Doom 3 was the real masterpiece

[Firmament]

I am fully aware that Doom 3 is quite different, but I mean, c'mon, who would deny that, as a *game*, it is absolutely better than all other Dooms, including the 2016 one?

Here's my is/isn't comparison between Doom 3 and Doom 4 (I haven't finished Doom 4 yet but I've played it long enough to see the mechanics, and I have all weapons and I have seen all demons):

Doom 3 is scary, Doom 4 isn't.

Doom 3 has a real scenario (yes...) Doom 4 barely has one.

Doom 3 has a great ambient (sounds, lightning, nicely scripted events), Doom 4's sounds are average to awful, and it uses a minimum of scripted events.

Doom 3's Hell level really looks dark, gloomy and terrific, Doom 4's Hell level looks way too common and almost quiet actually - this is clearly not hell as the place where all evil resides.

Doom 3 has corridors, Doom 4 has arenas (I vastly prefer the first, as arena maps are pure ambient killers).

Doom 3 has average to decent physics/ragdoll, Doom 4's ones go from bad to average.

Doom 3 was really visually impressive when it was out, Doom 4 has very nice visuals but that's about all.

Doom 3 has many interactive stuff (screens you can click on, hidden buttons...), Doom 4 seems to use this only when it is required for the main objectives.

Doom 3 has a chainsaw, Doom 4 has some super overpowered weapon they've called "chainsaw".

Doom 3 has several boss well distributed through the game, and you have to wait for long to see the first one in Doom 4 - there isn't even one to exit hell, lol!

Doom 3 has pure old-school weapons, Doom 4's ones are upgradable and can use modules like in a RPG (don't get me wrong, I like this feature and I think the developers got it right, but I'm not sure I want to see this in a Doom).

Doom 3 has pure old-school gameplay, Doom 4 has super-jumps, glory kills, climbing and vertical maps, like in a fantasy world...

You can punch demons in the face using your fists in Doom 3, which is a very Doomish feature, and you can't do this in Doom 4 because the marine apparently only wants to use his hands against demons during glory kills.

Ect, ect...


So, which Doom is better and also, which Doom is actually more Doom...?


PS: in spite of what you might think, I actually like Doom 4 - it is just that I find it clearly not as good as the previous one, and I also think that, regardless of what many people say, this game isn't a real Doom *at all*. To me, it looks like a cross between Quake and Rage...

[RetroSimon]

Messaggio originale di I'm Helping!:

If I could bring one thing from Doom 3, ONE thing, to Doom 4.

It would be the fully intact brains ejecting from bodies.

I would bring over super turbo turkey puncher 3. You know the only actual good thing in that game.

[Zaxx]

Messaggio originale di RetroSimon:

Messaggio originale di I'm Helping!:

If I could bring one thing from Doom 3, ONE thing, to Doom 4.

It would be the fully intact brains ejecting from bodies.

I would bring over super turbo turkey puncher 3. You know the only actual good thing in that game.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=684878716
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=684879248

[RetroSimon]

Messaggio originale di Zaxx:

Messaggio originale di RetroSimon:

I would bring over super turbo turkey puncher 3. You know the only actual good thing in that game.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=684878716
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=684879248

Whoohoo ! Brings tears to eyes

[Seaclean]

I can appreciate both Doom 3 and 4 for what they are. It's clear that Doom 3 deviated from the fast-paced run-and-gun formula but I think they succeeded in bringing something different and fun to the table. If I had to choose I think I'd choose Doom 3 over 4 but it depends largely on my mood.

[Killerspinach]

You'd ahve a hard time convincing me you were alive when any of these released.

[ImHelping]

Messaggio originale di killerspinach:

You'd ahve a hard time convincing me you were alive when any of these released.

I liked Curse Of The Catacombs. I didn't learn until recently that was some rerelease of "Catacomb: Armageddon" with a cool 90's frog slapped over the old Title+Credit on the HUD. Thanks, GOG.

[Zaxx]

Messaggio originale di RetroSimon:

Messaggio originale di Zaxx:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=684878716
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=684879248

Whoohoo ! Brings tears to eyes

Btw. what I missed from Doom 3 were the interactive computer screens with the mouse pointer, clickable diaries and all that. They would not fit this game because it would slow the speed down but still, it was a nice little immersive touch.

[DM]

Messaggio originale di Firmament:

I am fully aware that Doom 3 is quite different, but I mean, c'mon, who would deny that, as a *game*, it is absolutely better than all other Dooms, including the 2016 one?

Here's my is/isn't comparison between Doom 3 and Doom 4 (I haven't finished Doom 4 yet but I've played it long enough to see the mechanics, and I have all weapons and I have seen all demons): (snip)

Its fine to have an opinion and a favourite but most of what you listed is pure preference for one thing over another, both games are very different. If Id Software decided to revisit Doom in the style of Doom3 - slow paced survival horror - we could try and debate which game was actually better than the other.

As it stands right now we are almost comparing R-Type to Jamestown, both are great but in quite different ways even though both are the same genre.

Personally I love Doom 2016, not quite as much as I obsessed with Doom 2 on release when I was 17 (Doom 2 introduced me to PC gaming and was the major reason I bought my first PC) but its close. Given the time limit of 1 hour and told to pick 1 of the Doom's to spend my time with, I'd choose Doom 2016, with Brutal Doom a close second.

[Arch-Tau]

Okay, now let's see what's missing from your comparison: gameplay.
Doom 3: Walk down a corridor, open a room, blast the imp.
Doom 4: Cannot be described in words.

[Shellshock]

Doom 3 is pure trash. Not worthy of bearing the Doom name.

[Sebastian Nielsen]

Agree completely with the OP.
Doom3 is a large red heart.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=686685764
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=686685783

Oooh what I miss these. These would be excellent in Doom4.

Mangé: That was the good with Doom3. Not much fighting, especially not on recruiit, but a lot of puzzling, solving problems, finding PDA's and keycards, and then hunting for codes inside emails and audio logs. I LOVED THAT. And also the 2-step generators was a nice puzzle too.
And also that platforming puzzle to get on top of the broken pump with toxic goo and restart it, and also the restore the power in the alpha labs was a nice touch too.

Doom4 is just a HD copy of Boring Sam 3: BFE Edition. Doom4 is not worthy bearing the Doom name.

[Arch-Tau]

Messaggio originale di Sebastian Nielsen:

Agree completely with the OP.
Doom3 is a large red heart.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=686685764
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=686685783

Oooh what I miss these. These would be excellent in Doom4.

Mangé: That was the good with Doom3. Not much fighting, especially not on recruiit, but a lot of puzzling, solving problems, finding PDA's and keycards, and then hunting for codes inside emails and audio logs. I LOVED THAT. And also the 2-step generators was a nice puzzle too.
And also that platforming puzzle to get on top of the broken pump with toxic goo and restart it, and also the restore the power in the alpha labs was a nice touch too.

Doom4 is just a HD copy of Boring Sam 3: BFE Edition. Doom4 is not worthy bearing the Doom name.

Guess what, it's Doom 3 that is the black sheep. I enjoyed it, but all the other games were all about combat and fighting. The very ideas behind Doom 1, 2 and 4 were to create great and enjoyable fight scenarios. Either way, you can't say they failed at doing so, even if you dislike the concept.

[Attuoz]

Doom 2016 is better then Doom 3, especially the soundtracks. Never noticed the music in Doom 3, but in Doom 2016 you enjoy listening it.

[Sebastian Nielsen]

No. Doom1 and Doom2 @ Im Too Young To Die, is not much of combat. Not as much as in Doom4. Doom4 has just too much, even on Im Too Young To Die.

Doom1 and Doom2 had also quite a few platforming puzzles, and that balancing maze was nice too. Downtown is also pretty difficult if its first time playing.

[xXLaokinXx]

Messaggio originale di Sebastian Nielsen:

No. Doom1 and Doom2 @ Im Too Young To Die, is not much of combat. Not as much as in Doom4. Doom4 has just too much, even on Im Too Young To Die.

Doom1 and Doom2 had also quite a few platforming puzzles, and that balancing maze was nice too. Downtown is also pretty difficult if its first time playing.

Platforming puzzles? Did you even ever play doom? You can't crouch or jump, there is literally zero platforming in Doom 1 or 2 -- there is one secret in the game that requires you to run off an edge at exactly the right angle, and that's it -- Downtown? Are you thinking of Duke Nukem 3D? LOL.