Smite: The unbalancing Stuns disaster that is S3.

[HeftyOtter]

This game, does have too much CC on almost every god, not only do certain gods stun or slow or silence but it bothers me how ♥♥♥♥ing broken almost every god is now, it doesn't even matter how good or bad you are, it feels stale how easy you can get a kill by stunning another player repeatedly, we went up against 3 hunters in joust and we won regardless because we somehow managed to out play them but it's incredible how you can be 3 hunter in joust and somehow win with high damage just but keeping a player in the same spot longer than they need to be.

I came from League because I quit it a while back and I am sure that I'm going to get bashed just for mentioning it but I came from league because how bad the unbalancing was but this game is starting to out-unbalance league and that's saying something.

If everyone god needs CC or some sort of an un-fair advantage, than there is no point of even bothering to try to play almost any game when almost every god has a stun.

[Hydrataur]

Skill shots and basic attacks are much harder to hit in Smite than in LoL so you need some CC to make it possible. Search "Smite Real God Reveal" in youtube. It's a series made by Mythymoo. It shows how unbalanced everything is (it's not entirely true, but it's funny to see the insane damage potential every god has)

[TheZooted1]

lmao if a little bit of cc makes u think unbalance then just leave the game plz bye geting tired of alll the whiny posts crying about this and that if u dont like it then dont play

[HeftyOtter]

Originally posted by TheZooted1:

lmao if a little bit of cc makes u think unbalance then just leave the game plz bye geting tired of alll the whiny posts crying about this and that if u dont like it then dont play

If you're tired of hearing it why bother going to these kinds of discussions in the first place? honestly that's just hypocritical and I never said that I didn't like the game just I care enough about this game to address problems I see and like to talk about it.

[EmethSAS]

I played LoL also before coming to Smite and after a few months of playing Smite I felt the same way about CC that you do now, and this was back in S2... The CC thing isn't a product of S3, it's been a part of Smite's game design since the beginning, which is something I came to understand as I learned more about Smite from playing for a longer period of time and analyzing how things worked together.

The reason for all the CC is because of two other design choices HiRez has made for Smite:
1) The over-the-shoulder perspective, which makes skillshots, bodyblocks, positioning around structural features of the map, and so on major mechanics in Smite versus similar games like LoL.
2) HiRez has designed the game to have shorter playtimes on average than LoL or DOTA2, and ensuring that the average playtime for all modes including (and especially) Conquest remain around 30 minutes has influenced many of their other design choices in the game, such as the damage structures do, the way Gold Fury and Fire Giant work (in contrast to Dragon and Beren in LoL), the way the buff camps work, the way potions work, etc. Smite is designed around killing stalemate scenarios and avoiding "turtling" so the game is constantly moving.

Particularly when it comes to basic attacks being skillshots and wanting to avoid stalemates, having lots of CC to ensure that well-coordinated teams can secure damage and kills and make progress towards completing the objectives is a helpful design choice for achieving the goals HiRez has laid out for Smite.

On the other side of the coin, but much less talked about, is the fact that there are also far more leap (and other related mobility) abilities in Smite god kits than in LoL champ kits... This is the design choice for Smite to help counter all the CC they've put in: including a bunch of options for getting you out of a bad spot and avoiding CC and/or the subsequent damage to a better position.

How many ADCs in LoL have "escape" abilities to get them out of trouble when they get ganked? Very few... Tristana's leap is one of her "unique" features that other LoL ADCs don't have.

Now compare that to how many ADCs in Smite have "escape" abilities? Almost all of them, and those that don't struggle to compete, at least on the pro level, even if they have crazy amounts of damage or boxing potential like AMC or Skadi.

You could make the argument that it's a symptom of all the CC-power-creep, but given what I've seen with the design choices HiRez has made over the year I've been playing, I think it's more of an intentional design choice: they want there to be lots of options for making huge plays by locking down and anihilating an opponent or by countering that lockdown and escaping to be able to turn around and anihilate right back. It's an MMA fighting match rather than an Olympic wrestling match or an American football game rather than a FIFA futbol game. Both are equally valid approaches to game design, so I'm not saying Smite is better than LoL anymore than American football is better than FIFA futbol/football; they're just designed differently.

So the answer to all the CC is learning the counters to CC: anti-CC items and mobility options, especially when combined together.

But from what I've seen, it isn't a run-away balance factor, because they've also tried giving us gods even recently like Bellona or Chiron or Amaterasu or Skadi or Jing Wei or Izanami that don't really have strong CC (except for on their Ults for some of them). And in a lot of cases the gods that seem to be the most difficult for them to balance are the ones without CC because they're either too powerful with too much easy damage or too weak with no way to confirm their damage. So I think the CC/mobility counter-pairing is an intentional design choice because trying to step away from that too much has been a problem, AT LEAST with the goal of avoiding stalemate scenarios.

Or maybe Smite isn't the game for you; you're the type of person that likes FIFA and not the NFL or vice-versa... If you disagree with how they've designed the game with the goal of avoiding those stalemate scenarios by packing in CC and such, then maybe DOTA2 is more up your alley if you feel like LoL is getting too unbalanced...

But if you want to stick with Smite, just keep learning and asking questions and watching other people play on Twitch or YouTube or whatever and you'll get there...

[Hydrataur]

Originally posted by EmethSAS:

I played LoL also before coming to Smite and after a few months of playing Smite I felt the same way about CC that you do now, and this was back in S2... The CC thing isn't a product of S3, it's been a part of Smite's game design since the beginning, which is something I came to understand as I learned more about Smite from playing for a longer period of time and analyzing how things worked together.

The reason for all the CC is because of two other design choices HiRez has made for Smite:
1) The over-the-shoulder perspective, which makes skillshots, bodyblocks, positioning around structural features of the map, and so on major mechanics in Smite versus similar games like LoL.
2) HiRez has designed the game to have shorter playtimes on average than LoL or DOTA2, and ensuring that the average playtime for all modes including (and especially) Conquest remain around 30 minutes has influenced many of their other design choices in the game, such as the damage structures do, the way Gold Fury and Fire Giant work (in contrast to Dragon and Beren in LoL), the way the buff camps work, the way potions work, etc. Smite is designed around killing stalemate scenarios and avoiding "turtling" so the game is constantly moving.

Particularly when it comes to basic attacks being skillshots and wanting to avoid stalemates, having lots of CC to ensure that well-coordinated teams can secure damage and kills and make progress towards completing the objectives is a helpful design choice for achieving the goals HiRez has laid out for Smite.

On the other side of the coin, but much less talked about, is the fact that there are also far more leap (and other related mobility) abilities in Smite god kits than in LoL champ kits... This is the design choice for Smite to help counter all the CC they've put in: including a bunch of options for getting you out of a bad spot and avoiding CC and/or the subsequent damage to a better position.

How many ADCs in LoL have "escape" abilities to get them out of trouble when they get ganked? Very few... Tristana's leap is one of her "unique" features that other LoL ADCs don't have.

Now compare that to how many ADCs in Smite have "escape" abilities? Almost all of them, and those that don't struggle to compete, at least on the pro level, even if they have crazy amounts of damage or boxing potential like AMC or Skadi.

You could make the argument that it's a symptom of all the CC-power-creep, but given what I've seen with the design choices HiRez has made over the year I've been playing, I think it's more of an intentional design choice: they want there to be lots of options for making huge plays by locking down and anihilating an opponent or by countering that lockdown and escaping to be able to turn around and anihilate right back. It's an MMA match rather than a wrestling match or an American football game rather than a FIFA futbol game. Both are equally valid approaches to game design, so I'm not saying Smite is better than LoL anymore than American football is better than FIFA futbol/football; they're just designed differently.

So the answer to all the CC is learning the counters to CC: anti-CC items and mobility options, especially when combined together.

But from what I've seen, it isn't a run-away balance factor, because they've also tried giving us gods even recently like Bellona or Chiron or Amaterasu or Skadi or Jing Wei or Izanami that don't really have strong CC (except for on their Ults for some of them). And in a lot of cases the gods that seem to be the most difficult for them to balance are the ones without CC because they're either too powerful with too much easy damage or too weak with no way to confirm their damage. So I think the CC/mobility counter-pairing is an intentional design choice because trying to step away from that too much has been a problem, AT LEAST with the goal of avoiding stalemate scenarios.

Or maybe Smite isn't the game for you; you're the type of person that likes FIFA and not the NFL or vice-versa... If you disagree with how they've designed the game with the goal of avoiding those stalemate scenarios by packing in CC and such, then maybe DOTA2 is more up your alley if you feel like LoL is getting too unbalanced...

But if you want to stick with Smite, just keep learning and asking questions and watching other people play on Twitch or YouTube or whatever and you'll get there...

#MakeTheForumsGreatAgain
Emeth for moderator

[Ayhm]

Originally posted by TheZooted1:

lmao if a little bit of cc makes u think unbalance then just leave the game plz bye geting tired of alll the whiny posts crying about this and that if u dont like it then dont play

Was just about to say that

[Goregutz]

Originally posted by Hydrataur:

Originally posted by EmethSAS:

I played LoL also before coming to Smite and after a few months of playing Smite I felt the same way about CC that you do now, and this was back in S2... The CC thing isn't a product of S3, it's been a part of Smite's game design since the beginning, which is something I came to understand as I learned more about Smite from playing for a longer period of time and analyzing how things worked together.

The reason for all the CC is because of two other design choices HiRez has made for Smite:
1) The over-the-shoulder perspective, which makes skillshots, bodyblocks, positioning around structural features of the map, and so on major mechanics in Smite versus similar games like LoL.
2) HiRez has designed the game to have shorter playtimes on average than LoL or DOTA2, and ensuring that the average playtime for all modes including (and especially) Conquest remain around 30 minutes has influenced many of their other design choices in the game, such as the damage structures do, the way Gold Fury and Fire Giant work (in contrast to Dragon and Beren in LoL), the way the buff camps work, the way potions work, etc. Smite is designed around killing stalemate scenarios and avoiding "turtling" so the game is constantly moving.

Particularly when it comes to basic attacks being skillshots and wanting to avoid stalemates, having lots of CC to ensure that well-coordinated teams can secure damage and kills and make progress towards completing the objectives is a helpful design choice for achieving the goals HiRez has laid out for Smite.

On the other side of the coin, but much less talked about, is the fact that there are also far more leap (and other related mobility) abilities in Smite god kits than in LoL champ kits... This is the design choice for Smite to help counter all the CC they've put in: including a bunch of options for getting you out of a bad spot and avoiding CC and/or the subsequent damage to a better position.

How many ADCs in LoL have "escape" abilities to get them out of trouble when they get ganked? Very few... Tristana's leap is one of her "unique" features that other LoL ADCs don't have.

Now compare that to how many ADCs in Smite have "escape" abilities? Almost all of them, and those that don't struggle to compete, at least on the pro level, even if they have crazy amounts of damage or boxing potential like AMC or Skadi.

You could make the argument that it's a symptom of all the CC-power-creep, but given what I've seen with the design choices HiRez has made over the year I've been playing, I think it's more of an intentional design choice: they want there to be lots of options for making huge plays by locking down and anihilating an opponent or by countering that lockdown and escaping to be able to turn around and anihilate right back. It's an MMA match rather than a wrestling match or an American football game rather than a FIFA futbol game. Both are equally valid approaches to game design, so I'm not saying Smite is better than LoL anymore than American football is better than FIFA futbol/football; they're just designed differently.

So the answer to all the CC is learning the counters to CC: anti-CC items and mobility options, especially when combined together.

But from what I've seen, it isn't a run-away balance factor, because they've also tried giving us gods even recently like Bellona or Chiron or Amaterasu or Skadi or Jing Wei or Izanami that don't really have strong CC (except for on their Ults for some of them). And in a lot of cases the gods that seem to be the most difficult for them to balance are the ones without CC because they're either too powerful with too much easy damage or too weak with no way to confirm their damage. So I think the CC/mobility counter-pairing is an intentional design choice because trying to step away from that too much has been a problem, AT LEAST with the goal of avoiding stalemate scenarios.

Or maybe Smite isn't the game for you; you're the type of person that likes FIFA and not the NFL or vice-versa... If you disagree with how they've designed the game with the goal of avoiding those stalemate scenarios by packing in CC and such, then maybe DOTA2 is more up your alley if you feel like LoL is getting too unbalanced...

But if you want to stick with Smite, just keep learning and asking questions and watching other people play on Twitch or YouTube or whatever and you'll get there...

#MakeTheForumsGreatAgain
Emeth for moderator

I support Emeth for mod.

[丹尼]

If you think the stuns in Smite are bad dont even try Dota 2

[HeftyOtter]

Originally posted by EmethSAS:

I played LoL also before coming to Smite and after a few months of playing Smite I felt the same way about CC that you do now, and this was back in S2... The CC thing isn't a product of S3, it's been a part of Smite's game design since the beginning, which is something I came to understand as I learned more about Smite from playing for a longer period of time and analyzing how things worked together.

The reason for all the CC is because of two other design choices HiRez has made for Smite:
1) The over-the-shoulder perspective, which makes skillshots, bodyblocks, positioning around structural features of the map, and so on major mechanics in Smite versus similar games like LoL.
2) HiRez has designed the game to have shorter playtimes on average than LoL or DOTA2, and ensuring that the average playtime for all modes including (and especially) Conquest remain around 30 minutes has influenced many of their other design choices in the game, such as the damage structures do, the way Gold Fury and Fire Giant work (in contrast to Dragon and Beren in LoL), the way the buff camps work, the way potions work, etc. Smite is designed around killing stalemate scenarios and avoiding "turtling" so the game is constantly moving.

Particularly when it comes to basic attacks being skillshots and wanting to avoid stalemates, having lots of CC to ensure that well-coordinated teams can secure damage and kills and make progress towards completing the objectives is a helpful design choice for achieving the goals HiRez has laid out for Smite.

On the other side of the coin, but much less talked about, is the fact that there are also far more leap (and other related mobility) abilities in Smite god kits than in LoL champ kits... This is the design choice for Smite to help counter all the CC they've put in: including a bunch of options for getting you out of a bad spot and avoiding CC and/or the subsequent damage to a better position.

How many ADCs in LoL have "escape" abilities to get them out of trouble when they get ganked? Very few... Tristana's leap is one of her "unique" features that other LoL ADCs don't have.

Now compare that to how many ADCs in Smite have "escape" abilities? Almost all of them, and those that don't struggle to compete, at least on the pro level, even if they have crazy amounts of damage or boxing potential like AMC or Skadi.

You could make the argument that it's a symptom of all the CC-power-creep, but given what I've seen with the design choices HiRez has made over the year I've been playing, I think it's more of an intentional design choice: they want there to be lots of options for making huge plays by locking down and anihilating an opponent or by countering that lockdown and escaping to be able to turn around and anihilate right back. It's an MMA fighting match rather than an Olympic wrestling match or an American football game rather than a FIFA futbol game. Both are equally valid approaches to game design, so I'm not saying Smite is better than LoL anymore than American football is better than FIFA futbol/football; they're just designed differently.

So the answer to all the CC is learning the counters to CC: anti-CC items and mobility options, especially when combined together.

But from what I've seen, it isn't a run-away balance factor, because they've also tried giving us gods even recently like Bellona or Chiron or Amaterasu or Skadi or Jing Wei or Izanami that don't really have strong CC (except for on their Ults for some of them). And in a lot of cases the gods that seem to be the most difficult for them to balance are the ones without CC because they're either too powerful with too much easy damage or too weak with no way to confirm their damage. So I think the CC/mobility counter-pairing is an intentional design choice because trying to step away from that too much has been a problem, AT LEAST with the goal of avoiding stalemate scenarios.

Or maybe Smite isn't the game for you; you're the type of person that likes FIFA and not the NFL or vice-versa... If you disagree with how they've designed the game with the goal of avoiding those stalemate scenarios by packing in CC and such, then maybe DOTA2 is more up your alley if you feel like LoL is getting too unbalanced...

But if you want to stick with Smite, just keep learning and asking questions and watching other people play on Twitch or YouTube or whatever and you'll get there...

Yeah I normally try to learn how to counter CC when it comes to smite and I do tend to be successful at times when my team is working together, I just normally wanted to let out some steam (no pun intended) from the stress smite brings, I still love smite no matter what I just needed to vent about the whole CC thing.

[Fabio]

Originally posted by EmethSAS:

I played LoL also before coming to Smite and after a few months of playing Smite I felt the same way about CC that you do now, and this was back in S2... The CC thing isn't a product of S3, it's been a part of Smite's game design since the beginning, which is something I came to understand as I learned more about Smite from playing for a longer period of time and analyzing how things worked together.

The reason for all the CC is because of two other design choices HiRez has made for Smite:
1) The over-the-shoulder perspective, which makes skillshots, bodyblocks, positioning around structural features of the map, and so on major mechanics in Smite versus similar games like LoL.
2) HiRez has designed the game to have shorter playtimes on average than LoL or DOTA2, and ensuring that the average playtime for all modes including (and especially) Conquest remain around 30 minutes has influenced many of their other design choices in the game, such as the damage structures do, the way Gold Fury and Fire Giant work (in contrast to Dragon and Beren in LoL), the way the buff camps work, the way potions work, etc. Smite is designed around killing stalemate scenarios and avoiding "turtling" so the game is constantly moving.

Particularly when it comes to basic attacks being skillshots and wanting to avoid stalemates, having lots of CC to ensure that well-coordinated teams can secure damage and kills and make progress towards completing the objectives is a helpful design choice for achieving the goals HiRez has laid out for Smite.

On the other side of the coin, but much less talked about, is the fact that there are also far more leap (and other related mobility) abilities in Smite god kits than in LoL champ kits... This is the design choice for Smite to help counter all the CC they've put in: including a bunch of options for getting you out of a bad spot and avoiding CC and/or the subsequent damage to a better position.

How many ADCs in LoL have "escape" abilities to get them out of trouble when they get ganked? Very few... Tristana's leap is one of her "unique" features that other LoL ADCs don't have.

Now compare that to how many ADCs in Smite have "escape" abilities? Almost all of them, and those that don't struggle to compete, at least on the pro level, even if they have crazy amounts of damage or boxing potential like AMC or Skadi.

You could make the argument that it's a symptom of all the CC-power-creep, but given what I've seen with the design choices HiRez has made over the year I've been playing, I think it's more of an intentional design choice: they want there to be lots of options for making huge plays by locking down and anihilating an opponent or by countering that lockdown and escaping to be able to turn around and anihilate right back. It's an MMA fighting match rather than an Olympic wrestling match or an American football game rather than a FIFA futbol game. Both are equally valid approaches to game design, so I'm not saying Smite is better than LoL anymore than American football is better than FIFA futbol/football; they're just designed differently.

So the answer to all the CC is learning the counters to CC: anti-CC items and mobility options, especially when combined together.

But from what I've seen, it isn't a run-away balance factor, because they've also tried giving us gods even recently like Bellona or Chiron or Amaterasu or Skadi or Jing Wei or Izanami that don't really have strong CC (except for on their Ults for some of them). And in a lot of cases the gods that seem to be the most difficult for them to balance are the ones without CC because they're either too powerful with too much easy damage or too weak with no way to confirm their damage. So I think the CC/mobility counter-pairing is an intentional design choice because trying to step away from that too much has been a problem, AT LEAST with the goal of avoiding stalemate scenarios.

Or maybe Smite isn't the game for you; you're the type of person that likes FIFA and not the NFL or vice-versa... If you disagree with how they've designed the game with the goal of avoiding those stalemate scenarios by packing in CC and such, then maybe DOTA2 is more up your alley if you feel like LoL is getting too unbalanced...

But if you want to stick with Smite, just keep learning and asking questions and watching other people play on Twitch or YouTube or whatever and you'll get there...

This was a pleasure to read. Good job. :)

[EmethSAS]

Originally posted by Kev:

Yeah I normally try to learn how to counter CC when it comes to smite and I do tend to be successful at times when my team is working together, I just normally wanted to let out some steam (no pun intended) from the stress smite brings, I still love smite no matter what I just needed to vent about the whole CC thing.

No problem. It's understandable. I've been in the same boat and it certainly can be frustrating.

To all the other commenters, thanks for the kind words.

[丹尼]

Originally posted by EmethSAS:

Originally posted by Kev:

Yeah I normally try to learn how to counter CC when it comes to smite and I do tend to be successful at times when my team is working together, I just normally wanted to let out some steam (no pun intended) from the stress smite brings, I still love smite no matter what I just needed to vent about the whole CC thing.

No problem. It's understandable. I've been in the same boat and it certainly can be frustrating.

To all the other commenters, thanks for the kind words.

I enjoyed reading your post but why reccommend him DOTA 2 when the CC is even worst?

[EmethSAS]

Originally posted by ChitogeBestGrill:

Originally posted by EmethSAS:

No problem. It's understandable. I've been in the same boat and it certainly can be frustrating.

To all the other commenters, thanks for the kind words.

I enjoyed reading your post but why reccommend him DOTA 2 when the CC is even worst?

I dunno much about DOTA2, except that it is designed more similarly to LoL than Smite is, so if there's more CC there then I guess someone who doesn't like CC would have to hope LoL gets better again... Or maybe there's something to CC and MOBAs? I don't know; I just know what I said in the post about Smite.

[hngggg]

Originally posted by TheZooted1:

lmao if a little bit of cc makes u think unbalance then just leave the game plz bye geting tired of alll the whiny posts crying about this and that if u dont like it then dont play

Lmao dude, he's right, everyone can ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ stun or fly or jump or chase someone behind enemy lines etc, i bet ur the one using thanatos/loki only, the op bastards

[RecalledDread]

Originally posted by TheZooted1:

lmao if a little bit of cc makes u think unbalance then just leave the game plz bye geting tired of alll the whiny posts crying about this and that if u dont like it then dont play

To be fair, if the enemy team has Nu Wa and Fafnir, they can stun you for a very long time if they time it right. You will likely be killed before the stun is over. I think I was stunned for over 4 seconds in one game multiple times. Obviously Purification can counter it, and I think Sanctuary too (or at least helps anyway), but can still be annoying at times.