[Spoilers] Why Doesn't Chara LOAD If They Acually Do Have A Red DT Soul Like Frisk?

[DanEgbert]

I have four reasons why Chara couldn't LOAD their save file;

1. Someone else on the surface was more determined that Chara/Asriel.

2. Chara's Soul trait wasn't DT.

3. Since Asriel absorbed Chara, not vice versa, he was in control and purposely chose not to reset because of the danger Chara was posing on humanity.

4. Chara or Asriel does not have the will to live since Chara plan failed and/or Asriel failed his best friend Chara.

None of these are detailed in the least, I just layed out the ideas and just want feedback. Tell me what you think, which one do you agree with? If none, what's your idea? If you can, tell me any evidence regarding any reasons whatsoever.

[fushigi friend]

I think it's because the plot demands that Chara doesn't reset so magic.

[DanEgbert]

Originally posted by Drowning music in Sonic:

I think it's because the plot demands that Chara doesn't reset so magic.

If I know Toby, he puts a lot of thinking in his game. There must be some reason why.

[Zeox]

Asriel was the one with the reset powers after he absorved Chara's soul, then Frisk came and since they have more determination, they are the one controlling that power.

[DanEgbert]

Originally posted by Frisk:

Asriel was the one with the reset powers after he absorved Chara's soul, then Frisk came and since they have more determination, they are the one controlling that power.

That was when he was Flowey.
I'm saying that 100 years before Frisk fell, when Chara died, why didn't Chara/Asriel choose to LOAD their save file?

[ditt_25]

Chara's era being "100 years before Frisk fell, when chara died" is kind of just fanon. Rreaonable debateable fanon, absolutely. But still blatant fanon.

There's several holes in the theory, most obviously heavily relying on two statements by three hyperbole-prone jokesters being literal and true. In addition, to, you know, overreliance on Snowdrake. Still, I'm not really in a position to stay quiet about blatant fanon treated/stated as canon theories

As for your own theories? All acceptable enough on their own. Though #3 relies on a certain headcanon I don't follow, I'd say #2 was the probably the iffy-est of the bunch.

1]Purely speculative. Offhand I see no real evidence in either direction.

2]Perhaps, though their color was almost certainly red (Coffin in New home with their name). So does that mean all the colors get multiple traits? Or is only red capable of multiple possibilties?

3]Assumes Fanon: Child Chara is evil. Don't make me bust out the literal thirty page Chara is not evil link. While overall, I personally lean more towards good/neutral Chara, SOME of the "evil" Chara subtheories do make a lot of sense. Oh, and Temmie suggested that maybe Chara isn't actually all that bad when Game Grumps said some nasty things about Chara, back when the game was young and before the Chara is good theories become notable.

4]Certainly possible. Chara had already commited suicide and, assuming they DID care for the Dreemurrs [a fanon that potentially contradicts #3], losing their brother after that couldn't have been good for them either. As for Asriel? Well, given what Asriel says at the flower bed and how he acted as Flowey, yeah lack of will is certainly possible on his end.

This theory is further evidenced by phoen calls with Toriel if you reset (not true or geno) after answering your preference, she will guess it. And say "Hee hee hee. I had a feeling. When humans fall down here, strangely... I... I often feel like I already know them." Which STRONGLY implies that she has had at least two humans (probably more) who she experienced twice due to reset. And if that's the case, how did Asgore manage to get their soul, instead of stuck in an infinite time loop? TECHNCALLY there's a few longshot ways this could happen without it being the humans having control of timeline. But those would be such significant stretches it may as well be an AU or fanfic by that point.


Anyways, A few other speculative theories (not all are well thought out) might include:

A]Asriel and Chara's combined soul counts as a seperate entity with seperate save files from regular Chara or regular Flowey. This is the theory I'm planning to go with in my own series of fics. Though no instances have been shown yet, it will apply to all combined souls within the fics. In my case a Flowey/Frisk combination, and of course, Asriel/Chara. And a pair and a trio I won't spoil here .

B]I didn't ever see Frisk resetting to some random scene on the surface. Maybe reset's effects only apply in or to the Underground. Of course, the mere existence of True Reset makes this theory questionable, but still possible.

C]Did Chara even save/know about save when they fell?

[DataFire]

its because he was battling with chara and neither of them realized they could just reset and kill the humans until asriel became flowey.

[DanEgbert]

Originally posted by ditt_25:

Chara's era being "100 years before Frisk fell, when chara died" is kind of just fanon. Rreaonable debateable fanon, absolutely. But still blatant fanon.

There's several holes in the theory, most obviously heavily relying on two statements by three hyperbole-prone jokesters being literal and true. In addition, to, you know, overreliance on Snowdrake. Still, I'm not really in a position to stay quiet about blatant fanon treated/stated as canon theories

As for your own theories? All acceptable enough on their own. Though #3 relies on a certain headcanon I don't follow, I'd say #2 was the probably the iffy-est of the bunch.

1]Purely speculative. Offhand I see no real evidence in either direction.

2]Perhaps, though their color was almost certainly red (Coffin in New home with their name). So does that mean all the colors get multiple traits? Or is only red capable of multiple possibilties?

3]Assumes Fanon: Child Chara is evil. Don't make me bust out the literal thirty page Chara is not evil link. While overall, I personally lean more towards good/neutral Chara, SOME of the "evil" Chara subtheories do make a lot of sense. Oh, and Temmie suggested that maybe Chara isn't actually all that bad when Game Grumps said some nasty things about Chara, back when the game was young and before the Chara is good theories become notable.

4]Certainly possible. Chara had already commited suicide and, assuming they DID care for the Dreemurrs [a fanon that potentially contradicts #3], losing their brother after that couldn't have been good for them either. As for Asriel? Well, given what Asriel says at the flower bed and how he acted as Flowey, yeah lack of will is certainly possible on his end.

This theory is further evidenced by phoen calls with Toriel if you reset (not true or geno) after answering your preference, she will guess it. And say "Hee hee hee. I had a feeling. When humans fall down here, strangely... I... I often feel like I already know them." Which STRONGLY implies that she has had at least two humans (probably more) who she experienced twice due to reset. And if that's the case, how did Asgore manage to get their soul, instead of stuck in an infinite time loop? TECHNCALLY there's a few longshot ways this could happen without it being the humans having control of timeline. But those would be such significant stretches it may as well be an AU or fanfic by that point.


Anyways, A few other speculative theories (not all are well thought out) might include:

A]Asriel and Chara's combined soul counts as a seperate entity with seperate save files from regular Chara or regular Flowey. This is the theory I'm planning to go with in my own series of fics. Though no instances have been shown yet, it will apply to all combined souls within the fics. In my case a Flowey/Frisk combination, and of course, Asriel/Chara. And a pair and a trio I won't spoil here .

B]I didn't ever see Frisk resetting to some random scene on the surface. Maybe reset's effects only apply in or to the Underground. Of course, the mere existence of True Reset makes this theory questionable, but still possible.

C]Did Chara even save/know about save when they fell?

You make excellent points here. I would like to say, about my theory number 3, that I never implied that Chara was evil. I said that Chara hates humanity, and Asriel said himself that Chara wasn't the best person. Asriel knew that Chara wouldn't stop at killing only 6 humans. So I never was implying that Chara was evil, I think LV determines it. High LV: Super Evil. Low LV: Neutral. As for your three theories,
1. The Chara/Asriel combo that is a different entity makes sense. However we saw from Omega Flowey that if you have enough DT, you can make a SAVE file on the go. No need for the save stars. So the different save file altogether shouldn't make that much of a difference when it is known that the Human/Monster combo has a high amount of DT, the highest ever in fact (exclusion of Frisk because reasons).

2. The only reason Frisk couldn't reset on the surface was because, at the end, your DT overpassed Frisk's because you wanted to reset so much, that you made a form of RESET that even Flowey couldn't remember. Frisk can't control the timeline if you are the real one in control.

3. Even if Chara never knew about SAVEs, that doesn't stop them from LOADing when they die.

[Strider VM]

Originally posted by danman3210:

I have four reasons why Chara couldn't LOAD their save file;

1. Someone else on the surface was more determined that Chara/Asriel.

2. Chara's Soul trait wasn't DT.

3. Since Asriel absorbed Chara, not vice versa, he was in control and purposely chose not to reset because of the danger Chara was posing on humanity.

4. Chara or Asriel does not have the will to live since Chara plan failed and/or Asriel failed his best friend Chara.

None of these are detailed in the least, I just layed out the ideas and just want feedback. Tell me what you think, which one do you agree with? If none, what's your idea? If you can, tell me any evidence regarding any reasons whatsoever.

I'm going with a different frame of mind here so here it goes.....

It's either :

a)Chara wanted to die to he could control Asriel, so "determination" is not Chara's goal but control of Asriel in which due to absorbing his soul, gives Asriel immense power.

b)They did not know determination existed yet. And it's also useless in the human world since AFAIK, Determination only exists in the Underground.

[DanEgbert]

Originally posted by ストライダー VM:

Originally posted by danman3210:

I have four reasons why Chara couldn't LOAD their save file;

1. Someone else on the surface was more determined that Chara/Asriel.

2. Chara's Soul trait wasn't DT.

3. Since Asriel absorbed Chara, not vice versa, he was in control and purposely chose not to reset because of the danger Chara was posing on humanity.

4. Chara or Asriel does not have the will to live since Chara plan failed and/or Asriel failed his best friend Chara.

None of these are detailed in the least, I just layed out the ideas and just want feedback. Tell me what you think, which one do you agree with? If none, what's your idea? If you can, tell me any evidence regarding any reasons whatsoever.

I'm going with a different frame of mind here so here it goes.....

It's either :

a)Chara wanted to die to he could control Asriel, so "determination" is not Chara's goal but control of Asriel in which due to absorbing his soul, gives Asriel immense power.

b)They did not know determination existed yet. And it's also useless in the human world since AFAIK, Determination only exists in the Underground.

About your first point, I was talking about the Asriel/Chara combo after the absorbed soul.

About your second point, even if they didn't know about DT, they could still LOAD their SAVE file, like Frisk in the beginning of the Underground. Besides, the Asriel/Chara combo died in the royal throne room. That is in the Underground, so DT should still be there. Also DT can be used on the surface, like the magical humans that locked the monsters Underground. Also, the only reason Frisk doesn't reset is because the Player has the Reset power, not them.

[Probably Gnomes]

This is very simple, in the Genocide route Flowey explains that he LOADs everytime he almost dies and his will to live exerts itself putting him back in the garden. Chara WANTED to die, it was part of his plan.

[DanEgbert]

Originally posted by VentSnek:

This is very simple, in the Genocide route Flowey explains that he LOADs everytime he almost dies and his will to live exerts itself putting him back in the garden. Chara WANTED to die, it was part of their plan.

I was talking about the Chara/Asriel fused combo. I know that Chara wanted to die, I was talking about why didn't Chariel(?) LOAD their SAVE file? It was obvious that since Chariel(?) is a Human-Monster soul combo, that it has the most DT. Then why didn't Chara RELOAD so that their "master plan" can have a second attempt.