and just avoid AoE's. There's better and more involved MMO's out there if you're serious about personal skill growth."

Hope your brain doesn't fall out from all that cognitive dissonance.

[BrokenG3ars]

Първоначално публикувано от chipofsalt:

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

Just because you disagree with an objective fact doesn't make it a "lie" I'm sorry to inform you. Not a single thing I have ever said about FFXIV is a lie. The worst you could say is something I've said that's subjective is based upon my own personal experience but never have I lied about anything in the game. If you really need to character assassinate me like that to make yourself feel better about the game go for it I suppose.

Also NOWHERE did I say that there isn't challenge in the game. Maybe learn how to read yeah?

This you?

"The games actual core combat is so brain dead easy that having a DMG meter is pointless. Literally all you have to do on your end is faceroll the exact same basic handful of key rotations as everyone else and just avoid AoE's. There's better and more involved MMO's out there if you're serious about personal skill growth."

Hope your brain doesn't fall out from all that cognitive dissonance.

Yup! And nothing I said there is a lie. Please by all means, point out exactly what there is a "lie" in your view?

[Oberon]

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

Първоначално публикувано от chipofsalt:

This you?

"The games actual core combat is so brain dead easy that having a DMG meter is pointless. Literally all you have to do on your end is faceroll the exact same basic handful of key rotations as everyone else and just avoid AoE's. There's better and more involved MMO's out there if you're serious about personal skill growth."

Hope your brain doesn't fall out from all that cognitive dissonance.

Yup! And nothing I said there is a lie. Please by all means, point out exactly what there is a "lie" in your view?

That is an interesting philosophical point: Is spreading incorrect information still a lie if the person spreading it fully but erroneously believes it to be true?

For instance, Savage raids--the exact things damage meters are used for--are far more than just "faceroll a keyboard and avoid AOEs." You need to know your rotation down to the exact timing, and "avoiding AOEs" often involves being in a very precise spot. For instance, the tethers in O11S second phase requires everyone to know exactly where they need to be and then get there within a second.

So it may not be a lie, it may just be that you're wrong and don't know any better.

[chipofsalt]

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

Първоначално публикувано от chipofsalt:

This you?

"The games actual core combat is so brain dead easy that having a DMG meter is pointless. Literally all you have to do on your end is faceroll the exact same basic handful of key rotations as everyone else and just avoid AoE's. There's better and more involved MMO's out there if you're serious about personal skill growth."

Hope your brain doesn't fall out from all that cognitive dissonance.

Yup! And nothing I said there is a lie. Please by all means, point out exactly what there is a "lie" in your view?

I was responding to this, actually: "Also NOWHERE did I say that there isn't challenge in the game."

But sure, you do you bud.

[BrokenG3ars]

Първоначално публикувано от The Mayor of Murder Town:

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

Yup! And nothing I said there is a lie. Please by all means, point out exactly what there is a "lie" in your view?

That is an interesting philosophical point: Is spreading incorrect information still a lie if the person spreading it fully but erroneously believes it to be true?

For instance, Savage raids--the exact things damage meters are used for--are far more than just "faceroll a keyboard and avoid AOEs." You need to know your rotation down to the exact timing, and "avoiding AOEs" often involves being in a very precise spot. For instance, the tethers in O11S second phase requires everyone to know exactly where they need to be and then get there within a second.

So it may not be a lie, it may just be that you're wrong and don't know any better.

I quite clearly said CORE COMBAT. As in character skills and how you use them. AKA the skills on your couple of hotbars. Nowhere did I state anything about NON character related mechanics. Maybe read properly next time? I literally followed that up by again saying, nowhere did I say there isn't challenging mechanics in the game.

So once again, no nothing I said was a lie lol. I was not whatsoever talking about exterior dungeon or raid mechanics.

[chipofsalt]

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

Първоначално публикувано от The Mayor of Murder Town:

That is an interesting philosophical point: Is spreading incorrect information still a lie if the person spreading it fully but erroneously believes it to be true?

For instance, Savage raids--the exact things damage meters are used for--are far more than just "faceroll a keyboard and avoid AOEs." You need to know your rotation down to the exact timing, and "avoiding AOEs" often involves being in a very precise spot. For instance, the tethers in O11S second phase requires everyone to know exactly where they need to be and then get there within a second.

So it may not be a lie, it may just be that you're wrong and don't know any better.

I quite clearly said CORE COMBAT. As in character skills and how you use them. AKA the skills on your couple of hotbars. Nowhere did I state anything about NON character related mechanics. Maybe read properly next time? I literally followed that up by again saying, nowhere did I say there isn't challenging mechanics in the game.

So once again, no nothing I said was a lie lol. I was not whatsoever talking about exterior dungeon or raid mechanics.

"...that having a DMG meter is pointless." is quite the blanket statement. Nothing wrong with being wrong. Happens to everyone. Chin up my friend.

[BrokenG3ars]

Първоначално публикувано от chipofsalt:

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

I quite clearly said CORE COMBAT. As in character skills and how you use them. AKA the skills on your couple of hotbars. Nowhere did I state anything about NON character related mechanics. Maybe read properly next time? I literally followed that up by again saying, nowhere did I say there isn't challenging mechanics in the game.

So once again, no nothing I said was a lie lol. I was not whatsoever talking about exterior dungeon or raid mechanics.

"...that having a DMG meter is pointless." is quite the blanket statement. Nothing wrong with being wrong. Happens to everyone. Chin up my friend.

Having a DMG meter for your own personal improvement is largely pointless because individual skill ceiling when it comes to actual rotations and skills is very low. What DOES take skill and has a higher ceiling is knowing and memorising mechanics and being able to adapt when someone screws them up. So no, once again, I was not wrong to say that. If you personally disagree then hey so be it lol

[Azurda]

Първоначално публикувано от Osicat:

Personally I think a dmg meter, dmg taken, deaths, interrupts, dmg to what (prio target or padding) is the core of any organized dungeonering / rading.

Ye. But the thing is, ffxiv community in general is very bad. Even compared to communities of casual games without any meaningful endgame like eso and gw2. So SE chooses to pander to bad people for MUH sub numbers by making people's snowflake safe space as safe as possible. On the bright side, people do get filtered when they try to do high-end with this mentality.

[Oberon]

Първоначално публикувано от Azurda:

So SE chooses to pander to bad people for MUH sub numbers

Pandering to "the bads" which I assume you mean "people who aren't no life MLGpro make-fun-of-anyone-who-isn't-as-good I-think-playing-video-games-is-a-personality" then, yes, obviously. SE is a business and part of that is appealing to the broadest audience possible. It's why FF14 is thriving and everyone else couldn't afford to keep a subscription.

[Azurda]

Първоначално публикувано от The Mayor of Murder Town:

Pandering to "the bads" which I assume you mean "people who aren't no life MLGpro make-fun-of-anyone-who-isn't-as-good I-think-playing-video-games-is-a-personality"

Stop projecting. As I always said, I want people to play at least normally instead of playing like a braindead ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ apes doing normal raid 2x slower than average midcore group does savage version of the same floor.

[Oberon]

Първоначално публикувано от Azurda:

Първоначално публикувано от The Mayor of Murder Town:

Pandering to "the bads" which I assume you mean "people who aren't no life MLGpro make-fun-of-anyone-who-isn't-as-good I-think-playing-video-games-is-a-personality"

Stop projecting.

Are you only saying that because you heard it and even though you don't know what it means, you think it makes you sound smart? Because saying I'm "projecting" for making fun of a particular archetype is....nonsense, to say the least.

Първоначално публикувано от Azurda:

As I always said, I want people to play at least normally instead of playing like a braindead ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ apes doing normal raid 2x slower than average midcore group does savage version of the same floor.

And they do but okay.

[Azurda]

W/e, you do you, go end up in a few more blacklists on your DC. I'm not interested in fueling up your urge to ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ for another 10 pages.

[BrokenG3ars]

Първоначално публикувано от Kethriss:

Първоначално публикувано от BrokenG3ars:

Just because you disagree with an objective fact doesn't make it a "lie" I'm sorry to inform you. Not a single thing I have ever said about FFXIV is a lie. The worst you could say is something I've said that's subjective is based upon my own personal experience but never have I lied about anything in the game. If you really need to character assassinate me like that to make yourself feel better about the game go for it I suppose.

Also NOWHERE did I say that there isn't challenge in the game. Maybe learn how to read yeah?

You calling things that fundamentally aren't true "objective facts" is in fact a lie, no matter how much you would like it to be true.

Първоначално публикувано от Azurda:

Ye. But the thing is, ffxiv community in general is very bad. Even compared to communities of casual games without any meaningful endgame like eso and gw2. So SE chooses to pander to bad people for MUH sub numbers by making people's snowflake safe space as safe as possible. On the bright side, people do get filtered when they try to do high-end with this mentality.

People thinking accessibility is a bad thing is one of the ultimate examples of why the "gamers are dead and don't have to be your audience anymore" articles were all 100% correct.

You're welcome to think whatever you want lol