Band of Bastards DLC BUG: Poisoned/Bleeding Jan bearman (SPOILER ALLERT)

[TheKingmario2]

With the DLC Band of bastards you can play some new and unique quests, one of those is a secondary mission that involves on stealing a ring from your fellows mercenaries. The Stone asked me to take the ring from Dangler, then Stephan Fletching asked me to take the ring from The Stone and now Jan Bearman asked me to take the ring from Stephan Fletching, the problem is........something nasty happened to Jan.

Long story short: i played the last main mission of this DLC, i managed to persuade Kuno about betraying Sir Radzig, we beated the sh*t out of Zoul's army and took all their belongings, then we gone on separate ways, Kuno asked me to go to Sir Radzig and confirm the death of Hagen Zoul, Kuno's men returned to their camp at Ledetchko. Since im a completist, i tried to finish the ring's quest but i discovered that my fellow Jan Bearman was Poisoned or Bleeding (presumibly during the last battle with Zoul's Army), so at quest started i had litteraly few minutes to get the ring in time before well......... before God called his name.......

This "little incident" is one of many oversights by Warhorse studios, so watch out and complete the secondary quest as quick as you can, because your fellows really likes to die in nasty ways, leaving you with broken/busted balls in inopportune moments.

[theo]

Non-essential NPCs can die. It's not a bug neither it's an oversight.

[TheKingmario2]

Originally posted by theo:

Non-essential NPCs can die. It's not a bug neither it's an oversight.

if it is linked to a quest it shouldn't die like that trust me. Im one who always defended this game despite its shortcoming, but this bug.......come on, atleast make those npcs immune to bleeding and poison ffs.

[theo]

Why should they be immune to bleeding, they ain't made of iron.
I'll repeat it works as intended therefore it's not a bug. Only NPCs necessary for main quest are considered essential. Even Kuno can die at any point of the DLC story and give you an alternate short ending.
It would make more sense to complete side activities with the bastards before you knowingly put their lives at risk.

[Peyhah]

The AI doesn't bandage themselves after combat is over, though, that's the real issue.

I killed Peychar that way on my Merciful playthrough by shooting him with a weak-ish bow and waiting until he died of blood loss, lmao.

[TheKingmario2]

Originally posted by theo:

Why should they be immune to bleeding, they ain't made of iron.
I'll repeat it works as intended therefore it's not a bug. Only NPCs necessary for main quest are considered essential. Even Kuno can die at any point of the DLC story and give you an alternate short ending.
It would make more sense to complete side activities with the bastards before you knowingly put their lives at risk.

I don't think so. Failing a quest due a random and uncontrollable event (a.k.a: the random bleeding of your allies after a main quest fight) is not normal at all. As you said, it would even gives you the "short ending" if the bleeding guy is not Jan but Kuno. Imagine for a second this scene: you finished one of the missions, you get back to the camp and then go to ledetchko for your own reasons, then go back to the camp and......opsie.....you find Kuno dead on the ground by bleeding and the DLC mission fails.....and don't let you do the remaining missions (despite Kuno can be seen as an "essential" npc for the DLC progression). Now you have two choices:

1: Reload a previous saved file (praying god that you didn't do other important main game things during the DLC campain) and restart from there.

2: Embrace your Cross and accept your loss (not only your money, but your time).

Those "developer choices" are the main reason why the game got sh*t stormed so much by the reviews, just because an uncalculated player choice (like stealth killing an NPC, and then....opsie.....seeing it respawned with a weird knowledge about how he died), or an unpredictable collision of 2-3 quests at the same time generate those game breaking events that leaves to the player the only choice of reload (if he/she il lucky enough). Look at my ingame hours, i like the game but i like less the people who defend the undefendable.

[theo]

Originally posted by TheKingmario2:

I don't think so. Failing a quest due a random and uncontrollable event (a.k.a: the random bleeding of your allies after a main quest fight) is not normal at all.

It is normal because this game considers immersion more important than gameplay convenience - its world tries to live by its own rules instead of revolving around the player. An NPC can receive wounds and randomly die, it makes sense and there are as little exceptions to this rule as possible. It's not Skyrim where almost all NPCs are invincible because Bethesda geniuses used reasoning similar to yours.
Sure it's very important what you think about it, but it's not a bug in any definition of the word "bug".
I had similar situation with bandits randomly attacking Inn at the Glade and killing the wench that gives you some side quests. I was permanently blocked from those quests but such uncontrollable events make the game alive so I couldn't care less.
Those developer choices are the main reason why I absolutely love KCD.

I agree with previous poster that AI could learn to use bandages and potions. But not just be magically invulnerable to uncontrollable factors, this would be absolutely anti-immersive.

[TheKingmario2]

Originally posted by theo:

Originally posted by TheKingmario2:

I don't think so. Failing a quest due a random and uncontrollable event (a.k.a: the random bleeding of your allies after a main quest fight) is not normal at all.

It is normal because this game considers immersion more important than gameplay convenience - its world tries to live by its own rules instead of revolving around the player. An NPC can receive wounds and randomly die, it makes sense and there are as little exceptions to this rule as possible. It's not Skyrim where almost all NPCs are invincible because Bethesda geniuses used reasoning similar to yours.
Sure it's very important what you think about it, but it's not a bug in any definition of the word "bug".
I had similar situation with bandits randomly attacking Inn at the Glade and killing the wench that gives you some side quests. I was permanently blocked from those quests but such uncontrollable events make the game alive so I couldn't care less.
Those developer choices are the main reason why I absolutely love KCD.

I agree with previous poster that AI could learn to use bandages and potions. But not just be magically invulnerable to uncontrollable factors, this would be absolutely anti-immersive.

Oh sure.....immersion......did i already mentioned NPCs that came alive after you killed them (e.s: Rattay's Tailor, Wolfram Pruda)? I mentioned it in my previous message. Basicly, you could kill everyone in this game (without getting noticed also), if you save and wait (now i don't know the correct timing, maybe after some ingame weeks) they will respawn, and despite your efforts on being stealth when killing them, they will magically know how they died, and will start running away from you (maybe they will not allert the guards, but you will never be able to talk to them anymore).

As i said: i have plenty hours on this game, i played it in many forms, and i even played some runs with the sole purpose of breaking the game. I could write a whole post full of tricks on how to break the game (and i think i will do it, cause is always good to know some tricks), cause i played it alot and i know what is intentional immersion and unintentional immersion.

Is fine loving a game, but a wise gamer should always be objective when playing something, cause is the toxic behavior of defending every error commited by developers that screwed many software houses (e.s: Bethesda and it's Fallout 76).

[theo]

Oh I definitely agree that NPC respawn is ridiculous. And why do they respawn? Because this is how Warhorse tried to solve the 'problem' of random NPC deaths. Which wasn't a problem in the first place.
Unintentional immersion is absolutely fine. This is the point of open-ended and sandbox design - to create rules and conditions and then let things settle themselves.