An Undertale 2: A Direct Sequel Wouldn’t Be the Worst Thing Ever (some ideas)

[Collato]

I know it’s waaay to soon to be even thinking of a sequel, and I know Toby Fox said he wouldn't do a sequel; most defiantly a direct sequel and he will probably make another game entirely sometime in the distant future. And I've heard from quite a few people that a sequel (obviously mostly a direct sequel) was “never going to happened” that it would “ruin the story of Undertale,” wouldn’t “come close to being as good,” would “be lackluster,” “doesn’t need a sequel,” “it ended perfectly,” etc. And for the most part, I completely agree… but the concept of turn-based RPG/Shmup mash up is too good and extremely original to not use again… and… I love this game and the world it takes place in sooo much, and I love its characters even more. I’ve only just got to know them and I feel these characters deserve another adventure, I have never said that about any other cast from a game, movie, show, anything. Please don’t tell me I fell in love with them just to say goodbye. And yeah, I think I heard something about Toby maybe doing a comic, maybe focusing on a specific character from Undertale, and yes, that would satisfy my thirst for more Undertale… but I feel like there’s something still there, a story too big to be told through a comic. (*Spoilers from here on out I guess) I assume that the pacifist’s ending is the “true-canon” end to Undertale, but (to me at least) that ending doesn’t seem like a “happily ever after,” whether the sun is rising or setting, it just feels like the beginning of another story.

I just feel like there were too many questions left unanswered in Undertale, yes I know there probably left to interpretation or to the viewer’s imagination, but I just feel like there are huge possibilities for a story that could make for an excellent game. And Im not even talking about Gaster, or Sans’ power, or truly saving Asriel, or the power to save and load. There’s something everyone overlooks, something nobody seems to even bother to mention, something just assumed in Undertale and not given a second thought, something Im surprised nobody ever thinks about after finishing the game… What makes you so sure monsters and humans lived together peacefully? Why would they? What has changed in this world? Did the concept of monsters to humans fade into history and myth, or do the humans of the surface know of the monsters existence? You don’t think any humans, not a single one, would be furious that monsters would come take what’s there’s, there home, would be terrified at the notion of creatures that get stronger with human souls, a mere seven making them all powerful enough to wipe out humanity, would be inquisitive to their power and use them for military gain, would be fearful and violent towards something they don’t understand? Who are YOU to say that anime isn’t real in a world where MONSTERS exist and humans FOUGHT them using MAGIC TO MAKE A BARRIER TO SEAL THEM!? …Undertale 2…

There’s potential for a great game here, the notion of a war is still alluding, a choice to be made is had here. In Undertale, you decide the fate of all monsters; in a sequel, you could decide the fate of humanity, maybe even both. You can make these choices because Frisk was appointed ambassador of monsters at the end of Undertale. It kinda bothered me why this title of ambassador suddenly comes out of nowhere at the end of Undertale, it could actually be a huge thing and a great idea, if this was implemented, your actions and choices would not only represent you and affect you, but they would represent all monsters. You would be there voice whether your intentions are good or bad, the relation between humans and monsters would be up to you. Even if Toby nonchalantly used ambassador, it still can be used for something great.

I started thinking about a sequel like this after I got the pacifist ending. During the credits there are scenes of your monster friends living happily on the surface, as cute as the scenes are there’s something a bit off about them. If they live in peace with humans, why aren’t there any humans in the scenes? YES, obviously, no new character designs should have been made just for the credit scenes, and it would just seem unnecessary, and Frisk is the only (living normal) human in Undertale which is intentional. But what if there was a plot reason to see no humans, if any game this is the game where every little thing has a purpose. Maybe in a sequel, the humans evacuate an entire city for the monsters to live, a monster city, at the start it’s just inhabited by monsters, but over the course of the game and by your choices and actions, the residents would change. Humans could come in, monsters could leave, etc. This could be the game’s hub world, and yeah, a city scape is way too “Earthbound-y” for a game already influenced by Earthbound, and not very “Undertale-y” at all, but this it’s just an idea.

As for enemies, I like the idea of Chara having and “evil or demonic presence or influence.” She can/has negatively influenced Asriel and Frisk do malevolent things, I love the concept of her being the source of evil, somewhat controlling both monsters and humans to try to kill Frisk, similar to Undertale’s fighting mechanics you could either remind them of who they are and spare them, or outright kill them. Maybe combat with humans could be different then with monsters, maybe that you had to fight them and are unable to “act” but every human has a second wind with 1 hp when you land the finishing blow, there they’ll be in a mercy state where you decide to either spare or kill them. Maybe the military could be the basic human enemies. Maybe enemies “controlled” by Chara could be elite enemies and you could tell whose “possessed” by glowing red eyes and maybe a vacant smile. This could also be a way to fight your friends (first game bosses) again. And Chara could make an awesome final boss; maybe she could have like a “giygas” like final form or something like that.

There’s also an idea that the humans would have different factions or groups. You could win over different factions to side with you and the monsters, and depending on your choices and actions cause them to join you, leave, etc. Maybe befriending the faction or group’s leader or kill them to eliminate the group. Maybe some could include renegades who would be willing to fight for the monsters, or maybe descendants of the people who fought the monsters in the war and made the barrier, etc.

I also found this and there are some pretty good ideas here: http://steamcommunity.com/app/391540/discussions/0/490123197951744411/ The idea of assists from your friends is really cool to me, I think he said something like this in there but the idea of manually changing the color of your soul to use the shield or shoot could be interesting. Maybe your soul at one point is two different colors, blue and yellow, jump and shoot, etc. There could be new characters, new areas, new mechanics, maybe actual puzzles, maybe new heartwarming story concepts like maybe the idea a spirit (remnant of a soul) which could be something Flowey/Asriel could have or maybe something like a pure soul which is something Frisk could have and it could answer why she is so strong and how she even stood a chance against Asriel.

And of course there are the mysterious secret subplots of Undertale that are canon which are more than interesting enough to make a sequel. Like the mystery of Gaster, the grey monsters, saving and loading being a power that can affect time which Sans and Flowey both have. The concept of a plain of non-existence which Im assuming Gaster and the other grey monsters are in is intriguing and it would be the coolest if Gaster was a secret boss of some sort. Maybe the core could have a more nefarious purpose. The origins of this saving and loading power are also very interesting, and a way to truly save Asriel would also be the best. And the concept of Sans being in some sort of organization of time police is exceptionally a cool idea.

… So that’s it, that’s my whole dumb spiel on a direct sequel to Undertale, with some of my own dumb ideas thrown in. I know my own ideas aren’t great but hey, there just ideas. Sorry for such a long discussion post, if you have read all the way down to this point I really appreciate it and thank you a whole lot for hearing me out. I kinda got carried away and forgot to say why a direct sequel wouldn’t be the worst thing ever. I know Undertale doesn’t NEED a sequel; it’s a small humble little game, a little story, as small as the underground, everything is wrapped up perfectly, and a sequel (especially the one I painted a picture of) would not follow what Undertale stands for. Sure it could have the same theme of genocide or pacifism, but in the end it just wouldn’t be the same. Really thinking about it, maybe a sequel isn’t the best thing, because no matter the plot or how you look at it, it would just be another sequel. I guess what Im trying to say is, a sequel isn’t needed, but it sure would be nice. And by all means Im not trying to say a sequel should be made as soon as possible or sometime soon, or even eventually. But maybe saying, “a sequel will never happened” or “I would hate if a sequel was made” is a bit harsh, you never know, one could maybe be made a long long long time from now, and it could maybe be good in its own way. Maybe all I want is to see a little more of my Undertale friends, I don’t know. I just hope Toby doesn’t put a pin on the idea of a sequel quite yet, I just know there’s a tale wanting to be told there, somewhere. Thanks to anyone for listening, thanks to Toby Fox for making a fantastic game, can’t wait for the comic if that’s even happening, have a great day, and stay golden.

[Scorpix]

Everyone are happy and at last free from Flowey's timeline influence. This story is ended and there is no place for sequel or even a prequel

[!?!]

Undertale is not about good vs evil your choices matter, it's about disarming you by setting up expectations and then subverting them. You expect evil dreadknight undyne and get a goofball anime nerd. You expect to be lead into a trap by sans and it doesn't happen. You expect monster kings dark castle of evil with tons of guards and puzzles and get toriels home, no resistance and a touching backstory. You expect having to pick between humans or monsters when meeting the king and get railroaded instead.
There isn't much room for that now that the cat is out of the bag.

If it becomes too formulaic, it probably ceases to be effective because the whole point was to subvert the formula. And then there's all the 4th wall breaking the entire game hinges upon.
That, too, loses its bite after one go. There goes undertales most central, most defining plot device. Now what?

I also kind of dread all the grimdark nonsense that can come out of dealing with "humans" because of course the humans turn out to be ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ like they always do in so many stories and there isn't much room left to spin that any other way around. I envision a military strike against happy monster town with soldiers bombing and burning everything down with flamethrowers and stuff and I really don't need any of that. It would be like ruining darth vader in unneeded sequels all over again.

Also what could a 9 year old kid do to influence that? The only reason you have such significance in undertale is because monsters are pathetically weak and they're all you deal with, if we now deal with humans that all falls apart.

So the only way I can see a sequel go is down.
A game in a different kind of universe with new characters would be better, it also wouldn't have the looming specter of having to get on the level of its predecessor over its head.
Undertale is one hell if a game to live up to.

[Scorpix]

What about Undertale 0,999999: The dog story. The game in which you will learn everything about hidden powers of White dogs which are immune on Flowey's loading system.

[Strider VM]

The only thing I could say from any suggestion is this : Tobyfox said that he kept the scope of the game quite small as to make sure the game can be finished. Undertale took 3 years to develop. And he did it almost by himself. Any vast improvement from the original could cause problems down the line.

[kotamine]

Stop.
The game is out for less than a month I think.
We. Don't. Need. Another. Game.
Not now, or ever probably.
stop
Imagine stop signs
but blue
blue stop signs.
Now keep mashing them in your face
until you understand
that you need to stop.

[DankSlayer]

I would like a sequel taking place on the surface, but it would probably end up as a weak Earthbound clone.

[Chrono Atog]

I wouldn't mind a sequel per say, but not the same world/story as before. Undertale 2 would have to be a completely new story and characters, and world. Kinda like final fantasy, but give up at around X Toby when square enix buys you, because either your game will be in JPN but never released to NA (Dragon quest), or boring ass sequels of emo power fantasy.

[Pizzarugi]

Originally posted by TimtheEnchanter2806:

I don't think this game needs a sequel. It's one of those games where I think a sequel would never live up to the original if made.

[MPO]

Making a second game would contradict the first game's message that you shouldn't play god with its universe. It would have to provide a reason to justify doing so.

[MPO]

The act of Chara reincarnating as the player, who must possess Frisk to play means that same event would have to happen a second time (not to mention you messing around with timelines again), and this time, it would be intrinsically evil because you already know that's happening.

[MPO]

It would also contradict the game's theme of being a transient experience - one you are inevitably meant to say goodbye to. Flowey speaks to this at the end of the pacifist endings.

[(Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr]

The problem with a sequel is that this game self-contains its timeline in order to give every single playthrough a canonical purpose. The game essentially repeats endlessly, so making a sequel would break this concept.

[MPO]

That too.

[(Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr]

The only way I could see a possible sequel is if Toby essentially created an entirely new story and lore and kept the combat system, perhaps with a few callbacks. Similar to what Itoi did with Mother 3. Perhaps have Gaster be a villain somehow and actually explain him?

[Funny Rat Mod]

Originally posted by Balrog:

Originally posted by Sexual Villain:

I know it’s waaay to soon to be even thinking of a sequel, and I know Toby Fox said he wouldn't do a sequel; most defiantly a direct sequel and he will probably make another game entirely sometime in the distant future. And I've heard from quite a few people that a sequel (obviously mostly a direct sequel) was “never going to happened” that it would “ruin the story of Undertale,” wouldn’t “come close to being as good,” would “be lackluster,” “doesn’t need a sequel,” “it ended perfectly,” etc. And for the most part, I completely agree… but the concept of turn-based RPG/Shmup mash up is too good and extremely original to not use again… and… I love this game and the world it takes place in sooo much, and I love its characters even more. I’ve only just got to know them and I feel these characters deserve another adventure, I have never said that about any other cast from a game, movie, show, anything. Please don’t tell me I fell in love with them just to say goodbye. And yeah, I think I heard something about Toby maybe doing a comic, maybe focusing on a specific character from Undertale, and yes, that would satisfy my thirst for more Undertale… but I feel like there’s something still there, a story too big to be told through a comic. (*Spoilers from here on out I guess) I assume that the pacifist’s ending is the “true-canon” end to Undertale, but (to me at least) that ending doesn’t seem like a “happily ever after,” whether the sun is rising or setting, it just feels like the beginning of another story.

I just feel like there were too many questions left unanswered in Undertale, yes I know there probably left to interpretation or to the viewer’s imagination, but I just feel like there are huge possibilities for a story that could make for an excellent game. And Im not even talking about Gaster, or Sans’ power, or truly saving Asriel, or the power to save and load. There’s something everyone overlooks, something nobody seems to even bother to mention, something just assumed in Undertale and not given a second thought, something Im surprised nobody ever thinks about after finishing the game… What makes you so sure monsters and humans lived together peacefully? Why would they? What has changed in this world? Did the concept of monsters to humans fade into history and myth, or do the humans of the surface know of the monsters existence? You don’t think any humans, not a single one, would be furious that monsters would come take what’s there’s, there home, would be terrified at the notion of creatures that get stronger with human souls, a mere seven making them all powerful enough to wipe out humanity, would be inquisitive to their power and use them for military gain, would be fearful and violent towards something they don’t understand? Who are YOU to say that anime isn’t real in a world where MONSTERS exist and humans FOUGHT them using MAGIC TO MAKE A BARRIER TO SEAL THEM!? …Undertale 2…

There’s potential for a great game here, the notion of a war is still alluding, a choice to be made is had here. In Undertale, you decide the fate of all monsters; in a sequel, you could decide the fate of humanity, maybe even both. You can make these choices because Frisk was appointed ambassador of monsters at the end of Undertale. It kinda bothered me why this title of ambassador suddenly comes out of nowhere at the end of Undertale, it could actually be a huge thing and a great idea, if this was implemented, your actions and choices would not only represent you and affect you, but they would represent all monsters. You would be there voice whether your intentions are good or bad, the relation between humans and monsters would be up to you. Even if Toby nonchalantly used ambassador, it still can be used for something great.

I started thinking about a sequel like this after I got the pacifist ending. During the credits there are scenes of your monster friends living happily on the surface, as cute as the scenes are there’s something a bit off about them. If they live in peace with humans, why aren’t there any humans in the scenes? YES, obviously, no new character designs should have been made just for the credit scenes, and it would just seem unnecessary, and Frisk is the only (living normal) human in Undertale which is intentional. But what if there was a plot reason to see no humans, if any game this is the game where every little thing has a purpose. Maybe in a sequel, the humans evacuate an entire city for the monsters to live, a monster city, at the start it’s just inhabited by monsters, but over the course of the game and by your choices and actions, the residents would change. Humans could come in, monsters could leave, etc. This could be the game’s hub world, and yeah, a city scape is way too “Earthbound-y” for a game already influenced by Earthbound, and not very “Undertale-y” at all, but this it’s just an idea.

As for enemies, I like the idea of Chara having and “evil or demonic presence or influence.” She can/has negatively influenced Asriel and Frisk do malevolent things, I love the concept of her being the source of evil, somewhat controlling both monsters and humans to try to kill Frisk, similar to Undertale’s fighting mechanics you could either remind them of who they are and spare them, or outright kill them. Maybe combat with humans could be different then with monsters, maybe that you had to fight them and are unable to “act” but every human has a second wind with 1 hp when you land the finishing blow, there they’ll be in a mercy state where you decide to either spare or kill them. Maybe the military could be the basic human enemies. Maybe enemies “controlled” by Chara could be elite enemies and you could tell whose “possessed” by glowing red eyes and maybe a vacant smile. This could also be a way to fight your friends (first game bosses) again. And Chara could make an awesome final boss; maybe she could have like a “giygas” like final form or something like that.

There’s also an idea that the humans would have different factions or groups. You could win over different factions to side with you and the monsters, and depending on your choices and actions cause them to join you, leave, etc. Maybe befriending the faction or group’s leader or kill them to eliminate the group. Maybe some could include renegades who would be willing to fight for the monsters, or maybe descendants of the people who fought the monsters in the war and made the barrier, etc.

I also found this and there are some pretty good ideas here: http://steamcommunity.com/app/391540/discussions/0/490123197951744411/ The idea of assists from your friends is really cool to me, I think he said something like this in there but the idea of manually changing the color of your soul to use the shield or shoot could be interesting. Maybe your soul at one point is two different colors, blue and yellow, jump and shoot, etc. There could be new characters, new areas, new mechanics, maybe actual puzzles, maybe new heartwarming story concepts like maybe the idea a spirit (remnant of a soul) which could be something Flowey/Asriel could have or maybe something like a pure soul which is something Frisk could have and it could answer why she is so strong and how she even stood a chance against Asriel.

And of course there are the mysterious secret subplots of Undertale that are canon which are more than interesting enough to make a sequel. Like the mystery of Gaster, the grey monsters, saving and loading being a power that can affect time which Sans and Flowey both have. The concept of a plain of non-existence which Im assuming Gaster and the other grey monsters are in is intriguing and it would be the coolest if Gaster was a secret boss of some sort. Maybe the core could have a more nefarious purpose. The origins of this saving and loading power are also very interesting, and a way to truly save Asriel would also be the best. And the concept of Sans being in some sort of organization of time police is exceptionally a cool idea.

… So that’s it, that’s my whole dumb spiel on a direct sequel to Undertale, with some of my own dumb ideas thrown in. I know my own ideas aren’t great but hey, there just ideas. Sorry for such a long discussion post, if you have read all the way down to this point I really appreciate it and thank you a whole lot for hearing me out. I kinda got carried away and forgot to say why a direct sequel wouldn’t be the worst thing ever. I know Undertale doesn’t NEED a sequel; it’s a small humble little game, a little story, as small as the underground, everything is wrapped up perfectly, and a sequel (especially the one I painted a picture of) would not follow what Undertale stands for. Sure it could have the same theme of genocide or pacifism, but in the end it just wouldn’t be the same. Really thinking about it, maybe a sequel isn’t the best thing, because no matter the plot or how you look at it, it would just be another sequel. I guess what Im trying to say is, a sequel isn’t needed, but it sure would be nice. And by all means Im not trying to say a sequel should be made as soon as possible or sometime soon, or even eventually. But maybe saying, “a sequel will never happened” or “I would hate if a sequel was made” is a bit harsh, you never know, one could maybe be made a long long long time from now, and it could maybe be good in its own way. Maybe all I want is to see a little more of my Undertale friends, I don’t know. I just hope Toby doesn’t put a pin on the idea of a sequel quite yet, I just know there’s a tale wanting to be told there, somewhere. Thanks to anyone for listening, thanks to Toby Fox for making a fantastic game, can’t wait for the comic if that’s even happening, have a great day, and stay golden.

This reminds me...

"The wall has text has awoken"

Back to on topic, I'd actual like to see a prequal where the boy travels to the cave though. Which starts the WHOLE undertale storyline