sl120 prisoners chain....wut??

[DeuceBane]

I have seen dozens of threads on this and there is a ton of conflicting information.

Does anyone know if there are definitive numbers on this anywhere? For every person that swears by using it essentially all the time, even at sl120 (in order to have base 35 vig/end and use it to get to 40 each with extra carry weight) i see people that claim the extra damage you take outdoes the benefits received.

Anyone have some opinions on this?

[Sa†o]

I always roll with 35-42% DR. Later on it does way more than prisoners chains 15 stat points.

An example of this is people wearing the ring for extra hp to not get 1shot from hornet.
If you land around 40% damage reduction (Dr) you will never get oneshot not even with 900hp.

[TurranMC]

http://darksouls3.wiki.fextralife.com/Prisoner's+Chain

You essentially trade an extra 5 Vigor, Endurance, and Vitality for taking 10% increased damage.

+5 Vigor is about 100 health past 27 Vigor.
If someone hits you for 400 damage an extra 10% will turn that into 440.
Takes 2.5 hits with Prisoner's Chain to invalidate the extra Vigor.

Not very good at high SL.

Below 27 Vigor you generally gain 30+ health per point of Vigor meaning about 150 health.
If someone hits you for 200 damage an extra 10% will turn that into 220.
Takes 7.5 hits with Prisoner's Chain to invalidate the extra vigor.

Prisoner's Chain very good at lower levels of Vigor and damage. Not very good at higher levels as the Vigor isn't worth as much (since you generally have more health) and a lot of builds don't even use vitality. Your build has to be very specific to make the chain viable.

[DeuceBane]

Originally posted by Duero:

I always roll with 35-42% DR. Later on it does way more than prisoners chains 15 stat points.

An example of this is people wearing the ring for extra hp to not get 1shot from hornet.
If you land around 40% damage reduction (Dr) you will never get oneshot not even with 900hp.

so youre saying the ring does more harm than good at that soul level?

[Sa†o]

Originally posted by TurranMC:

http://darksouls3.wiki.fextralife.com/Prisoner's+Chain

You essentially trade an extra 5 Vigor, Endurance, and Vitality for taking 10% increased damage.

+5 Vigor is about 100 health past 27 Vigor.
If someone hits you for 400 damage an extra 10% will turn that into 440.
Takes 2.5 hits with Prisoner's Chain to invalidate the extra Vigor.

Not very good at high SL.

Below 27 Vigor you generally gain 30+ health per point of Vigor meaning about 150 health.
If someone hits you for 200 damage an extra 10% will turn that into 220.
Takes 7.5 hits with Prisoner's Chain to invalidate the extra vigor.

Prisoner's Chain very good at lower levels of Vigor and damage. Not very good at higher levels as the Vigor isn't worth as much (since you generally have more health) and a lot of builds don't even use vitality. Your build has to be very specific to make the chain viable.

Well written ^

[Sa†o]

Originally posted by MF DOOM:

Originally posted by Duero:

I always roll with 35-42% DR. Later on it does way more than prisoners chains 15 stat points.

An example of this is people wearing the ring for extra hp to not get 1shot from hornet.
If you land around 40% damage reduction (Dr) you will never get oneshot not even with 900hp.

so youre saying the ring does more harm than good at that soul level?

Yes thats precisely what im saying. :)

[DeuceBane]

Originally posted by TurranMC:

http://darksouls3.wiki.fextralife.com/Prisoner's+Chain

You essentially trade an extra 5 Vigor, Endurance, and Vitality for taking 10% increased damage.

+5 Vigor is about 100 health past 27 Vigor.
If someone hits you for 400 damage an extra 10% will turn that into 440.
Takes 2.5 hits with Prisoner's Chain to invalidate the extra Vigor.

Not very good at high SL.

Below 27 Vigor you generally gain 30+ health per point of Vigor meaning about 150 health.
If someone hits you for 200 damage an extra 10% will turn that into 220.
Takes 7.5 hits with Prisoner's Chain to invalidate the extra vigor.

Prisoner's Chain very good at lower levels of Vigor and damage. Not very good at higher levels as the Vigor isn't worth as much (since you generally have more health) and a lot of builds don't even use vitality. Your build has to be very specific to make the chain viable.

but will it really break my character? Right now i have a str build at 125, and im thinking of trying out a 50/50 quality build, and i would need the extra levels to get there. i have every weapon in the game and a boat load of slabs so i kinda want to make a super variety character, and pretty much be able to use whatever weapon i want outside of a few faith/int req weapons.

i realize its a trade-off, and my carry weight will go way down (since i have a lot of stats in it now that would go to dex) but it would sure be cool to just have to upgrade a weapon to be able to start dueling with it, and easily compare etc...

[TurranMC]

Will it break your character? Maybe? I don't know what your build is. What I can tell you is the Vigor is essentially worthless and you will die faster with the ring than you would without. Is the 5 Endurance and 5 Vitality worth dying faster? Probably not, but it's up to you.

[[Jintoro]]

MF DOOM, it's a bad idea to go 50/50 in the first place, due to diminishng returns and the soft cap being at 40, you'll get way less AR than you think.

[DeuceBane]

Originally posted by TurranMC:

Will it break your character? Maybe? I don't know what your build is. What I can tell you is the Vigor is essentially worthless and you will die faster with the ring than you would without. Is the 5 Endurance and 5 Vitality worth dying faster? Probably not, but it's up to you.

ok final question! would you consider 35 vig and end at 120 worse off than using the ring with those stats?

In other words, would simply omiting those ten points make me squishier than using the ring?

[DeuceBane]

Originally posted by Spacecadett:

MF DOOM, it's a bad idea to go 50/50 in the first place, due to diminishng returns and the soft cap being at 40, you'll get way less AR than you think.

thats a good point, i could probably just stay at 40/40 str/dex and do plenty damage.

[TurranMC]

I don't know what you're asking exactly. Spacecadett's point is extremely relevant though. For most weapons going from 40/40 to 50/50 gives you 5-20 extra damage. 1 stat point for <1 point of damage is not a good trade.

[NoQtrGiven]

So I was ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ around the prisoner chain/RoF. Prisoners chain gives only slightly more hp than RoF+1. But RoF+1 gives more stamina and more equip load while not increasing your dmg taken. So really just get RoF.