I don't really think Chara is evil. (Spoilers)

[the voices give me callouts]

So, I've seen a lot on people saying Chara is evil, but I don't think so. First, I'm gonna establish something. I think the player is a being in the lore, since in Sans's fight he says "I always thought the anomaly was doing this because they were unhappy, and when they got what they wanted, they'd stop all of this." This anomaly sounds like the player to me, saying "they'd stop all of this". next, you might be saying, "They call themselves a demon and destroy the timeline though!" and to that, I say, wouldn't a seemingly 9-10 year old feel a bit bad about getting themselves and their best friend killed? I think it'd be a huge weight on their shoulders and caused them to develop self hate. Plus, a DEMON, not devil. A demon serves a greater evil, like maybe a person who killed their friends and families, and massacred an entire race? They obviously weren't evil when they fell, because of the things they made for their family, plus, THEY died, not Asriel. They could have persuaded Asriel to do it, I'm guessing. But they didn't. They CARE for Asriel, along with every monster they knew. They also assist you in Pacifist by giving you the memories needed to SAVE Asriel. If they really were evil, why would they help you? Thus, I believe they are good. As we see in Sans's judgement, LOVE is a substance that distances you to killing, and pain as well as letting you hurt others more. EXP as well, it causes you to hurt more, hurt OTHERS more. That plus LOVE going to CHARA specifically (because their name is in the stat menu) would cause them to be numb to pain, and appear evil or cruel. I believe that Chara was kind while alive, and that the actions of the Genocide route (the only route you see them in person on, thus not a good representation of their true self) corrupted them. EVERY character acts different on genocide. The ones I'd point out mostly are Mettaton and Alphys. They both step up and become defiant towards you for the greater good of Monsterkind. Chara, being most likely attached to your soul and the name in the menu, absorbed the LV and EXP that Sans explicitly says is a way to quantify the will and capacity to hurt. So Chara in my opinion is truly kind, but in the wrong light in the Geno Route. That's it, share what you think if you want.

[BIKING VIKING]

nah it was the player that made frisk do the geno route and chara took revenge on the player by makeing it not be able to do a proper true pacofict route
Edit: can you check out my theory? I feel kinda bad advertiseing it here but its got no reccognission yet and I think its pretty good.

[kanna]

I'm with you OP, I've always thought Chara and Frisk were both just impressionable children, AND the game is even more meta than it first seems.

Pacifist guides Chara to do good, and Genocide guides Chara to do bad (Chara specifically says "with your guidance" at the end of Genocide too, from what I've seen).

The player's input (separate from Frisk's character) is its own part of the game too. (Looks to me like Deltarune is about to take this further too, though some in-game entity keeps trying to insist the player's choices don't matter. According to who exactly? Probably Gaster I'm hoping, as I'd like to see their hidden game files become more relevant. Also, I used to enjoy messing around with writing what I used to call a "malevolent narrative" myself in the past, and it also reminds me of the idea of the "Entity" from the earlier game OneShot but without being too similar. I would love more stories like this to enjoy, that are hopefully done as well as OneShot and Undertale are.

[the voices give me callouts]

Originally posted by littlefrillymonster:

nah it was the player that made frisk do the geno route and chara took revenge on the player by makeing it not be able to do a proper true pacofict route
Edit: can you check out my theory? I feel kinda bad advertiseing it here but its got no reccognission yet and I think its pretty good.

K, I'll check it out!

[the voices give me callouts]

Originally posted by kanna:

I'm with you OP, I've always thought Chara and Frisk were both just impressionable children, AND the game is even more meta than it first seems.

Pacifist guides Chara to do good, and Genocide guides Chara to do bad (Chara specifically says "with your guidance" at the end of Genocide too, from what I've seen).

The player's input (separate from Frisk's character) is its own part of the game too. (Looks to me like Deltarune is about to take this further too, though some in-game entity keeps trying to insist the player's choices don't matter. According to who exactly? Probably Gaster I'm hoping, as I'd like to see their hidden game files become more relevant. Also, I used to enjoy messing around with writing what I used to call a "malevolent narrative" myself in the past, and it also reminds me of the idea of the "Entity" from the earlier game OneShot but without being too similar. I would love more stories like this to enjoy, that are hopefully done as well as OneShot and Undertale are.

Thanks for being with me on the theory!

[the voices give me callouts]

Originally posted by littlefrillymonster:

nah it was the player that made frisk do the geno route and chara took revenge on the player by makeing it not be able to do a proper true pacofict route
Edit: can you check out my theory? I feel kinda bad advertiseing it here but its got no reccognission yet and I think its pretty good.

I can't find it, can you say what it's about?

[Dawning Light]

Does no one remember the final attack that hits Sans is actually Chara themself, Frisk/The Player(You) misses and a second slash that doesn't involve you hitting attack causes him to die. Now the player does have to go out of their way to defeat every single monster for a True Genocide, but I feel like Chara isn't being influenced by the player, but the other way around Chara is influencing Frisk as much as you are. Asriel and Chara both hated humanity and monster-kind because of how they died. Also, don't forget, Asriel aka Flowey, was terrified of Chara by the end of the True Genocide to the point of begging and bargaining just to live. I feel like the order of the game is Neutral first then splits into two paths depending on Frisk's action. I also don't see the jumpscare ending as a punishment for what you did, but for trying to resist Chara's demand. They see you as a willing accomplice and once you start backing out they exploit your weakness. Saying, "Since when were you the one in control?" That's how I see it anyway.

[FraЗ0ahg2r]

Originally posted by Dawning Light:

Does no one remember the final attack that hits Sans is actually Chara themself, Frisk/The Player(You) misses and a second slash that doesn't involve you hitting attack causes him to die. Now the player does have to go out of their way to defeat every single monster for a True Genocide, but I feel like Chara isn't being influenced by the player, but the other way around Chara is influencing Frisk as much as you are. Asriel and Chara both hated humanity and monster-kind because of how they died. Also, don't forget, Asriel aka Flowey, was terrified of Chara by the end of the True Genocide to the point of begging and bargaining just to live. I feel like the order of the game is Neutral first then splits into two paths depending on Frisk's action. I also don't see the jumpscare ending as a punishment for what you did, but for trying to resist Chara's demand. They see you as a willing accomplice and once you start backing out they exploit your weakness. Saying, "Since when were you the one in control?" That's how I see it anyway.

remember that Asriel is not really himself as Flowey

[(Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr]

Originally posted by Dawning Light:

Does no one remember the final attack that hits Sans is actually Chara themself, Frisk/The Player(You) misses and a second slash that doesn't involve you hitting attack causes him to die. Now the player does have to go out of their way to defeat every single monster for a True Genocide, but I feel like Chara isn't being influenced by the player, but the other way around Chara is influencing Frisk as much as you are. Asriel and Chara both hated humanity and monster-kind because of how they died. Also, don't forget, Asriel aka Flowey, was terrified of Chara by the end of the True Genocide to the point of begging and bargaining just to live. I feel like the order of the game is Neutral first then splits into two paths depending on Frisk's action. I also don't see the jumpscare ending as a punishment for what you did, but for trying to resist Chara's demand. They see you as a willing accomplice and once you start backing out they exploit your weakness. Saying, "Since when were you the one in control?" That's how I see it anyway.

When Chara and Asriel went to the surface, Chara believed that they should kill the humans outright as the humans would attack back. Asriel did not believe in fighting them as he thought it was wrong to do so. When Asriel became Flowey, he lost the ability to empathize with others and so took on Chara’s way of thinking since they would have survived if he had.

The point of the pacifist route is that you are proving to Asriel that his initial view was right. In genocide you are proving that Chara’s stance was right.

The main character is shared between 3 entities:
Chara Who represents the mind and the physical mechanics and limitations of the game, including stats, menus, files, and lore. Chara serves as the game’s narrator giving you information on all monsters and objects you check.

Frisk Represents the body, the medium in which the player is able to interact with the game’s world. They are associated with the more emotional side of a game that gives the player more moral purpose over numbers. Frisk however cannot do anything on their own as they are just a puppet.

You The player is both metaphorically and literally the soul of the main character. You mediate between the body and mind to make the decisions. Pacifist is a stance towards emotional play, while Genocide is playing a numbers game.

Chara is not evil, at least not initially. However, the more you prove their kill or be killed stance correct, the more they begin to abuse the game mechanics and become emotionally detached from the game’s world. By the end of the genocide route, Chara is fully aware that Undertale is a game, and that what happens in it is ultimately meaningless.

Chara sees no point in playing the game further and takes the pacifist ending from you to spite your reluctance to let the game go. Chara kills everyone, because they no longer care, the game doesn’t matter.

The true consequences of the genocide route are that you make Chara, and the game itself, become irreversibly evil.

[BIKING VIKING]

Originally posted by jevil kicked the baby:

Originally posted by littlefrillymonster:

nah it was the player that made frisk do the geno route and chara took revenge on the player by makeing it not be able to do a proper true pacofict route
Edit: can you check out my theory? I feel kinda bad advertiseing it here but its got no reccognission yet and I think its pretty good.

K, I'll check it out!

THANK YOU VERY MUCH! its called i have a theory about undyne and asgores weapons if u cant find it

[the voices give me callouts]

Originally posted by Dawning Light:

Does no one remember the final attack that hits Sans is actually Chara themself, Frisk/The Player(You) misses and a second slash that doesn't involve you hitting attack causes him to die. Now the player does have to go out of their way to defeat every single monster for a True Genocide, but I feel like Chara isn't being influenced by the player, but the other way around Chara is influencing Frisk as much as you are. Asriel and Chara both hated humanity and monster-kind because of how they died. Also, don't forget, Asriel aka Flowey, was terrified of Chara by the end of the True Genocide to the point of begging and bargaining just to live. I feel like the order of the game is Neutral first then splits into two paths depending on Frisk's action. I also don't see the jumpscare ending as a punishment for what you did, but for trying to resist Chara's demand. They see you as a willing accomplice and once you start backing out they exploit your weakness. Saying, "Since when were you the one in control?" That's how I see it anyway.

So, to me, the jumpscare was for murdering their entire family. Chara is the one to kill Sans because from what I think the LOVE corrupts and makes someone evil, and the hit was to finish what YOU, THE PLAYER, had started by attacking the enemies. Like Edgy Asriel said, the Genocide caused them to be detached.

[the voices give me callouts]

Originally posted by Dawning Light:

Does no one remember the final attack that hits Sans is actually Chara themself, Frisk/The Player(You) misses and a second slash that doesn't involve you hitting attack causes him to die. Now the player does have to go out of their way to defeat every single monster for a True Genocide, but I feel like Chara isn't being influenced by the player, but the other way around Chara is influencing Frisk as much as you are. Asriel and Chara both hated humanity and monster-kind because of how they died. Also, don't forget, Asriel aka Flowey, was terrified of Chara by the end of the True Genocide to the point of begging and bargaining just to live. I feel like the order of the game is Neutral first then splits into two paths depending on Frisk's action. I also don't see the jumpscare ending as a punishment for what you did, but for trying to resist Chara's demand. They see you as a willing accomplice and once you start backing out they exploit your weakness. Saying, "Since when were you the one in control?" That's how I see it anyway.

Also, the "When were you in control?" references the final kills that were powered by a LOVE 20 being, with the ability to destroy the world. It kills Sans without input, deals over 9999 damage to Asgore, and no matter what you kill Flowey. All of that was Chara at maximum emotional detatchment, or numbness, from what i think.

[Casual Amateur]

Originally posted by (Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr:

Chara Who represents the mind and the physical mechanics and limitations of the game, including stats, menus, files, and lore. Chara serves as the game’s narrator giving you information on all monsters and objects you check.

About narrator part. There clearly hint that there 2 narrator. Keep in mind that there every character have their own voice sound theme. Its clearly that some one narrator in middle of monster battle are clearly not Chara at all and sound nothing a like.

[Casual Amateur]

Originally posted by jevil kicked the baby:

Originally posted by Dawning Light:

Does no one remember the final attack that hits Sans is actually Chara themself, Frisk/The Player(You) misses and a second slash that doesn't involve you hitting attack causes him to die. Now the player does have to go out of their way to defeat every single monster for a True Genocide, but I feel like Chara isn't being influenced by the player, but the other way around Chara is influencing Frisk as much as you are. Asriel and Chara both hated humanity and monster-kind because of how they died. Also, don't forget, Asriel aka Flowey, was terrified of Chara by the end of the True Genocide to the point of begging and bargaining just to live. I feel like the order of the game is Neutral first then splits into two paths depending on Frisk's action. I also don't see the jumpscare ending as a punishment for what you did, but for trying to resist Chara's demand. They see you as a willing accomplice and once you start backing out they exploit your weakness. Saying, "Since when were you the one in control?" That's how I see it anyway.

So, to me, the jumpscare was for murdering their entire family. Chara is the one to kill Sans because from what I think the LOVE corrupts and makes someone evil, and the hit was to finish what YOU, THE PLAYER, had started by attacking the enemies. Like Edgy Asriel said, the Genocide caused them to be detached.

That basically what you think. From my point of view there nothing in it say that think like that at all. Also ideal of love thing can also mean that they also them to be detached from every body they meet. Clearly they didn't do any thing to stop the killing from happen any way.

[(Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr]

Originally posted by Mossy Mushroom:

Originally posted by (Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr:

Chara Who represents the mind and the physical mechanics and limitations of the game, including stats, menus, files, and lore. Chara serves as the game’s narrator giving you information on all monsters and objects you check.

About narrator part. There clearly hint that there 2 narrator. Keep in mind that there every character have their own voice sound theme. Its clearly that some one narrator in middle of monster battle are clearly not Chara at all and sound nothing a like.

Chara is the only one of the three that would know anything about the monsters, though.

[Crtl_Hit]

I agree and i don't get why people blame Chara for their actions