A Major Issue: Healing in PVP: Duels and Invasions

[zombii?]

First, off I'd like to say I have played every souls game over 500 hours on PC/PS3 and done tons of PVP.

Second, this post is purely based off my knowledge, personal opinions, and observations. If you feel offended over anything I say, thats a personal problem and I wont give you a milisecond thought

There seems to be a lot of disagreement in dueling / invasion etiquette. I wont go into the history behind why not healing is honorable, but I will tell you the current state of invasion/dueling and why I strongly believe there little honor in DS3 PVP at the moment.

Now these are not rules and need not be followed, but i think everyone could have a more enjoyable ds3 experience with them

A. DUELS (Summon Signs):

i. 1v1

- I've never healed in duels in any Souls game and I never will. I have on occasion accidentally healed but have always let the other player hit me down to my previous health.

- Why? Aside from the fact that different builds and playstyles become meaninless chasing games, it takes no skill at all to heal in 1v1 duels. You might say "well they can loyds talisman or chase you."

- Please... its the easiest thing in the world to run through some mobs or jump off a ledge to buy time chug. And loyds has a dreadfully long throw animation and is blocked by trees, walls, etc.

- Many players like me love these games because they do take actual skill and we put alot of effort into our builds. When people drink estus to survive in duels it shows that you lack either (1) knowledge of etiquette ; (2) Skill and Honor; (3) Your not intelligent enough to make a good build or look one up online; or (4) You're just scum that cant find purpose in your life other than to troll.

- If your not one of the above and think that healing makes duels better, I'd say you havent felt the truly intense excitement of a duel between silled players.


ii. 2v1 or more (vs Invader)

- When I am on the side with more than one I either duel first or dont duel at all. 2v1 is NOT honorable and has never been honorable.

- From French nobles duel to modern martial arts 1v1 has always beEN the basis of an hornorable duel.

- Why should this apply to Dark Souls 3? because although digital, they are still duels involving skills. What skill is there in gangbanging


B. INVASIONS (ORBS) (Note this does not include Red Soap stone)

- Invasions are a different story than duels, and every new player should be christened by a sneaky invader

- Invaders are either evil or Just.

- Evil - hey they are evil anything goes. I ususaly wont double team

- Just - You probably deserved it



TLDR:

A. 1v1 Deuls (Summons ex. Red Soap stone) - NO HEALING

- If people purposely drink estus to survive in duels it shows that you lack either (1) knowledge of etiquette ; (2) Skill and Honor; (3) Your not intelligent enough to make a good build or look one up online; or (4) You're just scum that cant find purpose in your life other than to troll.

B. INVASIONS

-- anything goes, I ususaly wont double team

I dont care much for opinions unless u have something to back it up but id like to hear ur thoughts

[Jayian]

Lil happy cat の投稿を引用：

Tsume の投稿を引用：

This is the kind of thinking that lead people to fight wars the way they did in the 1800s.
"Let's all stand in a straight line and let the enemy shoot at us with muskets." "Oh, our front line is dead? MOVE UP THE SECOND LINE!!" Easily prevented by ducking. But nope, that wouldn't be honorable.

TL:DR
Honor is for people who don't mind dying. I mind, I prefer not to. So I'll use EVERY tool at my disposal until I win or die.

There's more to the game than winning, its about getting better at facing others and not needing crutches, healing, and cookie cutter builds, at least if you're summoning

That's your opinion. If you go into a fight not wanting to win, don't go in at all.

[zombii?]

Tsume の投稿を引用：

Lil happy cat の投稿を引用：

There's more to the game than winning, its about getting better at facing others and not needing crutches, healing, and cookie cutter builds, at least if you're summoning

That's your opinion. If you go into a fight not wanting to win, don't go in at all.

A loss can teach you more than a win.

[stevo808]

Dealing with invaders if you don't want to just sucks in any 'Soulsborne' game. That's just how it is.

[PATCHESZ]

Neil Breen の投稿を引用：

The amount of people who play these games is much larger than it was in the past, and as such these unspoken rules will never be follow on a massive scale.

I have to agree. Everytime I have participated in a duel or 2v1 or w/e, they all chug. It seems that for a while it'd be best to embrace the chug, until the playerbase dwindles down to the experienced pvp players.

[zombii?]

Zyrconia の投稿を引用：

zombii? の投稿を引用：

I think some people have gotten the impression that I am invading people and trying to have an honor duel. This is not the case. I summon peoople and have duels.

But, im bored now so i probably wont come back, keep talking if u want.

Well, if that is all you do, again healing not a huge problem. Most PvP hotspots can be easily cleared of all the mobs that are close by. Irithyll is probably the hardest to do, but tif you focus on the bridge, you don't have to.

And you get more healing than the guy you summoned.

So if you summon and no heal, gg.

If your summon heals, you heal too.

If he is a major ♥♥♥♥ and runs away, never to return and wait in ambush, there is nothing you can do about it, but this can happen even if they were restricted in their healing ability.

In conclusion, I see no problem with healing.

I would still like to see it punishable. In DS2 it was technically punishable, but practically no. I never PvP with some flavor of the month OP burst weapon, so trying to punish a heal always left me with an opponent who gained some HP and me with a depleted stamina bar.

But in DS3 it is near impossible to punish a heal. It is so fast that all the opponent needs to do is create a minimal opening and chugg one. And there is no gun like in Blooborne.

I agree about the punishment, if there was a better way I wouldnt mind as much. In ds2 i was able to punish alot with forbidden sun and loyds. Also glad this did end in a cursing fest. lol

[Jayian]

zombii? の投稿を引用：

Tsume の投稿を引用：

That's your opinion. If you go into a fight not wanting to win, don't go in at all.

A loss can teach you more than a win.

Your opinion.

[zombii?]

Tsume の投稿を引用：

zombii? の投稿を引用：

A loss can teach you more than a win.

Your opinion.

Seriously? It is pure FACT. And you are just a Troll for even saying that.

[bun E]

zombii? の投稿を引用：

Tsume の投稿を引用：

Your opinion.

Seriously? Never lost to a boss then figured out u were doing it wrong? do u even play dark souls?

I don't understand people like that. If you play for an arbitrary "Defeated Host of Embers" screen, no matter what, whats the point? Like if they totally outplayed you, parried your ass 6 times, but you kept healing and ended up stun locking them to death with some super buffed straight sword, like what do you get out of that? Do you really feel like you've accomplished something? There really is more than just "Winning" like outplaying someone and demonstrating skill and learning, which you don't do if you have to wear training wheels and google "best build in dark souls 3"
And I'm talking about summoned duels and 1v1s right now, invasions are different.

[Jon]

"Honor"
*Entering someones game with the sole purpose of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ up their progress*

[zombii?]

Lil happy cat の投稿を引用：

zombii? の投稿を引用：

Seriously? Never lost to a boss then figured out u were doing it wrong? do u even play dark souls?

I don't understand people like that. If you play for an arbitrary "Defeated Host of Embers" screen, no matter what, whats the point? Like if they totally outplayed you, parried your ass 6 times, but you kept healing and ended up stun locking them to death with some super buffed straight sword, like what do you get out of that? Do you really feel like you've accomplished something? There really is more than just "Winning" like outplaying someone and demonstrating skill and learning, which you don't do if you have to wear training wheels and googles "best build in dark souls 3"

Just trolls dude.. what can ya do

[zombii?]

C Hunter X の投稿を引用：

"Honor"
*Entering someones game with the sole purpose of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ up their progress*

Wha?

[Skull]

Im fine if they heal as long as they dont run and try and hide behind all the mobs

[Zyrconia]

Well, I just exited the game after PVPing for a few hours and I can say the state of online is extraordinary. Might be the best yet.

Even your pretentious and precious honor is intact, as in most people, myself included, had only honorable duels. Did about 6 fight clubs and an additional 23 pale tongues from people summoning me just randomly, won 70% of my matches, found exactly 3 chuggers, one of them a huge ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ who attacked me during my bow, used a katana very poorly and healed every hit he received. Killing him was so satisfying.

Now that I'm higher level and PVP quite a bit more, I can say for sure that everything is fine with PVP in general. Chugging is not a problem, most people play fairly.

Weapons are not that balanced and it is very hard to win more than 6 times in a row in fight club, since sooner or later you'll find a katana guy or a rapier guy, and then it's gg.

[Jayian]

zombii? の投稿を引用：

Lil happy cat の投稿を引用：

I don't understand people like that. If you play for an arbitrary "Defeated Host of Embers" screen, no matter what, whats the point? Like if they totally outplayed you, parried your ass 6 times, but you kept healing and ended up stun locking them to death with some super buffed straight sword, like what do you get out of that? Do you really feel like you've accomplished something? There really is more than just "Winning" like outplaying someone and demonstrating skill and learning, which you don't do if you have to wear training wheels and googles "best build in dark souls 3"

Just trolls dude.. what can ya do

News flash, the world doesn't revolve around your ideals. Calling everyone who doesn't agree with you a troll is childish. Grow up son.

@Zyrconia
Find a set of armor with the max about of poise you can. That way, you aren't put off balance by people spamming poking sticks and katana's. I've won 8 in row using this method recently. Being able to continue your combo after getting hit is a MUST against people with faster weapons. I suggest Yhurm's shield. Apparently it has a passive poise buf.

[Xilia]

When I touch red/purple signs to do one on one I wait for the phantom to show up and sees me, then I chug out all of my estus before the fight. Most of them will do the same.

A real gentleman empties his estus before the fight.