Great machete is too rewarding

[Drumadin]

Why does this weapon have hyper armor, very few frames to punish if they miss and a stagger effect if they miss you but you stand infront of them?

I can't see how that is any good idea in any dark souls game.

[76561198359476007]

Originally posted by Stalin's Holy Moustache:

Why does this weapon have hyper armor, very few frames to punish if they miss and a stagger effect if they miss you but you stand infront of them?

I can't see how that is any good idea in any dark souls game.

It's completely wrecked, in my experience, by just about any UGS, as most axes are.

[Vash]

It's a weaker version of yorm's great machete. It's a good weapon a for a low level str build, let's say SL45-50 but at higher levels there are better options.

[.Stream]

It's actually much easier to punish than you think. the hyperarmour frames start much later than you expect and most fast weapons (Curved swords specifically) can shut you down. One handed it can be parried and it's easy to dodge. At 40 endurance, you can swing it 3-4 times depending on rings and if you want extra stamina leftover afterwards.

[Drumadin]

Originally posted by Fulgore:

Originally posted by Stalin's Holy Moustache:

Why does this weapon have hyper armor, very few frames to punish if they miss and a stagger effect if they miss you but you stand infront of them?

I can't see how that is any good idea in any dark souls game.

It's completely wrecked, in my experience, by just about any UGS, as most axes are.

That is kinda an issue in Dark Souls now tho. You need hyper armor to ♥♥♥♥ over hyper armor? Pro league hand holding given by From Software in that if you ask me.

[.Stream]

Originally posted by Stalin's Holy Moustache:

That is kinda an issue in Dark Souls now tho. You need hyper armor to ♥♥♥♥ over hyper armor? Pro league hand holding given by From Software in that if you ask me.

No, you need a big weapon to stagger a big weapon in hyperarmour...that or you can time your hits perfectly to hit when the hyperarmour ends or before it begins.

That or you need high poise damage/stagger items/weapons... bombs,crossbows with the explosive bolt ( Avelyn specifically ), etc. Or, be smart and use a longer weapon or even a ranged weapon or spell/miracle/pyro. Hyperarmour means nothing if you're out of range.

[nooblet]

The rolling 2h r1 is absolute ♥♥♥♥ though.

[Drumadin]

Originally posted by Zerberius:

Originally posted by Stalin's Holy Moustache:

That is kinda an issue in Dark Souls now tho. You need hyper armor to ♥♥♥♥ over hyper armor? Pro league hand holding given by From Software in that if you ask me.

No, you need a big weapon to stagger a big weapon in hyperarmour...that or you can time your hits perfectly to hit when the hyperarmour ends or before it begins.

That or you need high poise damage/stagger items/weapons... bombs,crossbows with the explosive bolt ( Avelyn specifically ), etc. Or, be smart and use a longer weapon or even a ranged weapon or spell/miracle/pyro. Hyperarmour means nothing if you're out of range.

Crossbows have a tedency to miss because of how they character bends down as they attack so it's not that reliable, also you must rememeber that if they miss you and you try to throw firebombs your action will be canceled because you get staggered when they miss.

Timing your hits perfectly is mostly a no go aswell because of the latency, so either you hit their hyper armor or they roll away taking no damage.

Spears has the same issue as the bombs, you get staggered. Only thing to use is just another hyper armor ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ weapon to counter a hyper armor ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ weapon.

It's all just become a ridicules concept that just made every build having a ultragreat weapon to become the new giant dad from the first DS game where they mistake broken and flawed programming with skill.

[NoQtrGiven]

Originally posted by Stalin's Holy Moustache:

Originally posted by Zerberius:

No, you need a big weapon to stagger a big weapon in hyperarmour...that or you can time your hits perfectly to hit when the hyperarmour ends or before it begins.

That or you need high poise damage/stagger items/weapons... bombs,crossbows with the explosive bolt ( Avelyn specifically ), etc. Or, be smart and use a longer weapon or even a ranged weapon or spell/miracle/pyro. Hyperarmour means nothing if you're out of range.

Crossbows have a tedency to miss because of how they character bends down as they attack so it's not that reliable, also you must rememeber that if they miss you and you try to throw firebombs your action will be canceled because you get staggered when they miss.

Timing your hits perfectly is mostly a no go aswell because of the latency, so either you hit their hyper armor or they roll away taking no damage.

Spears has the same issue as the bombs, you get staggered. Only thing to use is just another hyper armor ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ weapon to counter a hyper armor ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ weapon.

It's all just become a ridicules concept that just made every build having a ultragreat weapon to become the new giant dad from the first DS game where they mistake broken and flawed programming with skill.

And if there wasn't hyper armor then any great weapon would be useless since daggers can stagger in two hits and swing faster than any weapon. The hyper armor is there to make big weapons viable from both a technical stand point, and a latency standpoint. If it wasn't there then there would be 0 reason to use them other than fashion.

[76561198359476007]

Originally posted by NoQtrGiven:

Originally posted by Stalin's Holy Moustache:

Crossbows have a tedency to miss because of how they character bends down as they attack so it's not that reliable, also you must rememeber that if they miss you and you try to throw firebombs your action will be canceled because you get staggered when they miss.

Timing your hits perfectly is mostly a no go aswell because of the latency, so either you hit their hyper armor or they roll away taking no damage.

Spears has the same issue as the bombs, you get staggered. Only thing to use is just another hyper armor ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ weapon to counter a hyper armor ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ weapon.

It's all just become a ridicules concept that just made every build having a ultragreat weapon to become the new giant dad from the first DS game where they mistake broken and flawed programming with skill.

And if there wasn't hyper armor then any great weapon would be useless since daggers can stagger in two hits and swing faster than any weapon. The hyper armor is there to make big weapons viable from both a technical stand point, and a latency standpoint. If it wasn't there then there would be 0 reason to use them other than fashion.

Hyperarmor or Poise is the only thing that gives big slow heavy weapons a shot at victory and even then vs a skilled player it isn't enough. I really wish they added something to the actual weapons and not the armor that would make them viable. One interesting example would be for the ability to break smaller weapons. Maybe it could work kind of like a parry or something. Obviously this is just an idea, but there should of been a way to make them viable other than requiring the user to wear huge amounts of armor, and like I said that only works vs random players. One thing that really bugs me is that they have the ability to block, but have nowhere near the stability or defenses of a Greatshield. So, using them to block is pretty much suicide or useless. I think there was a lost opportunity there, to add something unique to the weapon itself.

[40+13x-3=17x-363]

Originally posted by nooblet:

The rolling 2h r1 is absolute ♥♥♥♥ though.

^And the 2h r1 can't combo for both great and yhorm machetes, just 1 hit and your oponent can roll away.

[Merilirem]

Complaining about not being able to beat heavily armoured knights with an ultra greatsword in melee combat... Wow.

If your weapon is fast you can hit and run or stunlock slower weapons eternally. If your using a spear you don't even need to get close enough for anything but the longest weapons to hit you. Spears are also faster to use than a long greatsword type weapon.

Poise/HA is useful, but you hardly need it in this game. Its generally thought to be easier to just grab a longsword and use the stupid 1h r1 to spam people to death outside of their frames. Big weapons are only a problem if your too stupid to do anything but run up and try trading.

Poise as a system works in a way which lets the guy in fallen knight strike through longswords with his greatsword, but get wrecked when i show up with my black iron and BKGA. In black iron with my BKGA i can actually 1h swing through people using some ultra's and 2handing the same BKGA im using. However i know that a guy in full havel is winning if i trade on even terms.

Thats how it works. You find a place in the armour/stagger levels and know that anyone below you can be crushed while those with bigger armour and weapons will come out on top. However you also know that your non armoured non ultra foes are faster than you, or have invested to hit REALLY hard or have high hp. Maybe they even have magic to enchant swords or throw fire.

Using big weapons properly takes alot. It takes honed skill and stat points above all.

Armour is still pretty crap TBH since its defensive values are just for show at this point.

Big weapons are unforgiving, small weapons forgive all but ultimate stupidity. If you want to be a frontline knight, you need to bring the right gear for the job.

[76561198359476007]

Originally posted by Merilirem:

Complaining about not being able to beat heavily armoured knights with an ultra greatsword in melee combat... Wow.

If your weapon is fast you can hit and run or stunlock slower weapons eternally. If your using a spear you don't even need to get close enough for anything but the longest weapons to hit you. Spears are also faster to use than a long greatsword type weapon.

Poise/HA is useful, but you hardly need it in this game. Its generally thought to be easier to just grab a longsword and use the stupid 1h r1 to spam people to death outside of their frames. Big weapons are only a problem if your too stupid to do anything but run up and try trading.

Poise as a system works in a way which lets the guy in fallen knight strike through longswords with his greatsword, but get wrecked when i show up with my black iron and BKGA. In black iron with my BKGA i can actually 1h swing through people using some ultra's and 2handing the same BKGA im using. However i know that a guy in full havel is winning if i trade on even terms.

Thats how it works. You find a place in the armour/stagger levels and know that anyone below you can be crushed while those with bigger armour and weapons will come out on top. However you also know that your non armoured non ultra foes are faster than you, or have invested to hit REALLY hard or have high hp. Maybe they even have magic to enchant swords or throw fire.

Using big weapons properly takes alot. It takes honed skill and stat points above all.

Armour is still pretty crap TBH since its defensive values are just for show at this point.

Big weapons are unforgiving, small weapons forgive all but ultimate stupidity. If you want to be a frontline knight, you need to bring the right gear for the job.

To be fair, Big Weapons are for killing Big Armor. That's one thing that is quite out of whack in the Dark Souls universe, but then again, it's fantasy.

Watch around 3m36s mark.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRY4Mpmfk1o&t=3m36s

[Merilirem]

Originally posted by Fulgore:

Originally posted by Merilirem:

Complaining about not being able to beat heavily armoured knights with an ultra greatsword in melee combat... Wow.

If your weapon is fast you can hit and run or stunlock slower weapons eternally. If your using a spear you don't even need to get close enough for anything but the longest weapons to hit you. Spears are also faster to use than a long greatsword type weapon.

Poise/HA is useful, but you hardly need it in this game. Its generally thought to be easier to just grab a longsword and use the stupid 1h r1 to spam people to death outside of their frames. Big weapons are only a problem if your too stupid to do anything but run up and try trading.

Poise as a system works in a way which lets the guy in fallen knight strike through longswords with his greatsword, but get wrecked when i show up with my black iron and BKGA. In black iron with my BKGA i can actually 1h swing through people using some ultra's and 2handing the same BKGA im using. However i know that a guy in full havel is winning if i trade on even terms.

Thats how it works. You find a place in the armour/stagger levels and know that anyone below you can be crushed while those with bigger armour and weapons will come out on top. However you also know that your non armoured non ultra foes are faster than you, or have invested to hit REALLY hard or have high hp. Maybe they even have magic to enchant swords or throw fire.

Using big weapons properly takes alot. It takes honed skill and stat points above all.

Armour is still pretty crap TBH since its defensive values are just for show at this point.

Big weapons are unforgiving, small weapons forgive all but ultimate stupidity. If you want to be a frontline knight, you need to bring the right gear for the job.

To be fair, Big Weapons are for killing Big Armor. That's one thing that is quite out of whack in the Dark Souls universe, but then again, it's fantasy.

Watch around 3m36s mark.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRY4Mpmfk1o&t=3m36s

I know how it SHOULD work. Its actually one of my pet peeves. I was just explaining how it works in this game. Big weapons still work on big armour, its just more about poisebreaking them.

[Drumadin]

What about normal greatswords such as Claymore or the Hollowslayer? Why do they need hyper armor when they got decent attack speed and high damage?

[Merilirem]

Originally posted by Stalin's Holy Moustache:

What about normal greatswords such as Claymore or the Hollowslayer? Why do they need hyper armor when they got decent attack speed and high damage?

The attack speed and damage are only decent as long as they have hyper armour. A longsword will easily out perform in terms of straight damage potential. They also lack the range of longer weapons like UGS which you can't hyper through without serious disparity in poise.

Hyper armour is a feature of the weapon and there is no weapon which has it that could live without it. Not counting Onikiri's jump skill which could easily live with less at the very least.