Easy way to level Speech?

[Broseph]

The rest of the main attributes are really easy to level, but speech seems to take forever just talking to people. You run out of things to say. Any good way to get it up?

[Hieronymous Alloy]

haggling.

[Hieronymous Alloy]

Also, bard potions, temporarily.

[Au milieu d'un monde des ruines]

I don't think there are even speech skill trainers, so passing speech skill checks, haggling, talking to absolutely everybody and using bard and amor potions when you need them is the only way I see.

[Hammer]

As someone who's toyed with haggling and paid close attention to the "hits" in skill, haggling only seems to increase Speech if the dialogue associated with it is considered "new", much like how speech increases normally by talking to people. I'd also like to take time to say, I absolutely hate that Speech only increases either by trial by fire (speech challenges), or by only ever talking about a subject with dialogue you haven't gotten before. On a game claiming to be a little more "realistic", does it really make sense that you reach a brick wall in improving your manners when you can't find any more unique things to talk about with someone?


I'd really like to know what Lua script or XML file I need to toy with, to change this behavior, if it can even be done with the current modding interface. It really bugs me, even just a single point in speech for grayed out options would be better than nothing. You don't stop learning about Combat if you keep fighting the same person, so why is Speech this crippled in opportunities for improvement?

[Au milieu d'un monde des ruines]

Originally posted by Hammer:

As someone who's toyed with haggling and paid close attention to the "hits" in skill, haggling only seems to increase Speech if the dialogue associated with it is considered "new"

Interesting. I failed to notice. Thanks for the info.

Originally posted by Hammer:

I absolutely hate that Speech only increases either by trial by fire (speech challenges), or by only ever talking about a subject with dialogue you haven't gotten before. On a game claiming to be a little more "realistic", does it really make sense that you reach a brick wall in improving your manners when you can't find any more unique things to talk about with someone?

When you put it like that I agree. I love that the game has a mechanical motivation to talk to more people. Not sure what other way to increase the skill would be better though.

[Hammer]

Just talking in general should do it, the limit of having to be -unique- dialogues should have never existed. The feel I get from it is, it's a sort of "anti-grind" mechanism, which I don't understand why even bother when everything else is already so easy to grind, and only a few people ever grind so much like that anyways.


I think it would be better that picking "new" options gives 2-3x more XP, while choosing greyed out options gives exactly ONE experience point. If people want to grind it, let 'em grind it. Vitality, Maintenance, all combat related skills... everything else can already be grinded. This limitation has no reason to exist and no place.

I'll even mod it out, I just need to find the related files, grr...

[Broseph]

Appreciate you Hammer, good luck on your speech mod quest

[Au milieu d'un monde des ruines]

Originally posted by Hammer:

Just talking in general should do it, the limit of having to be -unique- dialogues should have never existed. The feel I get from it is, it's a sort of "anti-grind" mechanism, which I don't understand why even bother when everything else is already so easy to grind, and only a few people ever grind so much like that anyways.


I think it would be better that picking "new" options gives 2-3x more XP, while choosing greyed out options gives exactly ONE experience point. If people want to grind it, let 'em grind it. Vitality, Maintenance, all combat related skills... everything else can already be grinded. This limitation has no reason to exist and no place.

I'll even mod it out, I just need to find the related files, grr...

Add to that that haggling always should give you some XP and that's a mod I'd use right away. Hopefully you'll find it, best of luck.

[Phatcat]

To add insult to injury there is even a bloody speech perk called 'Silver Tongue' which quite literally says to 'Increase your speech skill when haggling' - Either that's a lie, or it's bugged to hell cause it ain't working (ps4, ver. 1.3) I get exactly 0 exp nomatter how much I haggle (to save money or to tip 'em, doesn't matter) - Not a single point of speech exp from haggling. I am basically stuck at 18 speech skill and Capon is ready for me to end the game... I am not sure what to do to get the level cap trophy.

[Lieste]

Silver Tongue increases your effective skill in speech, not adds skill XP. It works the same as any other 'perk' which conditionally increases a stat or skill under some circumstance.

[Phatcat]

Oh for ♥♥♥♥ sake what a stupid formulation, but yeah, I see what they mean now...

[Phatcat]

I thought it worked the same way as Leg Day, but I see that perk is worded quite a lot differently..

[Hammer]

So, your speech options are considered technically by the game as "sequences". One dialogue option is a "sequence", assumingly it consists of not just your dialogue option, but the full response of the NPC and pointers to other sequences after that sequence (maybe). What would need to be done, is to find the code that handles the event for starting a dialogue sequence from Henry's side and is giving the XP, and removing or modifying the check to see if the sequence is "new" before giving XP.


I can't find any way to modify this with the current modding SDK WHS has provided, so until they actually provide a more comprehensive SDK, we're just gonna have to milk every new dialogue sequence in existance.

[76561188078797539]

I thought somebody on Warhorse forum did an informal statistical collation that claimed every haggle session, unless it's set on "default" amount, did increase speech point gain?

Can't find it right now, but from what I recall the best point gain was at heavy "discount" haggle, while giving a small tip was second best (and did not mess up reputation with the trader).

[Hammer]

Originally posted by Sheepify:

I thought somebody on Warhorse forum did an informal statistical collation that claimed every haggle session, unless it's set on "default" amount, did increase speech point gain?

Can't find it right now, but from what I recall the best point gain was at heavy "discount" haggle, while giving a small tip was second best (and did not mess up reputation with the trader).

Immediately skeptical because I was very thorough with trying to use haggling to increase speech in Rattay. The issue is the behavior he measured could have changed in the later versions of KC:D, but we'll never know because WHS doesn't do in-depth changelogs (especially for bugfixes). Let me know if you do find it though.