[SPOILERS] Is Papyrus as strong as Sans?

[Glitterfiend]

Mega spoilers about genocide run and Gaster ahead. I'm also very sorry if I've made any grammatical mistakes, I tried my best (English is my second language). And also sorry if there were any other threads about the same subject, I searched Google with no success. Maybe I just suck at that.

I've read many theories regarding Papyrus and Sans (and Gaster). I know that Sans looks up to his brother a lot and I wonder if Paps has the incredible powers we've seen when fighting Sans. There are many hints that suggest it's true: Undyne's speech about Papyrus's strength is the best example. She tells us that "He's actually pretty freaking tough!", those are her exact words. Sans looking up to his brother may be just about his innocence and positive attitude, but what if it's also connected to their strength? We all know that in Undertale one's state of mind greatly affect his battle prowess - the bigger the bloodlust, the more damage can be inflicted. Sans, during his fight, has the pure intention of killing you - that's why he can show his full (or near-full) potential. Paps, on the other hand, never wants to hurt us or anyone else. His good nature prevents him from showing us even a fraction of his real strength. He's the only monster that won't ever let you die - if your HP dropped below 1, he would instead lock you in his shed. Even in genocide run he doesn't want to hurt you - the fight is started with him already sparing you, just like that. Could anyone tell me if I'm interpreting things wrong and provide more evidence, either supporting or disproving this theory? Sans and Papyrus are my favourite characters (especially Paps) and I'd love to know more about them.

[Cut out the unimportant paragraph, 'cause I nerded out like freakin Alphys and now I'm ashamed of it -_- ]

So, back to my original question: what do YOU think about Papyrus's strength?

Thanks for reading and have a nice day!

[200rock]

Papyrus is likely to be as strong or stronger than Sans. I've been reading up on it and it seems that it is possible. Although we never really see Papyrus's SPECIAL attack we can assume that he can take quite a few hits which is unlike Sans. Not to mention that Papyrus talks down to Sans for using his powers for such small things. This COULD imply that Papyrus has the same powers and is more powerful, but there is no solid evidence to show this. So far these are mainly assumptions, but there is one thing that shows Papyrus has one power.

It is pretty likely that Papyrus CAN see through time like Sans. You might miss these small details, but they do prove pretty important to this topic. In the fight with Papyrus in the Pacifist or Neutral route he says that he sees a hedge trimmed in the shape of his face by Asgore. This vision ends up coming true as we see the credits of the true pacifist ending. Of course this could just be a coincidence, but it doesn't explain the next detail. When you first interact with Papyrus(He sees a rock and thinks it is a human) things seems normal. If you don't save and die or just exit the game and come back, Papyrus says the rock looks familiar. This at first doesn't make sense since he's not supposed to remember. And if it was just because he saw it before you came, he would have said it was familiar the first time. If you think about it for a second what other explanation could there be, the possibility of seeing through the saves was already explained from Sans, so it seems like it is the only explanation. While we can't be sure if Papyrus is necessarily stronger than Sans, we are able to say there is something a little fishy.

[ToMatt]

Well, here's something for you to think about. During Genocide, if you stop at Papyrus and spare him then hang out with him and check his attacks box in his room, he'll say something like: "If I had used my special attack you would have been blasted.... wait... where's my special attack?" then proceeds to talk about the Annoying Dog.

The point I'm trying to make here is: Probably, just probably, Sans was already preparing to deal with you and took the blasters, which actually might belong to Papyrus, that keeping in mind that we never saw Papyrus' Special Attack. We know too little about the Skelebros to get anything from them yet, and there's also the Gaster factor which is... even more confusing.

[portal bump]

I actually believe that Papyrus is stronger then Sans, its just that "he wont hurt even a single fly."

[PanzerKirby]

Isn't supposed to be 3 persons in the gaster investigation? Gaster, Sans and Papyrus? if that is true (i remember seeing something about it, sans telling that they could see the change in the time with the save/restore). And looking at Papyrus sparing you in the genocide run ASAP makes you think if he considered frisk a friend because he "knew" from the pacifist game

[tikiman572]

I'm also of the opinion that Papyrus is perhaps one of the strongest characters in the game... it's that he just doesn't know it yet. Or maybe he did, at one point.

In the update to the game that happened earlier, a new message was discovered in Sans' Workshop: a note that simply read, "Don't forget."

I'm of the belief that this was written by Sans to remind himself not to forget who he is or what his purpose is, whatever that may be, unlike his brother, Papyrus, who HAS forgotten who he once was and thus can't display near the same level of strength that he once wielded. As such, the Papyrus we know in-game? That may very well be a false Papyrus, if you will. A separate personality created after who knows what occurred to the actual Papyrus. If this is the case, then we may very well have an Id situation on our hands here ala Xenogears.

This also ties in to Sans' depression. He exudes the personality of a jovial jokester and prankster but by this point we KNOW Sans is deeply depressed because of his knowledge of Save/Load and Reset and how meaningless everything is when it's just going to go back the way it used to earlier at any given point in time. This is just me, but I am guessing that deep down, Sans WANTS to forget, like Papyrus has forgotten, and thus truly be happy. But whatever it is that Sans knows is preventing him from doing just that. That his happiness is insignificant compared to whatever bigger plan that he is involved in.

[LastGuardian]

no spaghetti?

[Thebossinator9000]

Lets just say what sans would say Nope

[normal]

Alright, I know this hasn't been commented on for a little, But if anyone wants to discuss this further I am pretty interested, I'd like to make a few points, Sans IS the older brother of papyrus, This is proven around multiple points (But I wont go into them, Unless someone wants proof). Also, Sans is depressed, No way of getting around that, When he fights you, He isn't fighting you, He knows he will lose, and no matter what he does you will just reset the timeline, *Try starting a fight KNOWING that you have NO chance of winning, No matter what* I would like to think that he is not using his full power, Also, Sans can teleport willy-nilly while Papyrus is mostly in snowdin. Also, Papyus is very good natured, And his last "Normal" attack is powerful as all hell, *I don't think anyone avoided that attack first try* Showing that he is infact quite powerful. As powerful as sans? Maybe. Again, Sans MAY be short and stout, but he is the older brother, Papyrus is silly, Good natured and doesn't want to hurt anyone. Sans however, says on mutiple occasions that he WILL kill you if you hurt his brother, He is protective of him, He READS HIM BEDTIME STORYS, Acts as santa and gives him presents, and will kill you pretty damn fast if you hurt poeple, But have you thought about how hard he trys not to intervene with your destiny? He wont fight you if you spare EVEN JERRY. And in the pacifist ending I think he KNOWS you will win, So he sees no reason to intervene. Keep in mind, He is aware of different timelines *Papyrus MIGHT be*. And in LOG 17 when gaster says "What do you two think?" he is talking about Gaster, And the proof that he is related to them *IGNORING THE TWO POSSIBLE SPRITES* is A: He is named after a font, *Wing dings and Aster* Who else in the storyline is named after a font? B: Sprite Mystery_Man is skeletal, Who else is a skeleton? Sprite *[REDACTED*] Could be skeletal as well, But is melted beyond anyone telling. Also, The shopkeepers tell you they just "Inserted" themselfs, Without anyone knowing, The mystery behind these too may not be solved until the next game. Thanks for reading!

[Crystalitar]

Papyrus has never been directly stated as younger brother. That japanese term is only used occasionally for older brother, but ALSO is used when you respect someone or look up to. This doesnt neccesarily mean sans is older. Otherwise toby would have saod the older brother exclusive word.

[normal]

Lemme say something about Sans and pap, Sans pays the rent, tells him bedtime stories, and gives him action figures. BUUUTTT, They are skeletons, Age might not matter, But in maturity sans i s definatly the older brother, Caring for him. Also, I believe in the theory that sans and papyrus are related to gaster, I think Sans and papyrus are both powerful, But sans is more powerful, Being able to see alternate timelines and teleport. (Remmeber, Growth doesn't matter when you are a skeleton) To me, Sans is older and more powerful but again, Only toby knows this.

[Crystalitar]

In maturity yeah. Still doesn't decide who is older. Some people act childish even when older, and will keep acting that way.

[normal]

Again, They may not even age the same way we do, Sans is older maturity wise, Pap just looks older TO me.

[Exarch_Alpha]

Papyrus is dumb as a door. They aren´t really "brothers". Papyrus can believe anything, that his ridiculous puzzles are hard, that Flowey isn´t bad, and so forth (look at dialogues in the cell phone), while both the fight itself and SEVERAL moments earlier it is shown that Sans is much more than he shows when you first meet him.

That Sans bleeds while Papyrus talks even decapitated also... well makes it difficult to believe they are the same "species"... Jesus people, just think.

[Dani]

Wait...
If Papyrus has more HP than Sans, and more attack power...
If he WANTED to kill you... Would the fight be HARDER than Sans?!

[Nope]

Well Undyne DID say he's pretty tough to fight to quote her
"It's not like he's weak or anything,he's atully really frekein tough!It's just he's too nice to hurt anyone."
So yea.Papyrus IS said to be strong it's just he's too goofy to atully kill you.