What is with the backstabs in this game? (PvE)

[Netsa]

I'm using a mace, and this seems to happen on a full third of my backstab attempts: I circle around, I hit R1, my character does a long wind-up as if he's about to backstab them, then the enemy just turns around and slaps me.

I don't remember this happening in DS1 or 2. What's going on?

[ImmortalSausages]

If you're fighting silver knights, theres a chance they will quickly turn around and shield bash you. As far as I know, silver knights are the only enemies to react to backstabs. A mace has a slightly longer backstab windup compared to straight swords, daggers, greatswords, etc. So some enemies can move away from it pretty easily

[Netsa]

Originally posted by ImmortalSausages:

If you're fighting silver knights, theres a chance they will quickly turn around and shield bash you. As far as I know, silver knights are the only enemies to react to backstabs. A mace has a slightly longer backstab windup compared to straight swords, daggers, greatswords, etc. So some enemies can move away from it pretty easily

They move away from it very easily. It's not just knights, even regular monsters sometimes just dodge away. I'm used to monsters being locked into the animation if the game reads it as a successful backstab. Instead, I'm the one being locked into an animation while they walk off.

[Arcade Bumstead]

Originally posted by ImmortalSausages:

If you're fighting silver knights, theres a chance they will quickly turn around and shield bash you. As far as I know, silver knights are the only enemies to react to backstabs. A mace has a slightly longer backstab windup compared to straight swords, daggers, greatswords, etc. So some enemies can move away from it pretty easily

I see enemies attack behind themselves all the time. It's not just a silver knight thing.

[Tao314zdin]

There is a false grab-box for backstabs, it is slightly large than actual grab-box and makes you perform 1st part animation without actually grabbing.

So you need to be more precise (closer to their back) and it will not happen.

You can check that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9HX3WKT5P0
see at 2:06 the false box works the same way in PVE and PVP.

[Dielawn]

Literally have beaten this game like 10 times. But on my latest playthrough the first silver knight was doing some ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ backstab prevention move I've never seen before. Not the backwards shield bash like the lothric knights do. Also wasnt a false backstab. I 100% had like 5 successful backstabs that he somehow prevented from working. Didnt have that happen ever. Not even with the other silver knights. Very strange ahit

[76561199236527341]

think of your backstab attempts like a "grab" type of attack. there is a part of the BS animation that acts like a grab attack, and the hitbox that grabs your enemy is on your weapon.

you initiate the animation, and if the enemy is in the right position for the whole animation, it grabs them. if they move out of position, you get this backstab whiff youre describing here.

the main thing you can do to prevent this is to use a different weapon with a different backstab animation. there are 4 BS animations, normal thrust, rapier thrust, axe/hammer/ugs, and fist/claw. the one you have now with mace, as well as the fist one, is really bad. it is slower, and grabs enemies later in the animation. using a weapon with theb standard thrust BS animation is much more reliable.

can you put something like a dagger or rapier in your second right hand slot, and when you want to go for a BS, press the button to toggle/softswap weapons? a dagger or rapier with a split damage infusion will also do much more damage than mace on a BS, so youd get 2 benefits here, and if you go for lots of backstabs, its totally worth the tiny amount of extra vitality you need to have a softswap dagger.

usually, the normal dagger is the best. chaos infusion for dark/pyro stats, lightning for fth, crystal for int, fire for physical unless you have 80dex, then you want sharp. sometimes for fth/lightning, mail breaker will do a bit more, but normal dagger has quickstep. rapier is more useful for pvp. it does have a ton of additional ability to pull enemies into backstabs, its the easiest weapon type to land stabs with, but you wont see a lot of that in pve, it shines more in pvp. for pve dagger is preferable for extra damage.