Characters and narrative, should I play this game?

[Alfon]

Hi! I got the game recently as a gift and I was exploring it a little bit. I started the game and I found that the main character can't talk, right? Am I wrong? Like the hero in Skyrim, Link in Zelda or Byleth in Fire Emblem. I wanted to ask your opinion, is dragon's dogma narrative hurt very hard for that reason? What do you think?

And about the companions, in the tutorial they seem to be random characters with specific classes. Is it that way? There is not relationships and such? They are just... minions and nothing more?

I have little time relatively talking (it's summer anyway) and I am wondering if I should put more time into this one. Thanks a lot for helping me.

[zadymek]

The game is all about combat and doesn't even have a proper dialogue system so no, narrative doesn't get hurt by a mute protagonist and talking Pawns (and scarce relationships with NPCs which are present in this game too).

Think of it more like a hack and slash/slasher than an RPG. If you like action, with a bit of strategy and tactics, you will like it. If you expect Bioware levels of writing forget about it.

[KarmaTheAlligator]

Why would the narrative be hurt by the main character not talking?

Yes, pawns are just followers (although your own pawn is very attached to you), but you can form relationships with other NPCs. You're not going to be making out with your party members like in Dragon Age or Mass Effect.

[Alfon]

Originally posted by KarmaTheAlligator:

Why would the narrative be hurt by the main character not talking?

Yes, pawns are just followers (although your own pawn is very attached to you), but you can form relationships with other NPCs. You're not going to be making out with your party members like in Dragon Age or Mass Effect.

The main character is the vehicle in which the player travels through the game. If the character doesn't talk it's hard to reflect his personality and emotions, which turns that vehicle into a footmobile of sorts. Just imagine Shepard being mute in Mass Effect for example. The narrative can be good but then it needs to compensate for that loss. And that's really hard. It needs some really good companions or a really, like, really well developed world.

Originally posted by zadymek:

The game is all about combat and doesn't even have a proper dialogue system so no, narrative doesn't get hurt by a mute protagonist and talking Pawns (and scarce relationships with NPCs which are present in this game too).

Think of it more like a hack and slash/slasher than an RPG. If you like action, with a bit of strategy and tactics, you will like it. If you expect Bioware levels of writing forget about it.

Ok, reading both of you, this is an action rpg with focus on the action. This is about fighting, and the story is absolutely aside, is it that way? At least, are there some epic twists or memorable characters?

[zadymek]

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

Ok, reading both of you, this is an action rpg with focus on the action. This is about fighting, and the story is absolutely aside, is it that way? At least, are there some epic twists or memorable characters?

Let me put it this way: this is an action game (I try to dissuade ppl from using this bollocks PR term ARPG) and the plot is the ancillary device to the combat. That doesn't make it good or bad, it just makes it of secondary importance gameplay wise.

As for the actual quality: I daresay it is on par with majority of RPGs you may have played. It may be a bit unfocused (play the game for a while you'll know what I mean) and is very detached from the protagonist for some reason, but it's nothing to be a shamed of.


BTW IMHO Gordon Freeman does a much better job at immersing the player in the plot than all protagonists from AAA heroic RPGs put together. And he does this without a single word: show, don't tell.

[Alfon]

Originally posted by zadymek:

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

Ok, reading both of you, this is an action rpg with focus on the action. This is about fighting, and the story is absolutely aside, is it that way? At least, are there some epic twists or memorable characters?

Let me put it this way: this is an action game (I try to dissuade ppl from using this bollocks PR term ARPG) and the plot is the ancillary device to the combat. That doesn't make it good or bad, it just makes it of secondary importance gameplay wise.

As for the actual quality: I daresay it is on par with majority of RPGs you may have played. It may be a bit unfocused (play the game for a while you'll know what I mean) and is very detached from the protagonist for some reason, but it's nothing to be a shamed of.


BTW IMHO Gordon Freeman does a much better job at immersing the player in the plot than all protagonists from AAA heroic RPGs put together. And he does this without a single word: show, don't tell.

That's not Gordon Freeman, that's Valve. As I said, you can make great storytelling with a mute character but you are making sacrifices that you need to compensate. A mute character is an avatar for the player. You need to give voice to the player then in some way.

In Half life 2 the side characters were AMAZING, every scene was a delight. You felt inside the game, part of that world.

When you ask to someone "who was Gordon Freeman?" sometimes you get the right answer: "I was Gordon Freeman". That's the answer that any developer wants to get when they create a mute character as the main character.

But usually that doesn't work. If I ask you "Who is the hero in Xenoblade Chronicles X?" WHO THE ♥♥♥♥ KNOWS. I have some bias with Nintendo, I'll admit it. I think they are very bad storytellers, every time I think in this kind of things I think on their games. I know that a lot of people use mute characters but some people do it well.

I loved the story in Baldur's gate when I was a kid and the main character was just a mute avatar.


Anyway, thank you guys. I think I can enjoy this game, I'll play again soon.

[Guts]

Originally posted by zadymek:

BTW IMHO Gordon Freeman does a much better job at immersing the player in the plot than all protagonists from AAA heroic RPGs put together. And he does this without a single word: show, don't tell.

Preach it

[Grr. [SG CMD] Majah Lazah]

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

Hi! I got the game recently as a gift and I was exploring it a little bit. I started the game and I found that the main character can't talk, right? Am I wrong? Like the hero in Skyrim, Link in Zelda or Byleth in Fire Emblem. I wanted to ask your opinion, is dragon's dogma narrative hurt very hard for that reason? What do you think?

And about the companions, in the tutorial they seem to be random characters with specific classes. Is it that way? There is not relationships and such? They are just... minions and nothing more?

I have little time relatively talking (it's summer anyway) and I am wondering if I should put more time into this one. Thanks a lot for helping me.

You seem to think this game is Dragon Age. This game is the literal opposite of Dragon Age.

[Alfon]

Originally posted by Grr. SG CMD Majah Lazah:

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

Hi! I got the game recently as a gift and I was exploring it a little bit. I started the game and I found that the main character can't talk, right? Am I wrong? Like the hero in Skyrim, Link in Zelda or Byleth in Fire Emblem. I wanted to ask your opinion, is dragon's dogma narrative hurt very hard for that reason? What do you think?

And about the companions, in the tutorial they seem to be random characters with specific classes. Is it that way? There is not relationships and such? They are just... minions and nothing more?

I have little time relatively talking (it's summer anyway) and I am wondering if I should put more time into this one. Thanks a lot for helping me.

You seem to think this game is Dragon Age. This game is the literal opposite of Dragon Age.

I don't know what is this game XD, that's why I am here. But I'd say I have a pretty decent idea now.

[zadymek]

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

That's not Gordon Freeman, that's Valve. As I said, you can make great storytelling with a mute character but you are making sacrifices that you need to compensate. A mute character is an avatar for the player. You need to give voice to the player then in some way.

Compensate you say? Ok, how about this

Pawns
Pawn is not just your creation/helper. It also talks. And it not only replies to your commands (you can pick its attitude btw), shares strategies or game tips but also comments on current events:

- it adds a bit of dramatism to combat when a pawn cries for help, or the other way around, hurries to rescue the Arisen
- Pawns also de facto speak in place of the Arisen during quests advising strategies, commenting Arisen decisions, NPC fates aso.

tl;dr Pawn system is a full fledged narrative device in Dragon's Dogma.


BTW I will not comment on the quality of Half-Life 2 plot, cause I yawn at the very mention of it.

[Alfon]

Originally posted by zadymek:

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

That's not Gordon Freeman, that's Valve. As I said, you can make great storytelling with a mute character but you are making sacrifices that you need to compensate. A mute character is an avatar for the player. You need to give voice to the player then in some way.

Compensate you say? Ok, how about this

Pawns
Pawn is not just your creation/helper. It also talks. And it not only replies to your commands (you can pick its attitude btw), shares strategies or game tips but also comments on current events:

- it adds a bit of dramatism to combat when a pawn cries for help, or the other way around, hurries to rescue the Arisen
- Pawns also de facto speak in place of the Arisen during quests advising strategies, commenting Arisen decisions, NPC fates aso.

tl;dr Pawn system is a full fledged narrative device in Dragon's Dogma.


BTW I will not comment on the quality of Half-Life 2 plot, cause I yawn at the very mention of it.

That's interesting, I am intrigued. The fact that you can choose so many things about the pawns however... I am not sure of that. I mean, they look like constructs, bots that assist you casually. Doesn't that breaks the immersion?

[zadymek]

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

That's interesting, I am intrigued. The fact that you can choose so many things about the pawns however... I am not sure of that. I mean, they look like constructs, bots that assist you casually. Doesn't that breaks the immersion?

Well
they do talk a lot, a bit too much at times ;)
but that's it. They are, how to put it, your heart in the game. They react, they feel, they even cry after your character dies.

And yes, they are technically constructs, but human like ones - and each Pawn, literally, is the reflection of its creator (except offline ones). They are not part of our world, they only pretend (well) to be human and even the NPCs themselves notice how Pawns are different, but...
Yeah, not artificial, just different. It is truly entertaining obeserving how those outsiders attempt to integrate with the society.

Also...without spoilers I cannot explain how in the course of the plot they become less of outsiders, sorry.

[Alfon]

Originally posted by zadymek:

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

That's interesting, I am intrigued. The fact that you can choose so many things about the pawns however... I am not sure of that. I mean, they look like constructs, bots that assist you casually. Doesn't that breaks the immersion?

Well
they do talk a lot, a bit too much at times ;)
but that's it. They are, how to put it, your heart in the game. They react, they feel, they even cry after your character dies.

And yes, they are technically constructs, but human like ones - and each Pawn, literally, is the reflection of its creator (except offline ones). They are not part of our world, they only pretend (well) to be human and even the NPCs themselves notice how Pawns are different, but...
Yeah, not artificial, just different. It is truly entertaining obeserving how those outsiders attempt to integrate with the society.

Also...without spoilers I cannot explain how in the course of the plot they become less of outsiders, sorry.

Ok, I definitely need to play this game now. Thanks!

[zadymek]

Originally posted by Sorenzor:

Ok, I definitely need to play this game now. Thanks!

Oh my, what have I done ;)

A word of advice: if you happen to pick the wrong voice for your "construct", like a chipmunk or slab-of-stone ish, progress the main plot till Gran Soren, find the barber shop on the map and pay handsomely for a Royal Treatment. No need to suffer more than necessary.

[Chrisso]

I was looking/hoping for a "typical" - dialogue driven etc. RPG too and first I thought Dragon's Dogma was pretty laughable... but it grew on me fast. Just forget your typical RPG expectations, after a while it makes sense and can be incredibly fun - yes, the pawns are the highlight, they are not perfect but super fun and come with some nice little surprises. Don't play offline, checking out other people's pawns is the meat of the game. Other than that, don't take the story too serious, some of it is told in a way that reminds of Anime, with some strange exaggerations, it's actually a little satirical and should be taken with humor (just take the "love interests"). You won't find big decissions, just witness the story of your character and pawn, but it's a fun ride, and in the end even the story makes some sense. As for combat, it's the biggest part of the game, but not very hard and actually fun, although grindy in parts. You won't enjoy fighting dragons in Skyrim or Dragon Age anymore after climbing on the backs and heads of them here. :)

[Guh~hey~hey~♫]

I'd say no.

If you like that much narrative over gameplay, just read books, watch movies, or play visual novels (or story driven games).

DDDA has an okay narrative, but it's mostly about gameplay.