Izanami?

[plooo]

What do you guys think so far? Is she op or fairly balanced.
I think she's pretty strong, I don't know about broken yet, she feels so weak to me. I personally don't find her that fun to play. I still think Rama and Neith are just better and every other magical ADC.

[TheGooeyBeans]

Originally posted by Amber:

What do you guys think so far? Is she op or fairly balanced.
I think she's pretty strong, I don't know about broken yet, she feels so weak to me. I personally don't find her that fun to play. I still think Rama and Neith are just better and every other magical ADC.

So just to start...you cannot say "she's pretty strong" and then say "she feels so weak to me." If what you mean is you are having a hard time having success with her, while other people are, we need to evaluate your builds. Izanami is a difficult hunter to play, but I think once people learn (and exploit) what makes her great, they will find she is a strong choice. I have played nine Conquest games with her (5W-4L), and my total KDA is 53/15/22 (4.27).

First...do not treat her like a hunter! Think of her more as a burst mage or assassin. She has easy wave clear at the start of the game with her Spectral Projection (level this first), a great steroid in Sickle Storm (level this second), a handy escape/stealth (level this last), and a nuke ultimate that is hilariously overpowered (level this at 5-9/10-13/14-17-20).

Unlike Apollo or Rama, you won't be able to be an effective force by building crit items. Trans builds DO work on her, but personally I have never liked Trans builds as they seem to most effective mid-game, and fall off late. Try this...

Death's Toll - Short Bow - Pots

You'll want to finish Ichaival, then build Warrior Tabi - Asi - Qin's Sais - Titan's Bane - Brawler's Beatstick. At the end of the game you CAN sell Ichaival for one of the strong crit items, primarily Deathbringer or Malice, but don't feel like it's a necessity. You will get full on-hit crit effects when utilzing Sickle Storm.

To clear things up...lifesteal is not bad on her. Wherever this came from I'm not sure, but Asi should be a staple on her, especially since it synergizes perfectly with her passive. Without lifesteal you WILL LOSE BOXING MATCHES. FACT.

Proper combo is her Spectral Projection into Dark Portal. This combo scales exceptionally well into the late game. DO NOT lead with Dark Portal (it's easy to miss). Try and avoid using Sickle Storm until you are in a boxing or teamfight situation. Once you have bursted an enemy down, you are just a few basics away from killing them. The Qin's/Pen combo is broken and should be nerfed on her ASAP. Her capability of dealing near true damage is unmatched amongst hunters.

Izanami is not weak, she is misunderstood.

[EmethSAS]

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Death's Toll - Short Bow - Pots

You'll want to finish Ichaival, then build Warrior Tabi - Asi - Qin's Sais - Titan's Bane - Brawler's Beatstick. At the end of the game you CAN sell Ichaival for one of the strong crit items, primarily Deathbringer or Malice, but don't feel like it's a necessity. You will get full on-hit crit effects when utilzing Sickle Storm.

Thanks for the analysis, Beans. Just wanted to get your opinion on this, but I've heard with her "secret nerf" of now not being able to crit (at least on enemy gods) on the return hits, that Malice now is BY FAR the best crit item on her since its passive is unaffected by the 50% decrease on her basic damage the way that Deathbringer is reduced to 50% effectiveness.

Also, I wanted to ask if it was really necessary to have THAT much penetration in her build (Asi plus Titan's Bane AND Brawler's Beatstick?) particularly with her passive providing additional penetration? How do you feel about Devourer's over Transcendence/Asi on her? I've also seen Bloodforge recommended for the power and shield to protect her if she gets a kill at lower health to maintain her passive pen... I've also heard people recommend O-Bow because when it procs it gives an additional burst of her basic attack power to just fully exploit the whole "my basics are totally AoE" aspect of her kit...

Recommended builds I've seen are:
Trans, Warrior, Ichaival, Qins', Titan's, Wind Demon, sell Ichaival for Malice
and
Trans, Warrior, Ichaival, Qins', Titan's, Bloodforge, sell Ichaival for O-Bow

Your analysis?

[Professor Genki]

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Originally posted by Amber:

What do you guys think so far? Is she op or fairly balanced.
I think she's pretty strong, I don't know about broken yet, she feels so weak to me. I personally don't find her that fun to play. I still think Rama and Neith are just better and every other magical ADC.

So just to start...you cannot say "she's pretty strong" and then say "she feels so weak to me." If what you mean is you are having a hard time having success with her, while other people are, we need to evaluate your builds. Izanami is a difficult hunter to play, but I think once people learn (and exploit) what makes her great, they will find she is a strong choice. I have played nine Conquest games with her (5W-4L), and my total KDA is 53/15/22 (4.27).

First...do not treat her like a hunter! Think of her more as a burst mage or assassin. She has easy wave clear at the start of the game with her Spectral Projection (level this first), a great steroid in Sickle Storm (level this second), a handy escape/stealth (level this last), and a nuke ultimate that is hilariously overpowered (level this at 5-9/10-13/14-17-20).

Unlike Apollo or Rama, you won't be able to be an effective force by building crit items. Trans builds DO work on her, but personally I have never liked Trans builds as they seem to most effective mid-game, and fall off late. Try this...

Death's Toll - Short Bow - Pots

You'll want to finish Ichaival, then build Warrior Tabi - Asi - Qin's Sais - Titan's Bane - Brawler's Beatstick. At the end of the game you CAN sell Ichaival for one of the strong crit items, primarily Deathbringer or Malice, but don't feel like it's a necessity. You will get full on-hit crit effects when utilzing Sickle Storm.

To clear things up...lifesteal is not bad on her. Wherever this came from I'm not sure, but Asi should be a staple on her, especially since it synergizes perfectly with her passive. Without lifesteal you WILL LOSE BOXING MATCHES. FACT.

Proper combo is her Spectral Projection into Dark Portal. This combo scales exceptionally well into the late game. DO NOT lead with Dark Portal (it's easy to miss). Try and avoid using Sickle Storm until you are in a boxing or teamfight situation. Once you have bursted an enemy down, you are just a few basics away from killing them. The Qin's/Pen combo is broken and should be nerfed on her ASAP. Her capability of dealing near true damage is unmatched amongst hunters.

Izanami is not weak, she is misunderstood.

I feel you can treat her like a normal Hunter but with a more assassin vibe. Crits are great on her

[TheGooeyBeans]

Originally posted by EmethSAS:

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Death's Toll - Short Bow - Pots

You'll want to finish Ichaival, then build Warrior Tabi - Asi - Qin's Sais - Titan's Bane - Brawler's Beatstick. At the end of the game you CAN sell Ichaival for one of the strong crit items, primarily Deathbringer or Malice, but don't feel like it's a necessity. You will get full on-hit crit effects when utilzing Sickle Storm.

Thanks for the analysis, Beans. Just wanted to get your opinion on this, but I've heard with her "secret nerf" of now not being able to crit (at least on enemy gods) on the return hits, that Malice now is BY FAR the best crit item on her since its passive is unaffected by the 50% decrease on her basic damage the way that Deathbringer is reduced to 50% effectiveness.

Also, I wanted to ask if it was really necessary to have THAT much penetration in her build (Asi plus Titan's Bane AND Brawler's Beatstick?) particularly with her passive providing additional penetration? How do you feel about Devourer's over Transcendence/Asi on her? I've also seen Bloodforge recommended for the power and shield to protect her if she gets a kill at lower health to maintain her passive pen... I've also heard people recommend O-Bow because when it procs it gives an additional burst of her basic attack power to just fully exploit the whole "my basics are totally AoE" aspect of her kit...

Recommended builds I've seen are:
Trans, Warrior, Ichaival, Qins', Titan's, Wind Demon, sell Ichaival for Malice
and
Trans, Warrior, Ichaival, Qins', Titan's, Bloodforge, sell Ichaival for O-Bow

Your analysis?

So yes, it is true that Malice's passive is unaffected when she is just utilizing her normal basic attacks. The only reason Deathbringer would also be recommended is because you still get full on-hit crit effects when her Sickle Storm is active, which would make Deathbringer's passive viable. It's a bit of a toss up and based on personal preference. Personally, I like Malice on her. I'd avoid multiple crit items :)

As for other items on her...yes, they all work. The penetration heavy build is just the one I've had the most success with. But that's just me, and I'm an "Average Joe!" Your mileage may vary. Not bragging, but my last game with her was a 17/0/7 affair with 27.5k damage in 25 minutes (Conquest). That used the same Pen build I recommended.

Also...a weird item on her that also works (especially if you are playing her solo in the mid game) is Shifter's Shield. It's not a must buy item, but it definitely works in certain situations and also helps her passive (like Bloodforge).

[TheGooeyBeans]

Originally posted by Professor Genki:

I feel you can treat her like a normal Hunter but with a more assassin vibe. Crits are great on her

Not great. Unless your Sickle Storm is active they only do half damage since the basic won't crit on the return hit. Crit is OK on her but it is far from a priority.

[EmethSAS]

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Originally posted by Professor Genki:

I feel you can treat her like a normal Hunter but with a more assassin vibe. Crits are great on her

Not great. Unless your Sickle Storm is active they only do half damage since the basic won't crit on the return hit. Crit is OK on her but it is far from a priority.

Yeah, with that change to her passive she went from being a god everyone wanted to get tons of crits on because who doesn't want AoE crit? now to crits are mostly useless on her since they are only half as effective unless you are using her 1...

[Professor Genki]

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Originally posted by Professor Genki:

I feel you can treat her like a normal Hunter but with a more assassin vibe. Crits are great on her

Not great. Unless your Sickle Storm is active they only do half damage since the basic won't crit on the return hit. Crit is OK on her but it is far from a priority.

Crit is still pretty good on her and her basic attacks still do a lot of crit damage.

[TheGooeyBeans]

Originally posted by Professor Genki:

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Not great. Unless your Sickle Storm is active they only do half damage since the basic won't crit on the return hit. Crit is OK on her but it is far from a priority.

Crit is still pretty good on her and her basic attacks still do a lot of crit damage.

Not trying to mean...how can her crits be doing "a lot" of damage when they are literally doing HALF DAMAGE? Come on.

[Professor Genki]

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Originally posted by Professor Genki:

Crit is still pretty good on her and her basic attacks still do a lot of crit damage.

Not trying to mean...how can her crits be doing "a lot" of damage when they are literally doing HALF DAMAGE? Come on.

well for one thing for half damage it is still alot. also her crits can proc twice i a row do deal full damage

[TheGooeyBeans]

Originally posted by Professor Genki:

Originally posted by The Gooey Beans:

Not trying to mean...how can her crits be doing "a lot" of damage when they are literally doing HALF DAMAGE? Come on.

well for one thing for half damage it is still alot. also her crits can proc twice i a row do deal full damage

Just to clarify, at the time I typed this the AM hotfix had not been released which altered the crit proc on her return attack. She can crit on the return now.

[AuzzieDonkey]

I like a lot of things about her, only thing I don't really like, sure would be good with a xing tian or an ares other then that 1 of the more useless ults compared to the rest of the gods.

[Professor Genki]

Originally posted by AuzzieDonkey:

I like a lot of things about her, only thing I don't really like, sure would be good with a xing tian or an ares other then that 1 of the more useless ults compared to the rest of the gods.

Look at Sol's Ult and Izzy's Ult seems 100% better

[♥♥♥♥♥♥]

Lol