Poacher best perk's build

[Pan.Turkusik]

i'm kinda new to Battle Brother's and i like the level up system but every time i try to make my archer build (bowyer) i get confused. So i decided to ask someone smarter and more expirianced than my: you guys. So here i am looking for what perk's should i take for my bowyer and what stat's to take.

[Scathe]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3408667409

theres what I do for a ranged attacker, done for the base crossbowman on the companions origin. bowyer or poacher still needs ranged attack stars to qualify as a ranged attacker. needed perks are bags&belts, quick hands, throwing mastery, nimble, berserk, and duelist. I also take colossus.

[UnluckyNoob]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2801094137

Nothing really changed in last 3 years neither in build not in community understanding of archer builds. Although now I recommend 3 archers: bow + 2 crossbows. Just do not bother much with great recruits, hunter without ranged stars is good enough. You'll be able to fish for chad recruits later if you wish.

[Scathe]

Originally posted by UnluckyNoob:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2801094137

Nothing really changed in last 3 years neither in build not in community understanding of archer builds. Although now I recommend 3 archers: bow + 2 crossbows. Just do not bother much with great recruits, hunter without ranged stars is good enough. You'll be able to fish for chad recruits later if you wish.

do you use archers in addition to throwing duelists or do you skip building throwing duelists? 3 archers seems alot

[UnluckyNoob]

Originally posted by Scathe:

do you use archers in addition to throwing duelists or do you skip building throwing duelists? 3 archers seems alot

I use all melee party for big melee fights. 9 frontliners + sergeant + 2 swordlancers normally and 11 frontliners + sergeant vs barbs. Small backline is much easier to protect and swordlancers are usually better than throwers.

[gvandinteren]

I never build dedicated archers. Their use is too limited, imo. Basically Hexes and maybe Necromancers. I always give them Throwing Mastery and usually nothing else. Bow Mastery isn't very good, as it does not increase damage and the increased range is not a big deal and the reduced fatigue usually isn't either.

The barb throwing gear does so much more damage at short range.

Usually I start the battle equipped with a bow, but when the enemy gets close, swap to throwing gear. Depending on the enemy I bring heavy javelins or throwing axes or a mix of both.

Perks:
Colossus
Bags & Belts
Throwing mastery
Duelist
Berserk
Quickhands

This is the core of every build. For the rest you can pick from:

Nimble. I will take this almost always, but might skip if I have great ranged defense. A ranged unit with 3 stars in rdefense, for example.

Overwhelm. Great Vs very tough enemies like Lindwurms. Put a couple of stats into Initiative if you take this

Recover. If the fat of your bro isn't very good.

Fearsome. Good to trigger morale checks Vs primarily orcs

Bow mastery. Maybe give it to one of your bros.

Xbow mastery. If you are good with gonnes or have a kickass famed xbow.

Pathfinder. For the fat reduction and the mobility.

Killing frenzy. For the damage boost.

Bullseye. To hit those pesky hexes and necromancers that are hiding behind allies.

Fast adaptation. Don't take this. Find another recruit.

Build a couple of ranged bros in different ways, so you can bring the correct one into a specific fight.

Leveling stats is easy. Take ranged attack every time and grab whatever are the best rolls in fatigue, hitpoints and ranged defense. Resolve isn't that important, cause he doesn't get hit or walked upon. Initiative should be leveled a bit if you grab overwhelm. You can also wear the hyena armor attachment

[gvandinteren]

BTW I lied when I said that Colossus was a core perk.
In my peasant militia campaign (no Hunters, no Bowyers to recruit) I found a Farmhand with max ranged attack + 3 stars and 2 stars in ranged def. He didn't get Colosuss or Nimble and ended up at level 11 with 89 ranged attack and 40+ ranged def.

vs orcs bring Fearsome.

vs undead and lindwurms bring overwhelm. vs zombies also bring Recover, because these are long ass fights.

vs hexes, goblins and possibly necromancers, bring master bowmen.

vs humans bring all of them. Heavy javelins WRECK humans.

vs a plethora of Orc Warriors or a barb chosen camp with frost unholds or an ancient undead camp with too many necrosavants, your ranged units sit out.

[goobie snoobert]

dedicated bow/crossbow bros are a bad idea later on, but are decent early for free damage at the start of combat. sooner than later you want to pivot into throwing, and eventually handgonnes as well.
the inventory of your ranged units is going to heavily depend on the fight. early on it's usually javelins and a shield, a melee, and a net. but once i can afford them, my ranged units get 2 handgonnes, javelins, a smoke pot, and a good melee weapon; remember to level up their melee skill to punish anyone trying to ambush them, since eventually they WILL be forced into melee range. xbows are still really good for certain fights like necromancers and hexen, and nets are very strong for a lot of fights

Originally posted by Scathe:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3408667409

this is very close to the build id suggest, with a couple of key differences
no fast adaptation or colossus. your dedicated ranged units should have enough ranged skill that they'll be hitting almost every shot anyway. fast adaptation is a great perk for mediocre or outright bad brothers to make them usable, but you shouldn't be picking it on your main ranged units. and colossus i just find obsolete with nimble; ranged units will only be getting hit once in a blue moon, they don't need to be tanks
instead, i suggest fearsome (by far one of the best perks in the game and should be on all your dedicated damage dealers) and killing frenzy (great synergy with berserk, and ranged units typically get a lot of kills)

[gvandinteren]

Originally posted by goobie snoobert:

remember to level up their melee skill to punish anyone trying to ambush them, since eventually they WILL be forced into melee range

Hard disagree. Don't teach a Hunter how to melee fight. Learn how to keep your ranged bros out of enemy zoc and learn when to sit out ranged bros. When building a Hybrid, sure. But that is a entirely different build

[goobie snoobert]

Originally posted by gvandinteren:

Originally posted by goobie snoobert:

remember to level up their melee skill to punish anyone trying to ambush them, since eventually they WILL be forced into melee range

Hard disagree. Don't teach a Hunter how to melee fight. Learn how to keep your ranged bros out of enemy zoc and learn when to sit out ranged bros. When building a Hybrid, sure. But that is a entirely different build

it doesn't matter how much you keep ranged bros out of enemy zoc. eventually they will be forced into that situation. there are enemies like necrosavants, orc warriors, and wolfriders which prioritize getting to your backline. and the more enemies you fight, the more of them will try to flank you from the back
instead of making them damsels in distress that need to be saved by your frontline bros, you should make them able to confidently defend themselves. maces are ideal for this purpose since even if you can't get the kill, you can still daze or stun them
and like, what other stat are you gonna level? ranged defense and initiative are memes, and they don't need melee defense. you shouldn't feel forced to take +1s for melee skill, but if they're +2s or +3s, im always taking them

[gvandinteren]

If you face too many orc warriors or necrosavants, don't go in with ranged units.

Initiative is a meme? LOL? You don't think it is relevant to be able to have your turn before orc berserkers do?

Ranged defense is a meme? For ranged units? You don't want to own goblin ambushers and nomad archers with your ranged unit? For a ranged unit ranged defense >>> melee attack.

[Scathe]

I suggest getting all ranged attackers to 15-20 melee defense and 60-65 melee attack, maybe its a leftover feeling from my lone wolf campaign where I beat the black monolith with 3 ranged brothers, 1 a hybrid moreso than the other two, but you need to protect your back line and they need to protect themselves. against goblins and nomads, your ranged should be winning the ranged fight from behind a shieldwall, no overloading ranged defense there. tho ranged may still get 10-15rdef

[gvandinteren]

If you need to pump melee attack and defense of a ranged unit, you play (too many) ranged units when you shouldn't or suck at keeping them out of range of enemy melee units.

You need to pump HP, so they can deal with stuff like desert stalker headshots, pump ranged defense, so you can hit them before they hit you and fatigue, so you never have to recover and pump initiative, so you can attack before they do.

Melee attack and defense are luxuries and make your bro less effective at the things that actually matter

[goobie snoobert]

please stop giving terrible advice. it's actively harmful compared to just saying nothing. there's a non zero chance a new player might comb through this thread and think that pumping ranged defense and fatigue on ranged units is unironically a good idea (granted, ranged defense at least makes sense on paper, but it couldn't be further from the truth due to how enemy targeting works)

[Scathe]

Originally posted by gvandinteren:

If you need to pump melee attack and defense of a ranged unit, you play (too many) ranged units when you shouldn't or suck at keeping them out of range of enemy melee units.

You need to pump HP, so they can deal with stuff like desert stalker headshots, pump ranged defense, so you can hit them before they hit you and fatigue, so you never have to recover and pump initiative, so you can attack before they do.

Melee attack and defense are luxuries and make your bro less effective at the things that actually matter

initiative and ranged defense are luxuries that make your bro less effective at things that actually matter.

Originally posted by goobie snoobert:

please stop giving terrible advice. it's actively harmful compared to just saying nothing. there's a non zero chance a new player might comb through this thread and think that pumping ranged defense and fatigue on ranged units is unironically a good idea (granted, ranged defense at least makes sense on paper, but it couldn't be further from the truth due to how enemy targeting works)

noones giving terrible advice in this thread, if you learn to use archers from unluckynoob you will want to pump ranged defense, there are plenty of different ways to play... me my ranged attackers will always be behind a kiteshield wall, no need for ranged defense. thing is on a lone wolf campaign you want ranged and want versatile ranged. both sides of this argument have good points. if a newbie comes away from this thread pumping ranged attack and ranged defense and fatigue, they will not be badly mislead, but they will have to bench their ranged in more fights. this is why you have 8 reserves.

[gvandinteren]

We all play the game in different ways and since I know how many ranged units to being to a fight and how to properly position them, they don't ever need to revert to melee combat and hence don't need melee skill or defense.

That's like teaching Max Verstappen to run fast so he can win races even when his car breaks down