Is it me or Nail Arts are worthless against bosses?

[Artek [General]]

It seems that "Quck Slash" charm is > anything else. It almost feels like bosses have their HP based on amount of hits, not actual damage.
Spaming everything with quick slash seems to work better then trying to make timed nail arts, especially considering that they will leave you open for quiet some time and since a lot of bosses dont suffer from stagger (hey there, heavy blow, the most worthless charm in existence).

So... What's the deal?

EDIT: Yep, something is definetely up with Nail Arts when used against bosses.
Fighting Grey Prince right now (screw this guy) and quick slash gets him knocked out a LOT quicker then trying to skillfully used nail arts and only hit him with them.
What the hell?

EDIT 2: Welp, screw nail arts in that boss battle... They do nothing but get me killed.
Curse you, R1 spamming! You wont leave me alone even in this game!

[Aeternalis the Abyssal Alchemist]

Originally posted by Artek General:

It seems that "Quck Slash" charm is > anything else. It almost feels like bosses have their HP based on amount of hits, not actual damage.
Spaming everything with quick slash seems to work better then trying to make timed nail arts, especially considering that they will leave you open for quiet some time and since a lot of bosses dont suffer from stagger (hey there, heavy blow, the most worthless charm in existence).

The bosses do have health, but they also have stagger(stuns them if they get hit enough times in succession).
Quickslash was nerfed at some point, I believe in the Hidden Dreams update, by increasing its cost by one notch. If anyone had a save that was created before that update however, then they would still only need 2 notches to equip it.
And yes, Heavy Blow has very limited usefulness, but there are situations I found that it can be used effectively. But I still don't think its worth the 2 notches that the devs seem to think it is. The fact that different enemies have different levels of knockback resistance, and most boss are just immune, make the 2 notches seem very questionable.

Originally posted by Artek General:

EDIT: Yep, something is definetely up with Nail Arts when used against bosses.
Fighting Grey Prince right now (screw this guy) and quick slash gets him knocked out a LOT quicker then trying to skillfully used nail arts and only hit him with them.
What the hell?

Descending Dark and Flukenest really shine in that fight... though I suppose Flukenest really shines in every bossfight, the damage spam is just too good!

Originally posted by Artek General:

EDIT 2: Welp, screw nail arts in that boss battle... They do nothing but get me killed.
Curse you, R1 spamming! You wont leave me alone even in this game!

[/quote]

So I'm not the only one who changed attack to R1?
I just find it way more intuitive to use R1 for melee instead of X(which I mapped to my Spells).
I'm curious about your control layout.

[Bankai9212]

Originally posted by Artek General:

I honestly feel like the game's mechanics start contradicting themselves at this point.
The bossfights become so butt-tight that you have no time to heal except for specific windows when boss get staggered, but as the boss keeps spawning 9000 enemies on the screen to haunt you while he's staggered - there's no way you are going to just heal peacefully, or you are just going to get hit.
And in the same time you ARE going to get hit during the bossfight because there's no freakin way you are doding a boss and 3 of his minions who jump all over the place in RNG fashion.

He's one of a few, fortunately he's optional. Not sure if cheese tactics are needed for that fight.

[Artek [General]]

Originally posted by Abyssal Alchemist:

Originally posted by Artek General:

EDIT 2: Welp, screw nail arts in that boss battle... They do nothing but get me killed.
Curse you, R1 spamming! You wont leave me alone even in this game!

So I'm not the only one who changed attack to R1?
I just find it way more intuitive to use R1 for melee instead of X(which I mapped to my Spells).
I'm curious about your control layout.

Actually i play on a keyboard (i don't own a controller), but as a part of Souls community you just get used to the word "R1" and it becomes a synonym of quick attacks.

Originally posted by Bankai9212:

Originally posted by Artek General:

I honestly feel like the game's mechanics start contradicting themselves at this point.
The bossfights become so butt-tight that you have no time to heal except for specific windows when boss get staggered, but as the boss keeps spawning 9000 enemies on the screen to haunt you while he's staggered - there's no way you are going to just heal peacefully, or you are just going to get hit.
And in the same time you ARE going to get hit during the bossfight because there's no freakin way you are doding a boss and 3 of his minions who jump all over the place in RNG fashion.

He's one of a few, fortunately he's optional. Not sure if cheese tactics are needed for that fight.

I beat him 3 times (to get jounral listings of all of his minions) with a "heal at all costs" build.

Speed up heal + turn into a snail + be covered in shell + spit toxins whenever you heal + defender's chrest (which also increaes AOE and damage of heal-toxins).
Basically whenever the bastard would get me a window i would start healing and just run around the arena poisoning everything (speed-heal also speeds up your movement speed as a snail).

It worked suprisingly well through 3 fights, thankfully his minions gave me enough soul to keep healing myself from time to time.

Probably will be now my go-to build for any boss that refuses to give me quality time with my heals or just loves to jump everywhere.

[Bankai9212]

Or if the moves are predictable dodge effectively. As impressive as it is you got that far with keyboard I would suggest a controller though.

[Artek [General]]

Originally posted by Bankai9212:

Or if the moves are predictable dodge effectively. As impressive as it is you got that far with keyboard I would suggest a controller though.

Well i did learn to dodge most of his attacks more efficiently.
Not waste double jump on his low waves, bash him on the head when he charges me with a sword, yadi yada.
The problem is his ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ minions. He keeps spewing these damn flies and jumpers who go everywhere and while you try to dodge one of them - you get hit by something else.
They also die in 2 attacks instead of 1 which is infuriating (perhaps the 3-ore upgraded could fix that, but who knows...) Thankfully Defender's cresses and my toxin clouds from healing helped to easy the burden.

That's really what bosses such as him and Lost Kin come to - you must find a way to deal with small bastards as to not let them ruin you concentration on the real enemy.
And frankly... That's not as fun as it could be. I would enjoy a fair duel much more.

[Phirestar]

I began using the Nail Arts shortly after discovering the Nailmaster's Glory charm, and I found them to be my favorite abilities in the game. They're quite good against bosses for two reasons:

1. They deal more damage than regular attacks, which is useful when you can only get 1-2 hits in.
   
2. Because of their size, you can keep your distances from bosses while attacking, and more easily avoid taking damage.

As an example, I've found that using Dash Slash was a valuable tactic in the fight against Markoth. Being able to hit him from far away meant that it was less likely for me to get smacked in the face by his shield.

Now if only there were a vertical slice Nail Art...

[Morphic]

I agree with OP. Nail Arts just generally suck against majority of Bosses. Not because they aren't good Damage wise, it's because a Quickslash + Dmg + good skills out DPSes them.

I was loving on the Charged Slash and Spin Slash for clearing and exploring... then I tried them on Bosses and honestly, they just aren't worth it. I even started using the Sage Charm for quick use of Nail Arts ... and they just suck vs basic attacks. Spin Slash was super good, especially since you can actually extend the duration but you are left open the entire time.

Furthermore I'm really disappointed how majority of the Bosses are super easy when you just Pogo attack. Many of their Attack Patterns leave them open for Pogo Attacks and, as long as you attempt to dodge, you can essentially facetank through hits anyway and out DPS them.

I mean, at first I thought most of the Bosses were tough but interesting fights. I'd get my butt handed to me multiple times until I learned to perfectly dodge and memorize attack patterns... then I started trying to Pogo after having to do so many Pogo puzzles the game throws at you. Once I did that, it was like "why did I ever do anything different?". Hornet's last Boss Fight I did it first try without ever getting hit, all because I immediately Pogo'ed lol.

At least the Final Boss and Nightmare King are actually something and you can't Pogo to win.

[Aeternalis the Abyssal Alchemist]

Originally posted by Phirestar:

I began using the Nail Arts shortly after discovering the Nailmaster's Glory charm, and I found them to be my favorite abilities in the game. They're quite good against bosses for two reasons:

1. They deal more damage than regular attacks, which is useful when you can only get 1-2 hits in.
   
2. Because of their size, you can keep your distances from bosses while attacking, and more easily avoid taking damage.

As an example, I've found that using Dash Slash was a valuable tactic in the fight against Markoth. Being able to hit him from far away meant that it was less likely for me to get smacked in the face by his shield.

Now if only there were a vertical slice Nail Art...

Have you gotten all 3 of the spells? One of them is an upwards attack. You get it from Fog Canyon and upgrade it in The Abyss.

[Phirestar]

Originally posted by Abyssal Alchemist:

Originally posted by Phirestar:

I began using the Nail Arts shortly after discovering the Nailmaster's Glory charm, and I found them to be my favorite abilities in the game. They're quite good against bosses for two reasons:

1. They deal more damage than regular attacks, which is useful when you can only get 1-2 hits in.
   
2. Because of their size, you can keep your distances from bosses while attacking, and more easily avoid taking damage.

As an example, I've found that using Dash Slash was a valuable tactic in the fight against Markoth. Being able to hit him from far away meant that it was less likely for me to get smacked in the face by his shield.

Now if only there were a vertical slice Nail Art...

Have you gotten all 3 of the spells? One of them is an upwards attack. You get it from Fog Canyon and upgrade it in The Abyss.

Yes.

[MiFrun]

I play on a keyboard and will charge while i'm dodging (i just hold the attack button and jump around) so that the next opening i have in a boss fight i can get a big hit with a nail art in then follow it up with quickslashes. it's the only way I've really liked using them.


plus the dash art is nice when you've got stacked enemies (like in the watcher's spire).