Still don't understand crossing and heading.

[ozmono]

Okay closing in on a hundred hours and I don't quite understand the maths in the crossing/heading system. Granted most of that time I haven't had crossing system but I should understand it by now anyway.

It seems no matter how good my passer of the cross is, a 50 defence roll is all that is needed to block the cross. Also I'm not quite sure how the heading rating is calculated. If anyone in the know could educate me on the matter I'd appriecate it.

[Xas]

Press the ' ? ' button on top right corner of club hub to read more about corner and headings.

Basically having high control players 'within the box' and 'one square infront of box' is key to heading.
High passing from the crosser should increase chances of accurate pass.
If defenders and keeper are high in defence/ control,
chances are you'll be pushed out,
use alternate strategies, rather than forcefully trying to corner or cross the ball in.

[DeWitt]

I always thought just control matters for calculating if you get pushed out in case of a corner.

In case of a normal crossing in my opinion there is not getting pushed out, just the heading dice between players in order of position, in case of winning of the attacker his value against control of the keeper.

Which does not answer the initial question: Is a 50 (which means max for a player without heading) dice roll enough without an directly opposing attacker to block the cross? No matter what the crossing player rolls on his passing dice?

[455224]

Originally posted by DeWitt:

Which does not answer the initial question: Is a 50 (which means max for a player without heading) dice roll enough without an directly opposing attacker to block the cross? No matter what the crossing player rolls on his passing dice?

I have used a heading CF in every team since the new update brought them in, with my leading one on my current playthrough being on something like 240 goals / 150 games and in all that time, even using midfielders/wingers with 150+ PAS, I dont think I've ever seen a pass go over a 50 defender? (maybe, *maybe*, once, if my memory serves me well, but definitely no more than that - probably only remember that solitary one cos i was so shocked and like "oh wow!!!! it went in!?!?!?")

I appreciate that is still not an actual answer, but having tried my own experimentaion I have now fully given up on trying this particular approach with heading and now only use my heading CF's against teams with an 'open' back line or ones where you can run your player to the very corner of the box and whip it in over the DF and SW to score - otherwise its not worth thte hassle.

[455224]

Here are 3 v. quick screenshots to highlight my point - N.B. Im not doing this to highlight 'scoring' as 178 vs 120 is obviously not likely to score at all, but that 156 vs. 50 fails every time, despite the roll...

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298990038
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298990120
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298990187
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298992069

--EDIT--

And then to prove that the '15' chance to hit the cross is irrelvant, here is a '10' chance cross that my CF manges to head (but is then rightly blocked from scoring because of the 178 keeper vs. 120 header)

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298995379
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298995480

[View The Phenom]

Originally posted by DeWitt:

I always thought just control matters for calculating if you get pushed out in case of a corner.

In case of a normal crossing in my opinion there is not getting pushed out, just the heading dice between players in order of position, in case of winning of the attacker his value against control of the keeper.

Which does not answer the initial question: Is a 50 (which means max for a player without heading) dice roll enough without an directly opposing attacker to block the cross? No matter what the crossing player rolls on his passing dice?

Only control matters when fighting for position in the box, and this occurs during corner kicks only.
The base chance to intercept the ball with a header is 50 * (Head Play level + 1). If there's a defender in front of the cross, he will roll first to determine if he's able to head the ball away.

In order to prevent this, you need to get in front of the defenders so you attempt to head first and aim towards the goal. Once you actually head the ball towards the goal you then roll against the goal keeper's Control stat.

[DeWitt]

Originally posted by View The Phenom:

Only control matters when fighting for position in the box, and this occurs during corner kicks only.
The base chance to intercept the ball with a header is 50 * (Head Play level + 1). If there's a defender in front of the cross, he will roll first to determine if he's able to head the ball away.

In order to prevent this, you need to get in front of the defenders so you attempt to head first and aim towards the goal. Once you actually head the ball towards the goal you then roll against the goal keeper's Control stat.

Yes, that's basically what I wrote. But does not answer the opening question asked in this topic (not by me by the way).

What "45522" wrote is also my experience, it's not a 50, but a (nearly?) 100% chance of success to block the cross in case of a defender rolling first.

[_K_o_S_]

I see that the heading mechanics is quite hard to understand. However, it is very important to be able to use it.

So I decided to write a guide: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1301010308

Does it make it more clear? Also, if you can suggest how to make the English sentences/phrases more correct, suggest, please. I'd gladly improve the text.

[DeWitt]

Thanks for this guide! Didn't know the heading dice roll is calculated against the cross factor. Which explains the experience of balls getting kicked out nearly everytime by the first defender.. So in this situation it would be better (with a high passing player performing the cross) to choose the higher cross factor by positioning, right?

Also, related to this: If I position a winger (yellow) in the attacker zone (red) from the start, like in one of your examples in the guide, does he still earn winger exp?

[455224]

Originally posted by _K_o_S_:

I see that the heading mechanics is quite hard to understand. However, it is very important to be able to use it.

So I decided to write a guide: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1301010308

Does it make it more clear? Also, if you can suggest how to make the English sentences/phrases more correct, suggest, please. I'd gladly improve the text.

Hi KoS, I read this and understood, but still don't fully understand how the defender intercept works??

For example, in this screenshot, please can you explain how the defender 'wins' the header, even though he rolls *less* (a LOT less actually 153 PAS vs. 49 DEF) than the pass roll?

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298992069

I dont mind so much as I am now very accustomed to using 'good' positioning to not have to roll vs a defender, but would still like to know why???

Thanks in advance!? haha

[_K_o_S_]

Originally posted by DeWitt:

Thanks for this guide! Didn't know the heading dice roll is calculated against the cross factor. Which explains the experience of balls getting kicked out nearly everytime by the first defender.. So in this situation it would be better (with a high passing player performing the cross) to choose the higher cross factor by positioning, right?

Also, related to this: If I position a winger (yellow) in the attacker zone (red) from the start, like in one of your examples in the guide, does he still earn winger exp?

1) Depending on what you want to achieve. If you want the defender to have fewer chances to intercept the ball, than yes - use the tile which gives the higher cross factor.

2) No, he will earn the xp of the chosen position. In your case, it will be RF instead of RM.

[_K_o_S_]

Originally posted by 455224:

Hi KoS, I read this and understood, but still don't fully understand how the defender intercept works??

For example, in this screenshot, please can you explain how the defender 'wins' the header, even though he rolls *less* (a LOT less actually 153 PAS vs. 49 DEF) than the pass roll?

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1298992069

I dont mind so much as I am now very accustomed to using 'good' positioning to not have to roll vs a defender, but would still like to know why???

Thanks in advance!? haha

It's easy. A footballer hits the ball if his heading roll is higher than the cross factor roll. The cross factor roll in your screenshot is 13.

[455224]

Originally posted by _K_o_S_:

It's easy. A footballer hits the ball if his heading roll is higher than the cross factor roll. The cross factor roll in your screenshot is 13.

Understood. Cheers!

[ozmono]

Thanks for clearing it up.